What would you do with this water report?

[zippyclown]

Hi All...

Looking for a simple response based on my love of brewing all grain IPAs vs. my water report. I have a salt based water softener in my house.

If I bypass the water softener, which I understand is detremental, here's what my brewing water would look like.

I could use the guidance... I've read a lot online but don't want to overthink it.

Calcium: 22.2 mg/l
Iron: 1.29 mg/l (above acceptable range)
Magnesium: 4.6 mg/l
Manganese: 0.126 mg/l (above acceptable range)
Sodium: 14.6 mg/l
Alkalinity: 83 mg/l
Chloride: 5.3 mg/l
Chlorine: 0
Hardness, Total: 74 mg/l
PH at 25C: 6.9
Sulfate: 12 mg/l

Thanks!

zc

 

[Worticia]

I plugged your numbers into Palmer's Mash RA Spreadsheet and here's what I found:
- With no adjustments, your water is appropriate for SRM 10 - 15.
- The Sulfate to chloride ratio is 2.3 which will make your beer "More Bitter".

If you plan a lighter colored beer, in the range of SRM 6 - 11, you should add 2 grams each of Gypsom and Calcium Chloride for "Balanced" bitterness, and slightly more gypsom (like 2.5 grams) to change the ratio toward "Little Bitter".

You should download Palmer's Mash RA Spreadsheet and play around with it to come up with your preferred adjustments.

I'm not an IPA fan, so there are probably others out there who are more qualified to give you advice than I am. I like emphasizing malt, yet I always go for the "Balanced" sulfate to chloride ratio. Some people like to put in lots of gypsom to go really bitter.

 

[ajdelange]

Evidently your water softener is there to take care of the iron as the hardness level isn't sufficient to justify a softener. The softener is probably increasing your sodium to about 45 mg/L which, while it isn't intolerable is reasonably high. The question is as to whether the softener alone gets the iron and manganese down to tolerable levels. If it does you could brew with this water with calcium supplementation. If it doesn't or if you want lower sodium the low $ path is probably purchase of an RO unit. This will also knock out the alkalinity so you don't have to worry about that.

The other possibility would be to remove the softener and install an iron/manganese (e.g. greensand) reduction filter. This would leave the hardness and alkalinity (which you'd have to deal with in some beers) but get rid of the iron and manganese. I'm guessing that the RO unit would be cheaper than an iron reduction unit and that's the approach I would favor as there are other advantages to RO water in brewing.

 

[ajdelange]

You should download Palmer's Mash RA Spreadsheet and play around with it to come up with your preferred adjustments.

No,no. Don't do that. It would lead you to erroneous conclusions like

- With no adjustments, your water is appropriate for SRM 10 - 15.
- The Sulfate to chloride ratio is 2.3 which will make your beer "More Bitter".

If you plan a lighter colored beer, in the range of SRM 6 - 11, you should add 2 grams each of Gypsom and Calcium Chloride for "Balanced" bitterness, and slightly more gypsom (like 2.5 grams) to change the ratio toward "Little Bitter".

Some of us have worked long and hard to get people to forget about relationships between beer color and water chemistry and sulfate/chloride ratios. Whenever I think we have achieved the goal a post or two like this one pops up.

 

[zippyclown]

The question is as to whether the softener alone gets the iron and manganese down to tolerable levels. If it does you could brew with this water with calcium supplementation.

So yes, the softener is there to get rid of the high iron and manganese. Are you saying that I'm good to brew with this water and a calcium supplement, and that's it? Nothing else sticks out to you as an issue if I'm looking to brew various styles of beer (IPAs most often).

 

[ajdelange]

So yes, the softener is there to get rid of the high iron and manganese. Are you saying that I'm good to brew with this water and a calcium supplement, and that's it?

That's pretty much it.

Nothing else sticks out to you as an issue if I'm looking to brew various styles of beer (IPAs most often).

Just the sodium level which, as I noted earlier might not be a problem. If it is you could always knock it down by dilution with some RO. A 1:1 dilution would cut it in half (down to a bit over 20 mg/L).

 

[zippyclown]

That's pretty much it.

Thanks for the reply and appreciate you keeping it simple.

 

[Worticia]

No,no. Don't do that. It would lead you to erroneous conclusions like



Some of us have worked long and hard to get people to forget about relationships between beer color and water chemistry and sulfate/chloride ratios. Whenever I think we have achieved the goal a post or two like this one pops up.

My bad! Thanks Adjelange for your helpful criticism. I considered not responding to the OP, but, wanted to help in case noone else did (my motherly instinct). Next time, I will note details in the original post which should have caught my attention!!! (Iron and Manganese resulting in the need a water softener)!

I brew with non-chlorinated, untreated well water and have a fair idea of the makeup up my water: I lack experience with water challenges. Maybe my viewpoints will help someone; there are infinite situations; you are the expert at your spiggot, and I am the expert at mine.

In defense of Palmer's spreadsheet, it works very well for me. I brew low SRM and low bitterness with hard water which makes defects more apparent. My HWMO is my worst critic and loves my brews. All of my children are adorable

 

[mabrungard]

Yes, the un-softened water is not suited to brewing. With the low calcium and magnesium levels, the softener is not going to overload the treated water with too much sodium. I would repeat the water testing with the softened water and assess where that leaves you. Ion-exchange is typically very good at removing all divalent cations including iron and manganese (Ca and Mg too!). So I expect that this water would be acceptable for brewing.

The alkalinity level will remain too high for pale beer brewing and some form of acidification will be needed.

Boy! That POC RA-based spreadsheet just won't die. I recall Gordon Strong telling me about all the crappy alka-seltzer beers he's judged over the years that the brewers told him were brewed based on that sheet. I guess we haven't had much opportunity to point out it's deficiencies lately. But hopefully the message will become ingrained.