List of PJ Electrical Diagrams

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kal said:
For a single SSR, yes. I would still recommend putting the heat sink outside and using a heat sink meant for a larger SSR than you need. There are no "rules" as to heat sink size so many of the bargain sellers are supplying undersized heat sinks with their SSRs and expecting you to use a fan.

Kal
Click to expand...

I have an old computer cpu, think 4", fan that I might hook up as well since it just collects dust. Would I need a 220 to 12v transformer to hook that up? Figured I'd throw that in there if I ever needed to upgrade.
 
theck said:
I have an old computer cpu, think 4", fan that I might hook up as well since it just collects dust. Would I need a 220 to 12v transformer to hook that up?
Click to expand...
Depends on what the fan requires. Check the fan.

I'm not a fan of fans (pardon the pun). I prefer convection cooling. Fans can fail and are not weather/waterproof.

Kal
 
Ah maybe I won't bother then... one last question, for now :). I am checking out some builds and I see terminal bus strips, I think? I'd need 4 of those at the start of the wiring; GND, Neutral, Line 1 and Line 2, correct? I'm confused though on this:
IMG_1404.jpg


and why the wires are looped... is that done to allow more than 2 connections?
 
Whew. Just got done reading all 57 pages of this thread. A very good read indeed!

One question that remained after reading all of this is what is the purpose of the contactors after the SSR, but before the heating elements? Are these strictly necessary or just recommended? If so, why? The SSR manufacturers don't have these in their recommended schematics.

Thanks!
 
They are a safety feature. The contactors are actuated by switches on the control panel, not the ssr. No matter what the ssr wants to do it can only do what you say it can do. It forces you to stop and think 'okay, are we ready to go? is the pump primed? is the element submerged?' etc. Also, if you need to you can go the control panel and physically interrupt the current to the elements.

You could build your control panel without them but it doesn't seem like a good idea to me, wouldn't be much of a 'control' panel.
 
theck said:
Ah maybe I won't bother then... one last question, for now :). I am checking out some builds and I see terminal bus strips, I think? I'd need 4 of those at the start of the wiring; GND, Neutral, Line 1 and Line 2, correct? ...(picture deleted)..

and why the wires are looped... is that done to allow more than 2 connections?
Click to expand...

That is a barrier terminal strip. Each strip is isolated from the next. The jumpers are used to provide a conductive path to the next strip. Typical ratings are 15amp, with 20amp and 30amp being available as well. There are other ways to do the same thing, depending on how many branch feeds are needed and wire gauge.
 
Fatman_Brew said:
That is a barrier terminal strip. Each strip is isolated from the next. The jumpers are used to provide a conductive path to the next strip. Typical ratings are 15amp, with 20amp being available as well. There are other ways to do the same thing, depending on how many branch feeds are needed and wire gauge.
Click to expand...

I think he was using 30a, that's what would be required correct? Thanks!
 
I wouldn't use a 15/20 amp terminal strip to feed a 30amp circuit when a simple wire nut or splice would work. Make sure of amp ratings for any connections.
 
thekraken said:
They are a safety feature. The contactors are actuated by switches on the control panel, not the ssr. No matter what the ssr wants to do it can only do what you say it can do. It forces you to stop and think 'okay, are we ready to go? is the pump primed? is the element submerged?' etc. Also, if you need to you can go the control panel and physically interrupt the current to the elements.

You could build your control panel without them but it doesn't seem like a good idea to me, wouldn't be much of a 'control' panel.
Click to expand...

I've seen a number of control panels for other heating applications in industry using SSRs to throttle power delivery and I never saw contactors used on the load side. They were always used to disconnect groups of heaters on the line side. For example, there'd be a branch circuit with a 100A OCPD, followed by a 100A contactor, then split into individual OCPD for each heater, and then finally to the SSRs. The heaters would connect directly to the SSR outputs. The contactor would typically be tied into the emergency stop circuit, sometimes with an additional permissive from the PLC.

I always liked it tied into the PLC because if any one zone exceeded a threshold, i'd shut off all heating. This prevented a runaway in the event that a temp probe was wired to the wrong zone, or a faulty temp probe in general, because otherwise the PID would keep the heater on (and at 100% since the integral would wind up).

There are lots of ways to skin this cat and if someone wants the additional level os safety I don't see that it hurts, I just wanted to make sure I wasn't overlooking a function of it beyond it being an additional permissive.
 
dtfleming said:
P-J,

Could I use this drawing, eliminating the timer and adding a second element, one for the BK and one for the HLT. I would like to use a three position switch to change power from HLT-OFF-BK. Would I be able to do this with one 120V 20A power source since only one element would be on at a time?

http://www.pjmuth.org/beerstuff/images/Auberin-wiring1-a4-2000w-BIAB-120V-D-4.jpg

Thanks
Click to expand...
Yes & it was also posted in thread: 110v-recirculating-ebiab-2-5-gallon-batches-in post #501
 
P-J said:
Ok. Here is a diagram that you can use.

As always click on the image to see and save a fullscale diagram for your build.



I hope this helps you.

P-J
Click to expand...

I'm looking at this for a simple rims controller. I have one PID, an SSR, a pump. I'd like a light to light up for main power, pump, and heater power. I also have two SPST switches (main power and pump, I'd imagine) and one DPST switch (for the interlock, as I don't want to the element to come on without the pump).

This diagram (correct me if i'm wrong) seems to fit all descriptions of this, except the lights, yes?

They're 120v pilot lamps, so I don't need to drop the voltage before throwing them in. I have some hobby electronics experience, but very little working with mains. But i'm looking at this right, I'd need to put in:

1. The main power light in line right after switch #3, before the amp.
2. The pump power light in line between switch #2 and the PID
3. The heater power light between switch #1 and the heating element plug

Yes?
 
FWIW Here is the plan I'm working on. Controlling one rims tube element at 120v and one pump. Indicator lights show when power is on, and when either of the pump or element receptacles are hot. My pid is not shown, just plug what ever you got into the ssr and your good to go. The ssr is a dual ssr, but can be subbed for 2 ssrs or just use one and wire the pump for manual control only.

http://i.imgur.com/3h9jN3X.png

(edit) In your case you wouldn't have electronic pump control so you could just ignore the wire coming out of the right side of the pump switch.
 
thekraken said:
FWIW Here is the plan I'm working on. Controlling one rims tube element at 120v and one pump. Indicator lights show when power is on, and when either of the pump or element receptacles are hot. My pid is not shown, just plug what ever you got into the ssr and your good to go. The ssr is a dual ssr, but can be subbed for 2 ssrs or just use one and wire the pump for manual control only.

http://i.imgur.com/3h9jN3X.png

(edit) In your case you wouldn't have electronic pump control so you could just ignore the wire coming out of the right side of the pump switch.
Click to expand...

Hmm. I think that makes sense. I think.

Maybe :)

If i never come back, it means I wired it wrong and zapped myself dead. Wish me luck!
 
Thank you to everyone for the contributions and especially to P-J for all of the diagrams. I've browsed the entire thread, posted my own, and cannot seem to get over my mental block of how to plan my system to get what I want, so, I thought this would be a good place to go.

I apologize in advance for the long winded post.

I want a 3-vessel, e-HERMS, with two pumps. One 5500watt element in HLT, one 5500watt element in the BK. I'd like one Auber PID to control the HLT and one Auber Boil Controller for the BK. I will have the option to use 40amp service that is currently unused in the breaker box or 50amp service after we change from an electric range to a gas range. I'd like an E-stop, a Keyed power on switch, toggle switches to give power to elements and pumps with indicator lights for elements and pumps. I've seen a number of schematics, compared them to each other and with Kal's site. I am still a bit lost.

Could I bring the service wires in to a NC E-stop, to the NO Key Power switch, to the distribution blocks, then to the contactors, parts, and lights? Or do I need a contactor before getting to the distribution blocks? Should I put the E-Stop before the distribution blocks? Should I put the Key switch before the distribution blocks? Other than that, I believe I would need 2 contactors and 2 SSRs and the various switches and lights. Is there anything else?
 
spartybrews said:
Thank you to everyone for the contributions and especially to P-J for all of the diagrams. I've browsed the entire thread, posted my own, and cannot seem to get over my mental block of how to plan my system to get what I want, so, I thought this would be a good place to go.

I apologize in advance for the long winded post.

I want a 3-vessel, e-HERMS, with two pumps. One 5500watt element in HLT, one 5500watt element in the BK. I'd like one Auber PID to control the HLT and one Auber Boil Controller for the BK. I will have the option to use 40amp service that is currently unused in the breaker box or 50amp service after we change from an electric range to a gas range. I'd like an E-stop, a Keyed power on switch, toggle switches to give power to elements and pumps with indicator lights for elements and pumps. I've seen a number of schematics, compared them to each other and with Kal's site. I am still a bit lost.

Could I bring the service wires in to a NC E-stop, to the NO Key Power switch, to the distribution blocks, then to the contactors, parts, and lights? Or do I need a contactor before getting to the distribution blocks? Should I put the E-Stop before the distribution blocks? Should I put the Key switch before the distribution blocks? Other than that, I believe I would need 2 contactors and 2 SSRs and the various switches and lights. Is there anything else?
Click to expand...

I suggest that you use the diagram below and modify it to suite your needs. You would need to install your keyed switch on the line from the 15A breaker. That line supplies the base power to the system. All of the switches in place on the diagram are illuminate switches so you are good to go as is.

I hope this helps you.

(An after thought: You can change out the BOIL PID to the Wort Boil Contol. It's an easy swap for you if that is what you want to do.)

P-J

Auberin-wiring1-a11a-RM-SYL-2352-5500w.jpg
 
I am going to add a 120V 20A HLT to my propane BK
I have no 240 right now
I am gathering a lot of info from this great post and others, before I get started I have a couple questions on a control panel.
The shut off valve seems to be wired to power and utility ground. When engaged does this throw the GFCI? Just how does it work?
Do I need a contactor coil for what reason? TO boost power to Heat Element? Can I just run a 25A SSR from PID to heating element?


I will post my drawing when completed but here is my plan.
GFCI protection before control Panel
On/Off power with indicator lamp for Control Panel
Emergency shut off button
Power switch for 1 PID to HLT
1 Alarm buzzer from PID
1 RTD temp probe
Switch and indicator lamp to 1 heating element for HLT 120v 2000W
2 Chugger pumps each with switch and indicator lamp
12v converter
Switch and indicator lamp to 12v recirc pump for even heating of HERM coil
12v cooling fan if needed
 
aboantopick said:
I am going to add a 120V 20A HLT to my propane BK
I have no 240 right now
I am gathering a lot of info from this great post and others, before I get started I have a couple questions on a control panel.
The shut off valve seems to be wired to power and utility ground. When engaged does this throw the GFCI? Just how does it work?
Do I need a contactor coil for what reason? TO boost power to Heat Element? Can I just run a 25A SSR from PID to heating element?
...
Click to expand...

"The Shut off valve" is an E-Stop that provides a small leakage current to ground. This causes the GFCI breaker to trip and powers the system off.

Hope this helps.
 
P-J said:
I suggest that you use the diagram below and modify it to suite your needs. You would need to install your keyed switch on the line from the 15A breaker. That line supplies the base power to the system. All of the switches in place on the diagram are illuminate switches so you are good to go as is.

I hope this helps you.

(An after thought: You can change out the BOIL PID to the Wort Boil Contol. It's an easy swap for you if that is what you want to do.)

P-J

Auberin-wiring1-a11a-RM-SYL-2352-5500w.jpg
Click to expand...

Thank you P-J. This should do the trick. Again, I appreciate your help!
 
I have 2 Honeywell S8610U3009 Intermittent Pilot controls, a asco 8210g2 gas valve, a Honeywell vr8300 valve and a Honeywell vr8200 valve. I have 2 love tss2-2100 controls and a Auber SYL-1512A control. Does it matter what kind of transformer I get? I planned on putting the loves on the HLT and MLT with the Honeywell valves and spark ignition. I'd like to use the auber for only a temp gauge either on the BK or at the exit of my chiller. I have no pilots yet but plan on ordering them soon. Would it be hard to use the asco valve on the BK and have it ignite by push button on the control panel? what other parts would this require and is there a diagram for this type setup? Thanks in advance for any replies!
 
Just making sure I've updated this properly.

Each light is a 120v pilot lamp. Green is power to the PID, Red is active heating element, and blue is active pump.

Otherwise, everything is as listed, I believe?

R6tHFG5.jpg
 
Is there a way to get the bare images of the components used to make these diagrams? I want to make my own diagram using P-J's as a base. Thanks!
 
Hi Ya'll
I am going to post this asking for help with the diagram this time. Electric Brewing Hardware has a drawing and kit close to my plan but they do not seem to follow PJ's plans which are easy to understand. I am going to add a 120V 20A HLT to my propane BK
I have no 240 right now so the BK will remain gas.

Here are my specs:
120v 20 amp circuit
(1) 2000W heating element
(2) Chugger pumps

GFCI protection before control Panel
On/Off power with indicator lamp for Control Panel
Emergency shut off button
Power switch for 1 PID to HLT
1 Alarm buzzer from PID
1 temp probe to HLT
Switch and indicator lamp to 1 heating element for HLT 120v 2000W
2 Chugger pumps each with switches and indicator lamps

12v converter
Switch and indicator lamp to 12v recirc pump for even heating of HERM coil ( I already have one of those little tan 12v pumps I am using now to pump hot water from my BK to my MT and Sparge Tank but it barly does the job so it is being replaced by a Chugger so now I plan on using the little pump to keep the water moving in my HLT)
12v cooling fan if needed
Thank You!
 
DRog00 said:
Is there a way to get the bare images of the components used to make these diagrams? I want to make my own diagram using P-J's as a base. Thanks!
Click to expand...
I use Microsoft Image Composer to make the diagrams. You can secure a free download of it on the internet. Hope this helps.

P-J
 
Having trouble wiring the DPST switch correctly. I have four screws on it, labeled 1-2-3-4. On the diagram on the back of the switch, it has them labeled as followed:

1 - White Supply (-)
2 - Load
3 - Load
4 - Black Supply (+)

Having trouble converting that to the symbols from PJs diagram... THoughts?
 
bfinleyui said:
Having trouble wiring the DPST switch correctly. I have four screws on it, labeled 1-2-3-4. On the diagram on the back of the switch, it has them labeled as followed:

1 - White Supply (-)
2 - Load
3 - Load
4 - Black Supply (+)

Having trouble converting that to the symbols from PJs diagram... THoughts?
Click to expand...
How about a link to the swtch so that we can see an image of it.
It seems that 1&2 are one set of the n/o contacts and 3&4 are the other set.

P-J
 
Fun **** isn't it. I started brewing a year ago and cant get enough if it. Current challenge is adding a HLT with a control panel to my brewery.
All you people on here are helpful and a blast! PJ's drawing were very helpful to me understanding what to do.
So here what I came up with, any feedback is great.

ELECT-CONTROL-PANEL.jpg
 
bfinleyui said:
Having trouble wiring the DPST switch correctly. I have four screws on it, labeled 1-2-3-4. On the diagram on the back of the switch, it has them labeled as followed:

1 - White Supply (-)
2 - Load
3 - Load
4 - Black Supply (+)

Having trouble converting that to the symbols from PJs diagram... THoughts?
Click to expand...

Assuming the screws numbered 1 and 2 are on the same side of the switch then 1-2 is a contact pair and 3-4 is a contact pair. This can easily be verified with an ohm meter or continuity checker.
 
Yeah... busted out the multimeter/continuity checker and figured out it was laid out just like you said.

Got everything assembled, and then realized I'd bought the relay version, not the ssr version. *headdesk*

Returning now for the proper one. But other than that, everything's going well! Thanks P-J!
 
I was in San Francisco dog sitting at my daughters and bored when I posted my hand drawing of mt control panel plan to this thread. Back home now where I have AutoCad so here is a clearer vision of my plan. Same plan, no changes, just using a 25 amp rated SSR instead of the 40A, I already have it.
Do you think this will fly?

View attachment CONTROL-PANEL-LAYOUT.pdf

CONTROL-PANEL-LAYOUT.jpg
 
aboantopick,
Your layout looks good with three comments from me. 1 - the LED you show for the element won't actually show you when the element is on as it's upstream of the SSR. It just shows you if the switch is on or off. Suggest putting it downstream of the SSR, so you know whether the SSR is actually allowing power through to the element (verification that the SSR is working / the PID is actually sending power).
2 - I've personally never seen the advantage to the switch for the PID. In what scenario would you want to have your PID off - it doesn't draw a whole ton of power, and with the element disconnect switch upstream, you can turn off the element that way, so you're basically disabling the PID with that. No harm in keeping it, but it seems like a redundant switch.
3 - there's no main power on / off, so I assume you either have a switched outlet, or plan to do the plug in / unplug method? Just a verification comment if you've already worked it out.
-Kevin
 
Sorry to derail any unanswered questions or discussion on the thread but I have a couple of questions related to PJ diagrams. Can someone explain the "line 1" and "line 2" portion of the diagrams? Does this indication, element 1 is on one line and element 2 is on the other line? Also, when setting up the DIN rails, if there are two lines, do I need two DIN rails to keep the separation? Thanks for tolerating novice questions.
 
L1 and L2 are the 2 halves of 220v - each of them carrying 110v individually with respect to Neutral

You do not need multiple din rails to handle this
 
aboantopick said:
I was in San Francisco dog sitting at my daughters and bored when I posted my hand drawing of mt control panel plan to this thread. Back home now where I have AutoCad so here is a clearer vision of my plan. Same plan, no changes, just using a 25 amp rated SSR instead of the 40A, I already have it.
Do you think this will fly?
Click to expand...

Find a 120V, 20 amp switch and use that to turn the power on and off. Get rid of the emergency off. That's my recommendation.
 

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