Problem. everything turns sour\vinegar

CornyKegs 728
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Starting Brix/S.G. and pH? Not even those numbers? They can also be a good indicator of why you're having this problem. Short of having a microscope and plates in order to actually count gram-positive bacteria, you don't know if it's infected or not, and your intuition won't account for much. I also suggest using a different yeast like K1V-1116, it's the least fussy yeast I know of, has little to no SO2 problems, and will ferment to dryness.
 
Verratti said:
and why's that ? of corse some suggestions I've tried already. I've been struggling with this for a year now and tried a lot of things. But I have a pad where I write the ideas that I could try. If your one of which thinks it isn't ruined and only needs time, then yes its fulie. I've tried that and it doesn't work. It stays and gets a little worst before it becomes unbreathable forever. Its a total lost.
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RachmaelBenApplebaum's advice about "forget about it for a month" is good. Every message in this threads sounds like you've dumped each batch after a few days.

If I cared any more, I would prepare a batch, and not even concern myself with sanitation. Split it into two vessels. Pitch yeast into ONE of them. Give it a few days. I bet the one with yeast you'll think is infected because it will produce those smells.

Best of luck to you.
 
A) ditch the primary.
B) stop using bleach. Use oxyclean (scent free) before using bleach.
C) get and use some nutrient and energizer.
D) stop boiling your must.
E) try brewing at another location, ie parents house, SO's place, a friend's house, etc. You may have a high mold spore count in your home.

If these and others suggestions don't work, I'm sorry: apparently Dionysus has decided you shouldn't make wine :p but seriously, good luck!!
 
EJay said:
RachmaelBenApplebaum's advice about "forget about it for a month" is good. Every message in this threads sounds like you've dumped each batch after a few days.

If I cared any more, I would prepare a batch, and not even concern myself with sanitation. Split it into two vessels. Pitch yeast into ONE of them. Give it a few days. I bet the one with yeast you'll think is infected because it will produce those smells.

Best of luck to you.
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already answered you post #39
 
RachmaelBenApplebaum said:
Starting Brix/S.G. and pH? Not even those numbers? They can also be a good indicator of why you're having this problem. Short of having a microscope and plates in order to actually count gram-positive bacteria, you don't know if it's infected or not, and your intuition won't account for much. I also suggest using a different yeast like K1V-1116, it's the least fussy yeast I know of, has little to no SO2 problems, and will ferment to dryness.
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S.G 1.095. thats pretty much always what I aim for. I don't take pH cause I don't feel the need to. and ironically I do have a microscope (16x100) so I get at 1600 which lets me see very well the bacterias running around. I did the test the primary today but I dunno what the yeast is supposed to look like in comparison. I'll have to try this before adding yeast next time lol.
 
RegarRenill said:
A) ditch the primary.
B) stop using bleach. Use oxyclean (scent free) before using bleach.
C) get and use some nutrient and energizer.
D) stop boiling your must.
E) try brewing at another location, ie parents house, SO's place, a friend's house, etc. You may have a high mold spore count in your home.

If these and others suggestions don't work, I'm sorry: apparently Dionysus has decided you shouldn't make wine :p but seriously, good luck!!
Click to expand...

A) yes
B) yeah I did that for my secondary. I won't use bleach anymore I swear :)
C) I use that almost all the time. but this last to batch I don't use in case the nutrients were contaminated.
D) yep stopped that after yooper told me ( see people I listen :p)
E) Thats an idea. Id be surprised though since It's very solid and clean here. But hey so much things we don't see.

Dionysus probably hates me like crazy lol he sure doesn't hide it very well. Maybe I should pray and ask for good harvest :cool:
 
Verratti said:
A) yes
B) yeah I did that for my secondary. I won't use bleach anymore I swear :)
C) I use that almost all the time. but this last to batch I don't use in case the nutrients were contaminated.
D) yep stopped that after yooper told me ( see people I listen :p)
E) Thats an idea. Id be surprised though since It's very solid and clean here. But hey so much things we don't see.

Dionysus probably hates me like crazy lol he sure doesn't hide it very well. Maybe I should pray and ask for good harvest :cool:
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All good suggestions! brix is solid so nothing wrong there, the only reason I would suggest pH is that a really low pH could be causing yeast stress. Glad you have a microscope! yeast just look like little balls, I forget what kind of stain to use that the yeast metabolize so you can see it more clearly, but it wouldn't be a horrible idea. The only other thing I can think of is your water source, which can be a bad thing if there's too much chlorine etc.
 
yes the bacterias looked like little ball's. My must in the primary doesn't seem to be getting worst like the other ones. Maybe boiling everything then waiting 24 hrs to pitch was a bad idea. I'm not sure if I should toss the must from the primary or let it go all the way ?? Water source could be, but I tried buying some good water from the store and it didn't work out. My mango wine uses the same water and its smelling good. As for stain, I only have iodine and mercurochrome. Could always try them both.
 
Verratti said:
Maybe boiling everything then waiting 24 hrs to pitch was a bad idea.
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Yes, that would be a very bad idea. Just like you don't make dinner, and then let it sit at warm temperatures for a day before eating it, you don't want to do that with the must either.

Chill the must, or don't boil it at all (my preference), but either way 24 hours at warm temperatures without yeast added would favor the growth of microbes.
 
Yooper said:
Yes, that would be a very bad idea. Just like you don't make dinner, and then let it sit at warm temperatures for a day before eating it, you don't want to do that with the must either.

Chill the must, or don't boil it at all (my preference), but either way 24 hours at warm temperatures without yeast added would favor the growth of microbes.
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yeah I didn't boil it for the batch I started 4 days ago in my primary. Then I dunno if Im just paranoid, but I kinda thought I smelled the infection coming 2 days ago and decided to start a new batch in my glass carboy. Now after 4 days I realize I'm not sure it was infected in the primary since it doesn't seem to be getting bad. Smells bad but that normal in the first week of fermentation so Im like, do I keep and let it be, or do I dump it since it was in my maybe infected primary fermenter.
 
I'd suggest letting them both ride out for at least a month. Maybe the no boiling of the must and extended cooling is the major culprit, so no harm in letting the new batches play out.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
 
BrewinBromanite said:
I'd suggest letting them both ride out for at least a month. Maybe the no boiling of the must and extended cooling is the major culprit, so no harm in letting the new batches play out.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
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This time I had my must a little cool. Probably room temp. and didn't wait to pitch. It took a little time for the yeast to do its thing. I have it fermenting in a room at 64F. How long should it stay in the primary at that temp. with an S.G of 1,095 and EC-1118 yeast ?
 
Thought you said it was in a glass carboy.... I let a lot of it sit in a carboy 30 to 60 days. We actually consume ours instead of dumping it down the drain. You can do yours any old way you wish. You have got excellent advise from some very good wine makers and can use it or not.
 
oh ok its because I have made some in a carboy, and some in a primary bucket. I was referring to the one in primary. Im not sure at 64f how long it should stay in primary.
 
If I make a wine with fresh fruit I use the bucket open topped and covered with a towel. I stir it two or three times a day to punch down the fruit. This is a sign of active fermenting. I usually let it go 5 to 7 days or until gravity is 1020 or so then rack to a carboy and airlock it.

If I use straight juice I skip the bucket and use the carboy. I airlock right from the get go and leave a little extra head space for the active ferment period of 2 to 7 days give or take. Then top up put it a closet and forget it for 30 to 60 days. Then rack it to clean carboy and let clear. Add c tabs every other rack till no lees fall for at least 60 days. Then you can bottle or back sweeten.

Is the wine you have going right now with the 1118 a juice wine or are you using fruit?
 
Is the wine you have going right now with the 1118 a juice wine or are you using fruit?[/QUOTE]


When I use concentrate, I always add some fruits. Say I do grape concentrate, well I add a few pounds of store bought grapes. But the last batch I did, I used the secondary and only used juice.
 
Problem solved. Yooper your a hobby saviour. Boiling was the reason I was getting these infections and now I have 12 gallons going. I racked my batch that was in me primary today and it was nice. Smelled like juice with a little alcohol, but no sour vomit smells so I guess my primary is salvageable. Big thank you to Yooper I'm just so happy… oh and I had banana wine from your recipe going for a few months which I though was infected, sadly I noticed it was nice while I was poring it down the toilet. I juste never had added the raisins yet though so it smelled almost like vodka. I'll have to try this once more ;)
 

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