Yeast Starter - Why so confusing?

[Augusto Sotero]

Hi guys,

As with any other home brewing subject, I always read everything that I can about the matter.
BYO magazine, AHA posts and forums, HBT forums, books and so on...

The thing is that I am going to do my first starter and I have never seen so much conflicting information about the subject. Could you guys clarify and tell your preferences about this, please?

Basically there are too methods:

1) Wait about 12-18h after inoculating yeast in the starter and pitch the whole thing in the beer while it is at high krausen.
- PROS: quicker method, yeast then to start earlier as it has been pitched at high krausen;
- CON: you have to pitch the starter beer which might not be tasting so good.

2) Decant the fermented wort. Here is where I need some help with the schedule and time.
Ferment starter for about 36 hours and then toss in the fridge overnight (about 12 hours). After that decant the fermented wort leaving a little bit behind so that you can give it a swirl with the yeast in the bottom. Leave it at room temperature and then pitch the yeast.

What do you guys think of this schedule above?

My other question is about nutrients. Some places say use nutrients and other don't bother.
It is the first pitch, there is a real need for nutrients? Can I skip those?

Thank you very much!

 

[BLL]

The yeast will ferment out your starter wort and settle to the bottom of the starter vessel. When you're ready to pitch decant most of the starter wort off the top of the settled yeast. Swirl and pitch.

There's no set schedule. If you want to decant starter wort then you just need to watch for your starter to finish fermenting.

Edit: If you have a selection of local breweries and one or more of them brews a beer with a yeast character similar to what you're going for, then I highly recommend just going to them with a clean jar and asking them for some yeast. They've got no reason to turn you down and that yeast will be healthier than anything that's been sitting in a refrigerated vial for weeks at a time.

 

[waldoar15]

I usually decant Lager starters because they're large. That's a lot of oxidized beer.

I've also pitched smaller ale starters at high krausen. The beer took off quickly.

 

[RM-MN]

You really do starters for 2 reasons. First is to prove that the yeast is viable so you don't end up pitching dead yeast and wondering why your beer doesn't ferment. These days that is a pretty rare event. The second is to multiply the yeast ahead of time so your lag time is reduced or to help your yeast handle a big beer. Properly aerated, your wort provides a very good environment for growing more yeast so your starter is mostly changing when the yeast propagate. If you have good sanitation, putting the yeast directly into the aerated wort will probably get you the same result.

 

[SpeedYellow]

I'd say you're mostly correct. Two comments: 1) it may take much longer than 12 hours for the yeast to flocculate . Some lager yeasts take 2 days. 2) your method #2 is mostly just for lagers, since they call for much bigger starters.

I brew about three-quarters lagers and used the decant method but gave it up because it's too much work and sometimes makes the yeast super slow to start up. I switched to the "vitality starter" method and find it works just as well. No, my yeast cell count doesn't match the recommendations, but there's very little lag time, the beer ferments in the same time, and tastes great. I know of no other way to judge this vitality starter method than that!

 

[pinchegil]

For starters I believe vitality is just as good as viability, while pitching rates are kinda important pitching smaller amounts of healthy active cells works just as good as pitching total cell count from a calculator. Here is a good articlehttp://brulosophy.com/2015/06/29/ye...le-cell-count-vs-vitality-exbeeriment-results this method allows you to have a starter that is half the usual size so you can feel ok about pitching the whole starter, no need to crash so the cells are active when you pitch. On really big beers, I make 2L of wort and save off 500ml. I create a starter that is about 3/4 of what I need a few days earlier, and cold crash. I pour off the liquid the night before and then use it to make a 500ml starter on brew day. Its a little more work but lag is a thing of the past.

 

[SpeedYellow]

^^ ha ha. So there's a 3rd method: 1) vitality, 2) decant, and 3) Both!

But seriously, pinchegil's method seems unbeatable. Just more work than I'm willing to do. If I ever have a 1L vitality starter create any issues, I'll switch to that.

 

[pinchegil]

^^ ha ha. So there's a 3rd method: 1) vitality, 2) decant, and 3) Both!

But seriously, pinchegil's method seems unbeatable. Just more work than I'm willing to do. If I ever have a 1L vitality starter create any issues, I'll switch to that.

I only do it for big beers, 1.09+

 

[kh54s10]

I make starters for any beer over 1.040 when using liquid yeast. 18-24 hours is plenty in most cases if using a stirplate. After that they have already reproduced and are now depleting energy in further fermenting the starter wort.

Or at some point I am going to try this:https://www.experimentalbrew.com/blogs/denny/old-dognew-tricks

If it is good enough for Denny it should do well by me.