Saison recipe feedback.

[spgreene]

First time designing my own recipe, what are your thoughts?

3lbs Pilsen DME
3.15lbs Munich LME
2 Lbs Caramunich Malt (steeped)

1 oz Hallertua 60
1 oz Warrior 5
1 oz Hallertau (dry hop after two weeks)

WhiteLabs WLP568

Thanks for your feedback!

 

[Quaker]

Way too much caramunich in my opinion. Saisons should finish out dry and crystal malts will inhibit that to an extent. They definitely give a perception of sweetness as well. The Munich malt will also add to the malt backbone even though it's probably 50/50 pale and munich based. I always use some simple sugar in my saison to help dry them out, about 10% of my grain bill. I use honey, because I'm a beekeeper and have plenty on hand, but just plain table sugar will work. I think this is especially important in an extract batch where you cannot adjust the wort fermentability through mash control. So I would personally drop the caramunich completely and replace with a 8-12 ounces of sugar and enough pilsner DME to get to your target OG. If you wanted an amber color, then just steep about 4 ounces, and still add sugar and pilsner DME to hit your target OG.

Warrior seems an odd choice for a flavor/aroma addition. I've always considered it a bittering hop, but honestly I've never used it. I'd say swap the 5 min Warrior and 60 min Hallertau (check your IBUs with some software, because I'm guessing you'll want to cut the Warrior quantity way back.) That should provide a more traditional Saison flavor.

Then again, considering this is all extract based. You could shorten things to a 15 minute boil, Warrior at 15, Hallertau at 5 and dryhop. In that case the full ounce of warrior is probably about right.

 

[beergolf]

Quaker pretty much said everything I was going to recommend.

Definitely drop the Caramunich. Adding sugar because it is an extract batch should help dry it out. The magnum should be moved to bittering and the Hallertau for flavor.

Enjoy.

 

[Calder]

Drop the Caramunich. Keep the Munich if you really want to, but I'd drop that too. Add some plain table sugar. With an extract batch, I'd suggest more than others, and go 20%.

Ferment warm.

You probably only need a bittering charge of hops. Drop the Warrior, and keep the others.

The yeast will provide the flavors and complexity.

 

[spgreene]

Ok, so what I've learned so far is that I should put in some more time reading other recipes and learn more about the grains before picking them.

Maybe I'll read the recipes from some kits. Thanks for keeping me from traversing a terrible path.

 

[DoWBrewer]

I converted my all-grain recipe. I hope this helps...

Amt Name Type # %/IBU

6.00 gal Water 1
-

0.81 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] - First Wort 90.0 min Hop 4 25.3 IBUs

8 lbs 15 oz Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract 5 85.4 %

11oz Wheat Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract 6 6.4 %

2.0 oz Caramunich (steeping)

0.50 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins) Fining 7

0.80 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 8 7.9 IBUs

7 oz Sugar, Table (Sucrose) [Boil for 10 min] 9 4.3 %

0.50 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Primary 3.0 days)

WLP Saison III OR Belle Saison

 

[spgreene]

I went back to the drawing board. Let's see what you all think of this? I'm mostly curious if it'll be drinkable and recognizable as a saison.

5 gallon batch.

3# Pilsen DME
3.15# Pale LME
1# table sugar

1oz Hallertau 60
1oz Citra. 10
1oz Hallertau. Dry hop

WLP566

 

[hopbrad]

Ya that should be good, can even up the table sugar to 1.5 lbs.
citra is fine but you could go another noble hop if you want to be more traditional. Like Saaz or stick with all hallertau. Ferment as warm as u can

 

[DoWBrewer]

I think that is a good recipe. I am known in my homebrew club for my saisons. Having said that, there are many ways to do things. I start fermentation out at around 65. I leave it there for two days. On the third day, I boil the sugar for 10-mins and it to the fermenter. From there I let it free rise up into the 70s and then hold it there with a temp controller for two weeks.

Adding the sugar later should help you get a drier saison. With all-grain you would mash at a low temp to make a highly fermentable wort. You don't have that control with extract. The reason you add sugar later is that the yeast produce additional enzymes to consume maltose (malt sugar) during their growth phase. They will produce more of it (in theory) because that is most of the sugar available. By the time you add table sugar, they will have already done the work to create the enzymes. Also, add pure O2 if you can. That will make for healthy aggressive yeast.

If all of that seems like too much work, you can still do things the regular way (adding the sugar during the boil) and it will still turn out fine.

Good luck!

 

[Chadwick]

Saison is an acquired taste. It's different. I've found that friends of mine that enjoy my home brewing often need a little lesson of preparation before they tastes my saisons. An ounce of preparation gives you miles in appreciation. My friends are not keen on beer styles. They are learning. I'm not sure how to introduce them to the hard-core Belgium styles. I might never achieve that.

 

[homebrewdr]

Saisons are probably my favorite style, along with IPAs. Then again, whatever style I'm currently drinking is usually my favorite style.

My favorite saison so far was simply #15 2-Row and #1 biscuit, fermented with Wyeast 3711, Bittered to 25 IBU with nugget and flavor hopped with Polish Lubliner (which are apparently just like Saaz).

No temp control. Fermented wrapped in blankets.

It came out tasting like cotton candy, bubblegum, lemongrass, and candy. Was like a saison with Belgian Triple characteristics (probably due to the ABV).

As long as youre not letting other flavors conflict too much with the yeast, you'll make a killer saison.

 

[Reggie22]

Saisons are probably my favorite style, along with IPAs. Then again, whatever style I'm currently drinking is usually my favorite style.



My favorite saison so far was simply #15 2-Row and #1 biscuit, fermented with Wyeast 3711, Bittered to 25 IBU with nugget and flavor hopped with Polish Lubliner (which are apparently just like Saaz).



No temp control. Fermented wrapped in blankets.



It came out tasting like cotton candy, bubblegum, lemongrass, and candy. Was like a saison with Belgian Triple characteristics (probably due to the ABV).



As long as youre not letting other flavors conflict too much with the yeast, you'll make a killer saison.

Was this for a 5 gallon batch? Was thinking about a saison for one of my next brews. Your description sounds tasty.

 

[homebrewdr]

Was this for a 5 gallon batch? Was thinking about a saison for one of my next brews. Your description sounds tasty.

Yeah its a 5 gallon batch. I currently only get about 70% efficiency so I think it settled out around 8-8.5% ABV

Frankly I went with 2 row instead of pilsner simply cause it was way cheaper at the time. Also I like to constantly try new things even if others suggest against it. The biscuit was to add a little bread, color, and kind of compensate for what is lost when using 2 row instead of pilsner. The hops were simply what I had on hand. Let the yeast shine. Warm it up a little if possible.

It is my favorite out of the 4-5 saisons I've brewed and also the cheapest.

 

[Reggie22]

Warm it up a little if possible.

This. The last one I did I used a heating pad with the fermentation bucket in a box to get the temp up. Created a lot of character with the belle saison yeast. Also dried it out too ~1.004

 

[hopbrad]

Belle saison yeast or 3711 is a good idea with extract, they seem to eat everything

 

[DoWBrewer]

Belle saison yeast or 3711 is a good idea with extract, they seem to eat everything

I can confirm that the Belle Saison is a beast. The last time I used it fermented a beer from 1.053 to 1.002. The Belle has some weird almost green apple flavors that go away after you carbonate.

 

[spgreene]

So, brewed this a couple of weeks ago. Went to the lhbs and ended up with Wy3724 yeast instead. It's what they had readily available.

The first two day of fermentation were extremely active at around 70-75 degrees. It then seemed to stop so I ramped up the temp to around 90 and it's been bubbling the airlock every 15-20 seconds since.

I've never done a saison before but this yeast is apparently a beast. Two solid weeks of fermentation is nuts!

 

[homebrewdr]

So, brewed this a couple of weeks ago. Went to the lhbs and ended up with Wy3724 yeast instead. It's what they had readily available.

The first two day of fermentation were extremely active at around 70-75 degrees. It then seemed to stop so I ramped up the temp to around 90 and it's been bubbling the airlock every 15-20 seconds since.

I've never done a saison before but this yeast is apparently a beast. Two solid weeks of fermentation is nuts!

My first saison was with 3724. Although bubbling a lot for an entire week, at 2 weeks it was only at 1.030. Wrapped in a heated blanket, it dropped to below 1.010, but took 6 weeks. It may have dropped further, but at 1.010 I kegged it. If you look into this strand, its pretty typical to be a bit finicky. Just keep letting it heat and be patient if you run into this problem