Now I know some guys are using them successfully but I wonder if they will surpass Corny kegs? I have 11 cornies right now and would like to get some more kegs but the price of used cornies is almost as much as new Sanke kegs!! And new cornies are even more than new Sanke's. So it got me thinking that maybe it is time to switch over to Sanke's? The only disadvantage I see is that I would have to buy 3-4 couplers for carbing/dispensing. Cleaning/sanitation would be the same as long as I pull the spear out every time. Anything else I am missing?
Will Sanke kegs ever be popular with homebrewers?
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Chupidacabra
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You can't reach your arm in to clean. Not really necessary with hot water and good old pbw but it seems to be the reason most people are against it. That and maybe the 5gal carboy fitting so nicely In the 5gal corny.
If I could get 5 gal sanke for cheap I'd definitely put thought into it. I can get the standards but that would run me out of room quick.
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If I could get 5 gal sanke for cheap I'd definitely put thought into it. I can get the standards but that would run me out of room quick.
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I have brewed close to 1000 gallons over the years....98% were put into corny kegs. I don't ever recall ever having to scrub a serving keg....like you said a hot PBW solution works wonders. It is even better with a home made keg washer!
I just wonder when/if homebrewers start using Sanke kegs because they are cheaper than cornies?
I just wonder when/if homebrewers start using Sanke kegs because they are cheaper than cornies?
ArcaneXor
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Sankes are not cheaper... a wholesale sixtel costs about $20 more than an AEB 5-gallon keg (priced individually without bulk discounts).
The main reason Sankes are popular with homebrewers is that they are easy to steal.
The main reason Sankes are popular with homebrewers is that they are easy to steal.
So a used corny is about $60 now.
A new 1/6bbl sanke is $74 from Stout tanks
A new "corny" is $80 - $100
ArcaneXor
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That's a remarkably good price. Made in China?
Im getting tired of chasing down leaks in corny kegs (still no comparison to bottling imo). Seems like the integrated coupler would at least simplify things to one point of entry. That stout deal seems sweet.
That is a great deal on a new Sanke keg. Looking into Sanke's the other thing I like is that you can get the 1/4 bbl size (7.75 gal) for just under 100 bucks. If I step up to 15 gal batches that mean I only need 2 sanke kegs vs. 3 cornies....so then the cost is virtually the same.
I have used sanke sixtel and tall 1/4 (7.75 gal) kegs for years. The sanke D coupler works very well, superior to the corny fittings IMO. With the sanke coupler, there is one large o-ring seal on the keg that is very positively engaged w/ the coupler. Just my experience, but I have never heard of a sanke filling a keezer with beer due to accidental release?
NickTheGreat
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Maybe I'm just fat, but I'm not sure I could exactly reach into a corny :fro:
I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that at least 75% of the kegs on craigslist are left over from a party, forgotten about for awhile, and then not returned... either because they lost the receipt, or the "return by" date had passed.
I used to feel guilty about buying kegs off craigslist, but after trying to return questionable kegs, it's clear that the deposit system is flawed.
There is no time limit on soda bottles.
There is no need to produce a receipt either.
If they want their kegs back, they can pay the freak'n deposit back.
I don't feel guilty a bit.
I'm gonna buy another one tomorrow.
Well, truth be told, that is what got me thinking about this. A friend is going through a divorce and gave a Sanke keg from his old kegerator. He lost his deposit, has no use for it, and thought maybe I could use it. It is from a major brewery(not that it matters).
It is crazy that if I rent a car, skis, or even a library book I am on the hook for the full value of the item if I don't return it. However with a keg you only lose your deposit which doesn't cover the full replacement value of the keg? Talk about a stupid idea!! Why don't they just charge a full deposit for the keg and the problem with "keg theft" will be solved.
sandyeggoxj
Well-Known Member
I've thought about moving to sanke. In fact I've almost purchased them from Stout or beverage factory multiple times... Sixtels are easy enough to move around and generally still fit in my kegerator. I have around 18 ball lock cornies right now, including a 10-gallon and (3) 3-gallon cornies. I have thought about selling them all and converting. I'd have about 3/4 of the money I need for the sankes by just selling my ball lock kegs. I would have to reinvest in couplers again. But that isn't too bad.
I HATE chasing leaks on cornies and I have about had enough. Maybe that will be my winter project. Build a sanke keg washer and convert.
I HATE chasing leaks on cornies and I have about had enough. Maybe that will be my winter project. Build a sanke keg washer and convert.
A $100 plus deposit on a keg would likely deter sales of kegged beer. I think the breweries prefer to keep the deposit low and do more volume with more profit to offset losses for unreturned kegs. I believe it makes a better business model.
The part I don't get is if the brewery is charging a deposit to the vendor, and the vendor is passing that on to a customer, who is loosing here? The vendor? How could they stay in business? The vendors absolutely will not pay back the deposit unless the keg is both a) returned before the "return by" date, and b) you have the original receipt. Why wouldn't they just be happy to get the keg back and gladly pay the deposit?
Serious question.
I don't serve from Sankes... I use them for fermenting and use a TC cap that has been modified to accept the various fittings. If I was going to use it as a serving keg, I would probably do the same thing to avoid having to disassemble it every time it needed cleaning.
As for cleaning the kegs, I have a 90 degree tip for my pressure washer, and I can completely clean a disassembled keg in about 5 minutes.
Serious question.
I don't serve from Sankes... I use them for fermenting and use a TC cap that has been modified to accept the various fittings. If I was going to use it as a serving keg, I would probably do the same thing to avoid having to disassemble it every time it needed cleaning.
As for cleaning the kegs, I have a 90 degree tip for my pressure washer, and I can completely clean a disassembled keg in about 5 minutes.
The only reason I can see for the return by date is to avoid any issues with beer that has stayed in the keg to long (especially if using a hand pump to dispense) - and maybe they don't trust the keg washers to deal with those kegs (since the will be just another keg on the line by that stage), either for not being fully clean or beer stone. It might actually be cheaper to just "scrap" those kegs than deal with them and the problems they might cause - since this will likely be a small % of the actual inventory.
I'm sure the breweries have keg washing systems proficient enough that ^that^ is even a consideration. More likely it's about the retailer not wanting his book-keeping complicated with carry-over credits...
Cheers!
Cheers!
They would rather just be out the $50. Right...
What?
The retailer with the "return by" policy was holding the deposit, so he's not out anything. Worst-case he coughs that fitty back to the brewery, which is up a fitty and down a keg. Probably a wash to them...
Cheers!
I use a sanke as my 3rd tap. It works well because whenever I don't have beer ready or don't want to serve my own beer I can add a commercial keg as a "guest tap". Cleaning has never been an issue either; I just give it a good soak and spray then check it with a flashlight if you're nervous of debris stuck at the bottom. I do however sometimes get worried about the ring breaking and getting impaled by the keg spear similar to something I've seen in the Walking Dead.
But remember that a sanke may cost $150 for us to buy, but for a large brewery they will be significantly cheaper. Even from stout tanks for orders over 24 you are looking at $125 per keg. then each of these assets are depreciated over their life (from 1 minute of research typically 7 years). SO if you take just a straight line depreciation that's about $18 per year (even more if it is depreciated by a percentage). So for your $50 deposit, as long as the average age of the keg fleet is older than approx. 4 years then you don't care at that stage if you write it of and pocket the $50 deposit. But you can not then take that keg back later since that would probably be tax evasion or something
But that just puts back most of the annoying things about a cony - leaky posts, lid not seating, etc.
I would expect so, but most of it is.
I figured I probably should do the right thing. I noticed the BA has a website kegreturn.com where you can contact a brewery regarding lost kegs so I sent them an email over the weekend. So far haven't heard back from them. If they don't get back to me soon.....what's that old saying "finders keepers"?
mbbransc
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Is there anyway to get a PRV on a sanke?
mannye
Well-Known Member
I was just thinking the same thing. How is it that I pay 35 bucks deposit on a keg of Mich Ultra (back off...it was a test keg to set up my glycol system...no crying if I spill Ultra all over the floor...which happened by the way) for a total of 79 bucks (the beer was only 44 dollars) and if I keep the keg I only lose the deposit?? It's not even theft. It's a part of the contract! Of course I would kinda feel like a dick for getting my kegs this way. But if I can't find some sucker to drink all this pisswater before the time is up, I may consider keeping it.
Guys remember the kegs belong to the breweries and not the distributors or the liquor store. Keeping a keg for its deposit is stealing and wrong in my book. Call around to the local breweries and see if they have decommissioned kegs or have contact of people selling decommissioned kegs. Do things right and honest and dont steal from those who supply us with the amazingness that is beer.
On a happy note. Sankes are easy to clean and provide the slimmest chance of CO2 leakage. I switched to them about 6 months ago and love them. Im lucky because i have a club contact who sells decommissioned sankes.
On a happy note. Sankes are easy to clean and provide the slimmest chance of CO2 leakage. I switched to them about 6 months ago and love them. Im lucky because i have a club contact who sells decommissioned sankes.
mbbransc
Well-Known Member
For the brewers who have made the jump, are you using something like this http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/ball-lock-conversion-kit-for-sanke-couplers.html
... and continuing to use your ball lock connectors?
Or something like this?
http://www.homebrewing.org/American-Sanke-D-Coupler_p_764.html
... and continuing to use your ball lock connectors?
Or something like this?
http://www.homebrewing.org/American-Sanke-D-Coupler_p_764.html
mbbransc
Well-Known Member
I'll self quote myself to say yes, there are PRV.
Example: http://www.homebrewing.org/American-Sanke-D-Coupler_p_764.html
You can use the conversion kit but that adds height to everything and if you dont have a tall enough collar it will cause issues. I went right to the D couplers and never looked back cuz i knew i wasnt going back to cornies. So make sure your setup has the height available.
It is theft. Have you read the contract? The deposit is just an incentive for you to return the keg, it is not a down-payment in case you decide you want to purchase the keg.
That's why I contacted the brewery.....just so I can say I tried in good faith to return the keg to the rightful owner.
hunter_le five
Sheriff Underscore
This issue has been discussed to death. What you are talking about IS theft and it IS illegal. The deposit does not grant you ownership of the keg. It is merely a form of collateral, albeit a poor one, as the deposit nowhere near covers the value of the keg.
If you keep the keg, you are stealing. Period. Let's move on now to more productive discussion.
Like others, I got tired of chasing leaks in corney kegs. Seems like I never used a full 20# co2 tank, instead after a few months I would forget to triple check a keg lid or ball lock and leak it all. I've started switching to new Sankey's after that. Right now half of my kegs are Sankey and half the taps in the kegerator have Sankey couplers. I had mfl ball locks so I just got mfl tailpieces for the couplers in case I ever need to switch back and forth for some reason.
After a few times you get used to taking it apart and it really isn't that hard.
After a few times you get used to taking it apart and it really isn't that hard.
Like this? I made this from a cheap sanke coupler and an adapter kit I bought at my LHBS. Ball lock gas/liquid.
No. I thought about going that route but I didn't want to even deal with the disconnects. I used these on my Sankey coupler then unscrewed my mfl ball locks. Both ways let you go back and forth though yours is probably quicker.
Also, if you are thinking of converting, don't forget that Sankeys are just a bit wider than ball lock corneys. It took a little work to figure out how to configure them in my keezer.
mannye
Well-Known Member
I pretty much agree with you I guess. Regardless, I'm moving to Sanke kegs now that all my Cornys finally gave out.
The couplers are a little more expensive but I find them just as easy to work with as Cornys if not easier. And now that prices are starting to equalize it's no longer that much of a financial decision.
Plus if you do have a Sanke keg setup it allows you to buy the occasional commercial cider or craft beer. I don't know about you guys but sometimes I hear about family or friends coming to visit and the keezers are bare!
It's nice to be able to run out and get a 1/6 of Fat Tire or Cider and have beer flowing when the party starts!
So it seems the answer is yes. In fact, if the pro manufacturers catch on and start making home systems they may even replace them before long.
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Sorry I wasn't aiming my comment at you. I looked at the kegreturn.com website and that is a great place to do the right thing.
Looking a bit deeper they have a list from Tosca (a keg repair company) that list all the kegs held by them for various breweries - Boston Beer Co. has over 500 kegs on that list! Now there must be some reason that Boston Beer Co. doesn't just drive round there and pick up their 20 pallets of kegs.
What about PubKegs? They have Sanke fittings. People seemed excited about them about a year ago but in don't see or hear about them. They were pricey new, but as a disposable for bars, I thought the homebrew world would embrace them.
