Wyeast gluten content

[mrtree]

I recently questioned Wyeast about the gluten content of their yeast.
Here is the reply:


Michael,

Our packages contain at most about 120ppm gluten. This equates to about 0.82ppm in 5 gallons of beer if the beer was produced w/o any added gluten.

We are looking at the possibility for some GF products in the future.

I hope this helps. Please let me know if you have other questions.


Jess Caudill
Brewer/Microbiologist
Wyeast Laboratories, Inc.
P.O. Box 146
Odell, OR 97044 USA
Phone: 541-354-1335 Fax: 541-354-3449
[email protected]
www.wyeastlab.com


It was my understanding that Wyeast had a higher gluten number than White Labs however this email indicates differently.

Anyone have any insight on this?

 

[Walker]

I recently questioned Wyeast about the gluten content of their yeast.
Here is the reply:


Michael,

Our packages contain at most about 120ppm gluten. This equates to about 0.82ppm in 5 gallons of beer if the beer was produced w/o any added gluten.

We are looking at the possibility for some GF products in the future.

I hope this helps. Please let me know if you have other questions.


Jess Caudill
Brewer/Microbiologist
Wyeast Laboratories, Inc.
P.O. Box 146
Odell, OR 97044 USA
Phone: 541-354-1335 Fax: 541-354-3449
[email protected]
www.wyeastlab.com


It was my understanding that Wyeast had a higher gluten number than White Labs however this email indicates differently.

Anyone have any insight on this?

Which "package" was he talking about? The smaller "Propagator" pack, or the larger "Activator" pack?

 

[Misplaced_Canuck]

uhmn... if it's PPM, it's a ratio

M_C

 

[DKershner]

White Labs Yeast - All including Wine and Mead Yeast
This Yeast contains 12ppm in the slurry, a number slightly above the less than 10ppm requirement to be called gluten free. However, the final product (5gal of beer) only has 2ppm.

This is my quote from the beer ingredients post. What I am wondering, is how can 12ppm in a vial result in 2ppm in 5gal of beer, when 120ppm in a smack pack can only be .89ppm in 5gal of beer?

 

[Walker]

uhmn... if it's PPM, it's a ratio

M_C

now, see... why would you go and make a good point like that?

 

[dorklord]

This is my quote from the beer ingredients post. What I am wondering, is how can 12ppm in a vial result in 2ppm in 5gal of beer, when 120ppm in a smack pack can only be .89ppm in 5gal of beer?

Different amount of slurry being dissolved into the same amount of wort?

 

[dorklord]

Also, as for the propagator vs activator thing, if the propagator is simply 1/4 an activator (which is the difference in cell count listed on their site), then they should have the same ppm of gluten in the package...but the 'p' pack would have 1/4 as much total gluten, so it should then have 1/4 as much ppm when diluted in the beer.

If the 'p' pack has 1/4 the cell count, but has the same amount of 'liquid nutrient' in the inner 'pouch' then it would have a higher ppm in the package, but the same ppm when diluted.

Of course, if you really want to use wyeast, you might be best off to just NOT break open the inner pouch, and either pitch the yeast slurry, or use it to make a starter (with gf ingredients, of course).

 

[mrtree]

I was just curious about it and emailed Wyeast since I could not find info directly on their website like White Labs.

I emailed Wyeast back for a little clarification on how they arrived at that number.

 

[Walker]

If the 'p' pack has 1/4 the cell count, but has the same amount of 'liquid nutrient' in the inner 'pouch' then it would have a higher ppm in the package, but the same ppm when diluted.

Yeah.... umm... that's what I meant.

See, Canuck? I was right in the first place.

 

[DKershner]

Different amount of slurry being dissolved into the same amount of wort?

Except that the smack pack (125ml) has 3.5x as much slurry as the White Labs (35ml), so the calculation would be backwards and the Wyeast should have even MORE, not less.

 

[dorklord]

Except that the smack pack (125ml) has 3.5x as much slurry as the White Labs (35ml), so the calculation would be backwards and the Wyeast should have even MORE, not less.

Plain an simple, white labs math doesn't add up.

Take 12 ppm in 35 ml, dilute that 5 gallons (basically 19000 ml)

I get .022 ppm.

Take 120 ppm in 125 ml, dilute to 19000 ml, I get .78

.78 vs .82, that's close enough for government work.

 

[DKershner]

Plain an simple, white labs math doesn't add up.

Take 12 ppm in 35 ml, dilute that 5 gallons (basically 19000 ml)

I get .022 ppm.

Take 120 ppm in 125 ml, dilute to 19000 ml, I get .78

.78 vs .82, that's close enough for government work.

Then why would White Labs inflate their number by 100x?

http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/craft_FAQ.html

 

[mrtree]

Plain an simple, white labs math doesn't add up.

Take 12 ppm in 35 ml, dilute that 5 gallons (basically 19000 ml)

I get .022 ppm.

Take 120 ppm in 125 ml, dilute to 19000 ml, I get .78

.78 vs .82, that's close enough for government work.

Dorklord your right on. Here is the response from Wyeast:

Sure: The liquid in our package contains roughly 120ppm (mg/L) gluten. There is at most 130mls of liquid in our package. This yields 15.6mg of gluten in the package. When you divide 15.6mg by 18.9 Liters (5 gallons), you get 0.82 mg/L aka 0.82ppm gluten.

Jess


Now, what kind of math is White Labs using?

 

[dorklord]

Then why would White Labs inflate their number by 100x?

http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/craft_FAQ.html

Math is hard?

I honestly don't know. I mean, their math, as posted, just doesn't pass the simplest 'napkin' calculation You're diluting the yeast slurry more than 6 times, right?

Decimal points are tricky little buggers, they like to move on you...

 

[joe4444]

I emailed White Labs with the above calculations that result in .022 ppm asking them to explain their math. Here is the answer I received:

The technology currently used to measure gluten in beer can only really measure down to about 5ppm. Below that level, it's considered 'undetectable', so any value will be purely theoretical anyway. I think the 2ppm that we've been telling people is more of a scientific guess rather than a calculated value (we're yeast farmers, not mathematicians!), but your numbers make sense so I would go ahead and go with your values.