PicoBrew Zymatic

[jmark]

How were your temps or water? Anything changed on those fronts?

Temps looked fine according to the graphs... Water is RO with minerals added back in. I did add a mash-out to the Edinburgh yeast batch but just went back to the regular schedule (i.e. no messing around with the advanced editor) for the Cal Ale batch. I just added amylase to this batch too to see if that gets it moving again. More than a little frustrated... repeatability doesn't help much if fermentation consistently stops at 55% attenuation!

 

[sbartelski]

Has anyone had attenuation issues with their Z? Back to back batches now for me have stalled out at 1.024+... one with Cal Ale and one with Edinburgh Yeast... both had OG around 1.058 and mashed at 152... both recipes have been done on my regular 3 vessel system and got down to 1.014 and 1.012 respectively. For the Edinburgh batch, I added a half teaspoon of amylase and that got things moving again after being stalked at 1.024 for a week.

I wonder if I've got issues with the Z temp sensors and I'm mashing at higher temps?

Easy enough to find out. Buy yourself a digital thermometer with probe, many have one at the end of a wire. Hang the probe in the keg (just rest the keg-seal on top) and check that temperature. It should be close to what the Z is showing. You should probably dip the probe in Starsan first, but not critical since the boil is yet to come.

Stefan

 

[jmark]

Yeah, I'll give that a shot... I've got a bunch of probes hooked up in my fermentation chambers so I'll look at that. Thanks for the suggestion - I was thinking of rigging up something to the output of the Z, but I was over-complicating matters!

 

[Denny]

Has anyone had attenuation issues with their Z? Back to back batches now for me have stalled out at 1.024+... one with Cal Ale and one with Edinburgh Yeast... both had OG around 1.058 and mashed at 152... both recipes have been done on my regular 3 vessel system and got down to 1.014 and 1.012 respectively. For the Edinburgh batch, I added a half teaspoon of amylase and that got things moving again after being stalked at 1.024 for a week.

I wonder if I've got issues with the Z temp sensors and I'm mashing at higher temps?

FWIW, with today's highly modified malts mash temps don't make nearly as much difference as they used to.

 

[dude3516]

So the stars have aligned. I had to cancel my brew day for the 3rd time in a row due to work escalations, and at that moment a member of the local homebrew club decided to sell his Zymatic. He had just had it replaced from his kickstarter model, so the thing has only had 2 batches through it so far.

Time to get back to brewing.

 

[jrcrilly]

So if I have 8.5lbs of grain and 4.5 gals of water, I should be okay? It won't overflow? Does it take into account your ingredients and measure how much liquid is being sent to the step filter as to not have it overflow?

Over flow is not an issue if everything is working properly; it is designed to overflow and should do so on every brew
.
The overflow is diverted back into the keg. Since the keg is the source of the water, it should always be able to handle the volume.

 

[jrcrilly]

So the stars have aligned. I had to cancel my brew day for the 3rd time in a row due to work escalations, and at that moment a member of the local homebrew club decided to sell his Zymatic. He had just had it replaced from his kickstarter model, so the thing has only had 2 batches through it so far.

Time to get back to brewing.

The Z is a great tool for squeezing brew sessions into a busy schedule. I keep mine in the office and let it perk away while I work. I believe that you will enjoy it.

 

[dude3516]

The Z is a great tool for squeezing brew sessions into a busy schedule. I keep mine in the office and let it perk away while I work. I believe that you will enjoy it.

Perfect, so maybe you can answer me this. How loud is the thing? Trying to decide if I can put it in my office and let it go while I'm on conference calls, or if I need to permanently install it in a side room or something.

 

[dbarbagelata]

Hello, how are you all adding adjuncts such as salt, sugar, cocoa powder, honey, syrups, coffee, etc. During the boil?

 

[DemonsRun]

Hello, how are you all adding adjuncts such as salt, sugar, cocoa powder, honey, syrups, coffee, etc. During the boil?

I add them directly to the Keg in the last 15-10 min. of the boil.
If it is a powder I sometimes mix with a bit of water then pour into the keg.


Personally I add whole coffee beans after fermentation while cold crashing.

 

[jrcrilly]

Perfect, so maybe you can answer me this. How loud is the thing? Trying to decide if I can put it in my office and let it go while I'm on conference calls, or if I need to permanently install it in a side room or something.

The pumps are audible but not intrusive. I can meet with clients or talk on the telephone. I do avoid using the speakerphone when a pump is running in case the sound is annoying at the other end.l

 

[Denny]

Perfect, so maybe you can answer me this. How loud is the thing? Trying to decide if I can put it in my office and let it go while I'm on conference calls, or if I need to permanently install it in a side room or something.

It's not real loud, but it's loud enough that I probably wouldn't use it during conference calls.

 

[QoB]

Most honest answer from the Picobrew crew that I've seen in a while came from Annie today in a thread calling them out on the internal forum (emphasis mine):



So since "soon" has never meant soon, I wouldn't count on this. Prove me wrong, Picobrew.

Remember, if you're on the fence about buying one, and this very real issue of lack of future software development is preventing you - let them know! FFS - they haven't even fixed the advanced recipe editor overwriting bug yet - since day 1, if you edit a recipe that had custom advance settings (even something as simple as changing the mash in/mash/mash out temps) - the custom settings are GONE. It may not sound like a big deal, but it is insanely frustrating.

I hate that bug more than anything! :-( Good things on the horizon.

 

[Thorrak]

I hate that bug more than anything! :-( Good things on the horizon.

I'll be honest - more than anything, I'd love to see the open source firmware that was promised in the Kickstarter -- or even an API that developers could tap into with the Zymatic.

I absolutely adore my Zymatic (mostly because of the support team - give them my thanks!) and would love to solve the few issues I have with it myself given the opportunity.

 

[ross_daly]

I'd love to see the open source firmware that was promised in the Kickstarte

I've emailed with the developers before. They said that they were still interested in releasing the code, but they couldn't do it yet because they didn't have the developer manpower to do it right.

To be clear, that's not open source (i.e. as sold.)

I eventually gave up on the idea of getting one. I do wonder if one could decompile the hex firmware files though.

 

[Thorrak]

I've emailed with the developers before. They said that they were still interested in releasing the code, but they couldn't do it yet because they didn't have the developer manpower to do it right.

To be clear, that's not open source (i.e. as sold.)

I eventually gave up on the idea of getting one. I do wonder if one could decompile the hex firmware files though.

Right - My point was that in the Kickstarter they claimed the firmware would be open source.

Given that I wasn't a Kickstarter backer I have no horse in this race, but as a developer I'd love to see the source released.

As I mentioned though, for me it's honestly less about the source, and more about having access to an API that doesn't require massive hacks. I'd love to try to extend the functionality of my Zymatic (or the recipe editor!) if given an avenue to do so.

 

[ross_daly]

Agreed - I think there is so much potential there.

I understand that none of these appliances are aimed at super techy people (the kind that would build it themselves), but I am surprised I havent seen any of the more curious owners take it apart and share photos. I'd love to see what is going on in there. It seems like the type of thing that could be controlled pretty easily by an arduino if one wanted to get their hands dirty and void the warranty.

on the same thought - have you seen this project? https://github.com/toddq/whatspicobrewing

 

[dbarbagelata]

Hello,

Are you all using the high efficiency mash program when brewing over .060 OG beers? How do you adjust body when using this program since you can't adjust temp? This seems like a major drawback. Would it be better to use single infusion and just increase the mash time? Any thoughts would be most appreciated.

 

[DoubleEh]

The keg that came with my Zymatic arrived with some damage and PicoBrew's support was absolutely top notch in getting the issue resolved quickly. I know it's been said on here many times, but I didn't want this to go unrecognized.

 

[DemonsRun]

Hello,

Are you all using the high efficiency mash program when brewing over .060 OG beers? How do you adjust body when using this program since you can't adjust temp? This seems like a major drawback. Would it be better to use single infusion and just increase the mash time? Any thoughts would be most appreciated.

I Only use the High Efficiency Mash, and it's easy to change the Temp.
Just go into the Advanced editor and pick the temp and time you want.

Just make sure to edit in the advanced editor after you are done editing the recipe, the settings will be lost if you go back and edit the recipe.

 

[Denny]

I Only use the High Efficiency Mash, and it's easy to change the Temp.
Just go into the Advanced editor and pick the temp and time you want.

Just make sure to edit in the advanced editor after you are done editing the recipe, the settings will be lost if you go back and edit the recipe.

I use only the high efficiency also.

Also, malt these days has so much diastatic power that mash temp makes a lot less difference than it used to. I've mashed the same recipe at 153 and 165 with identical results. The best way to control body is with the recipe.

 

[dbarbagelata]

Thanks! Good to know you can change the temp. The manual says that you cannot. I understand about altering the recipe regarding body, but whether you want your beer more dry or sweet is certainly affected by mash temp.

I have not purchased one yet, just trying to get all questions answered before pulling the trigger.

 

[Denny]

Thanks! Good to know you can change the temp. The manual says that you cannot. I understand about altering the recipe regarding body, but whether you want your beer more dry or sweet is certainly affected by mash temp.

I have not purchased one yet, just trying to get all questions answered before pulling the trigger.

No, actually it's not....at least it's so minimal that you can pretty much disregard it.

 

[dbarbagelata]

No, actually it's not....at least it's so minimal that you can pretty

You don't think final gravity has anything to do with sweetness? Why do so many breweries talk about whether or not an IPA should be dry or sweet and that Mash temperature affects it?

 

[pagrider]

Simply not true having experimented with different mash temperatures on oatmeal stouts. There is a big difference

 

[Denny]

Simply not true having experimented with different mash temperatures on oatmeal stouts. There is a big difference

Hey, it simply is true according to my testing! It will depend on the malt you use to a greater or lesser extent.

I don't mean to discount your results, but I have my own results, too. I was surprised to find it, but I've duplicated it several times.

 

[Denny]

No, actually it's not....at least it's so minimal that you can pretty

You don't think final gravity has anything to do with sweetness? Why do so many breweries talk about whether or not an IPA should be dry or sweet and that Mash temperature affects it?

Maybe because they haven't tested it? Maybe because of the malts they use?

 

[dbarbagelata]

Maybe because they haven't tested it? Maybe because of the malts they use?

Interesting.

 

[dude3516]

Had a question about the advanced editor that was not forthcoming on the Picobrew site. When setting up the mash and pass thru I pick up that I need to drain from the current schedule, so that the pico can pick up some wort for passthru to heat. Do I always need a passthru to heat, or is it simply faster with the passthru?

 

[BurntOrngeLonghorn84]

Do I always need a passthru to heat, or is it simply faster with the passthru?

You always need to pass through. It heats using a glycol heat exchanger so if wort isn't passing through it will only heat what is in the exchanger. You definitely don't want that.

 

[BurntOrngeLonghorn84]

Dup post

 

[Anyhowe]

#mashtemp. Go here. http://brulosophy.com/2016/08/22/th...eme-temperature-variance-exbeeriment-results/

 

[Denny]

Had a question about the advanced editor that was not forthcoming on the Picobrew site. When setting up the mash and pass thru I pick up that I need to drain from the current schedule, so that the pico can pick up some wort for passthru to heat. Do I always need a passthru to heat, or is it simply faster with the passthru?

You can heat anywhere it suits you. For instance, for FWH you heat to boil through adjunct 1.

 

[Denny]

#mashtemp. Go here. http://brulosophy.com/2016/08/22/th...eme-temperature-variance-exbeeriment-results/

That's such a small temp difference I wouldn't expect it to matter much. And keep in mind that's a single trial. The key to science is repeatability.

 

[dude3516]

So my google-fu must be weakening as I grow older, but how long are the dip tubes on the zymatic kegs? I got mine used without the keg and need to mod some ball locks with full length dip tubes, and cannot find how much to remove.

 

[jmark]

I had to do the same thing... had curved dip tubes on my kegs and tried to use a tube cutter to cut off about an inch (about half an inch vertical) and ended up crushing the tube and ruining it. Bought a straight dip tube from Adventures in Homebrewing and have not had any issues... so if yours is straight you may well be okay... if it's not try either of my routes and hope you're better at using a tube cutter!

 

[Thorrak]

I had to do the same thing... had curved dip tubes on my kegs and tried to use a tube cutter to cut off about an inch (about half an inch vertical) and ended up crushing the tube and ruining it. Bought a straight dip tube from Adventures in Homebrewing and have not had any issues... so if yours is straight you may well be okay... if it's not try either of my routes and hope you're better at using a tube cutter!

I tried a tube cutter originally, but ended up giving up and going for a dremel. Pretty sure I still have metal shavings embedded in the wall of my living room, but hey - if that's the price of good beer, I'll take it.

 

[sbartelski]

So my google-fu must be weakening as I grow older, but how long are the dip tubes on the zymatic kegs? I got mine used without the keg and need to mod some ball locks with full length dip tubes, and cannot find how much to remove.

Remove 1/2 inch from a standard dip tube. But be careful, don't collapse it.

 

[pagrider]

use a dremel with a cut off wheel

 

[QoB]

You always need to pass through. It heats using a glycol heat exchanger so if wort isn't passing through it will only heat what is in the exchanger. You definitely don't want that.

You should use the bypass if going more than 7 degrees F. Anything under is finevto heat through the mash.