Super-simple Schwarzbier -- too simple?

[eulipion2]

I'm planning my second attempt at a schwarzbier. My first attempt resulted in an award-winning Czech Dark Lager, so I thought I'd simplify and try again. Here's the plan:

6 gallons, OG 1.049, FG 1.010, 28 IBU, 25 SRM

10 lb Weyermann Barke Vienna
12 oz Carafa III Special (dehusked)
.5 oz Magnum, 14.1% AA - 60 min
1 oz Hallertau Mittelfrueh (or maybe Hersbrucker), 4% AA - 10 min
2 packs Saflager W-34/70

Will this get me closer to the mark? Do I need to throw in some type of caramel or other character malt?

 

[Cavpilot2000]

That much Carafa will most likely result in waay too much roasted flavor. It'll taste like a porter. I'd drop it to about 4-6 oz.
Schwarzbiers shouldn't be heavily roasty.
BJCP guidelines say "hints of roast malt".

If you're worried about not enough color if you reduce the carafa, there is always Sinamar.

I'd throw in a little Caramalt, but nothing darker than CaraMunich II, just for some extra flavor depth. But, they should also be clean and not heavy or sweet, so keep it to half a pound or less (maybe 4-6 oz).

 

[BigEd]

I'm planning my second attempt at a schwarzbier. My first attempt resulted in an award-winning Czech Dark Lager, so I thought I'd simplify and try again. Here's the plan:

6 gallons, OG 1.049, FG 1.010, 28 IBU, 25 SRM

10 lb Weyermann Barke Vienna
12 oz Carafa III Special (dehusked)
.5 oz Magnum, 14.1% AA - 60 min
1 oz Hallertau Mittelfrueh (or maybe Hersbrucker), 4% AA - 10 min
2 packs Saflager W-34/70

Will this get me closer to the mark? Do I need to throw in some type of caramel or other character malt?

Too simple? No, simple is usually better. Agree with Cavpilot2000 on the Carafa malt. You want mostly color and little to no flavor from dark roast here. I would prefer Pilsner malt or at least a blend as the base. Vienna is going to make this beer lean towards a Dunkel rather than a Schwarzbier, not to say that's necessarily a bad thing. My other suggestion is to cut back on the late hops, both in quantity and time. Try a half ounce @ 20 minutes instead of a full ounce @ 10 minutes.

 

[Cavpilot2000]

Too simple? No, simple is usually better. Agree with Cavpilot2000 on the Carafa malt. You want mostly color and little to no flavor from dark roast here. I would prefer Pilsner malt or at least a blend as the base. Vienna is going to make this beer lean towards a Dunkel rather than a Schwarzbier, not to say that's necessarily a bad thing. My other suggestion is to cut back on the late hops, both in quantity and time. Try a half ounce @ 20 minutes instead of a full ounce @ 10 minutes.

Agree. I got so caught up on the Carafa that I failed to get back to the Vienna.
Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Vienna malt and it is probably my 2nd most used base malt next to Pilsner malt, but Pilsner is what you should use as your base malt. Vienna will give you a lot of breadiness that will be inappropriate for a Schwarzbier.

Now if you wanted to add a pound or two of Vienna, that might work, but like BigEd said: simpler is usually better, especially when making classic German styles - they are almost always pretty simple grain bills.

We homebrewers tend to think we need 3 base malts and 4 specialty malts in every beer, but the pros, especially in Germany, don't share that mindset.