When is your LHBS not your LHBS?

[OswaldvW]

I would really like to support my local homebrew shop, but the more I think about it, all LHBS "near me" are at least one hour away. Factor in gas, and it makes much more sense to order items online. I still make trips to two to three stores in my area, but that often means a roundtrip of 3 hours +.

I was wondering if there are brewers out there who have any strong feelings about this: Proximity, loyalty to local, cost, time, convenience, and so forth.

 

[RM-MN]

I would really like to support my local homebrew shop, but the more I think about it, all LHBS "near me" are at least one hour away. Factor in gas, and it makes much more sense to order items online. I still make trips to two to three stores in my area, but that often means a roundtrip of 3 hours +.

I was wondering if there are brewers out there who have any strong feelings about this: Proximity, loyalty to local, cost, time, convenience, and so forth.

Similar, my nearest B&M store is 90 miles and there is only one there. The next nearest is 150 miles but a different direction. I past by the nearer one once or twice a year and buy base malt and whatever else I remember while there but I have to depend on ordering in.

 

[bleme]

My 'LHBS' is 45 minutes away. I visited once, when I was in Fresno for something else anyway. For me, it isn't worth having to deal with Fresno so I order everything online.

There used to be a HBS in Bakersfield but the guy ran it on his own and would just close up shop to run his errands. Out of the 5 times I visited, twice the store was closed during advertised business hours. He seemed like a really nice guy but he had no idea how to run a business.

I see a LOT of people on here who are fanatical about supporting local small business but if I get crappy service at the local steak house, I'm going to eat at Outback.

 

[Coastalbrew]

I'm right there with you @OswaldvW . I really appreciate local business and try to support them whenever I can. But my local shop is 45 min 1 way and my last 3 batches they have been out of 2 or more ingredients causing me to have to substitute. I still go in for advice and hardware if I'm in the area anyway and need something , but have started getting ingredients online so I can get what I need when I need it.

For me local business is important and I support it when I can, but when I need to I'll shop online.

 

[Andrew Hodgson]

I'm lucky enough to have a LHBS 10 minutes away and I still get some things online. I don't fault anyone for ordering online instead just like I don't condemn anyone who uses Amazon. Everyone's consumer choice is based on their own logic/math and this is 'Murica, you are free to consider your options how you want and won't get any crap from me whichever you choose. Cheers.

 

[kh54s10]

In the case stated I would support the LHBS. But conditionally. I would go that distance only if I could make it worthwhile which would mean either buying something in bulk with savings enough to offset the gas/mileage or combine it with trips to other stores etc. To go there alone for small items that you can get for the same or less online doesn't make any sense.

 

[Blazinlow86]

I buy my grain, yeast, small hardware at the lhbs. Most of my actual system was bought online and I buy all my hops online from Yakima as the lhbs is too expensive for how much I brew. Cheers

 

[brew703]

The two LHBS I use are both 1 hr away. I do go to both when I'm in the area or really need grain or yeast. One LHBS I stopped buying grains from them because just about every order I get from them has weevils. Not just a few, but an infestation. The owner is really nice and knowledgeable but he didn't seem to really care when i mentioned it to him. Kinda pissed me off so i only get my CO2 tanks refilled there.

 

[odie]

So what defines local? Used to mean neighborhood businesses. Across town might be 2 hours in some cities.

 

[chezhed]

From the LHBS owner side...a couple points...
LOCATION
We understand proximity is an issue. Our store is the only one for hundreds of miles so we know many order online. Unfortunately, too many. I understand an hour away is an issue...it was for me as a homebrewer in other locations. There isn't much the LHBS can do about that. We are too small to offset the gas/time cost. It's the customers that are 30 miles away that order online and actually spend more to do so that are puzzling.....we are competitive and have been told so.

PRICE
Yeah the LHBS is probably a bit higher on hops by the ounce...just like the local food store is higher than the big boy markets. There is just no economical way around that for us. We just can't offset it in volume. But we try to make up for it in other commodities. And can you return hops (unopened) to that online place in case you ordered wrong or changed your mind? Consider bulk purchases at the LHBS. Have you ever negotiated a price? Remember, we OWN the place...we have final say.

QUALITY
Multiple orders with weevils? I'd change also. Closed during "normal" hours without any notice of return or anything? Yep, that would make me think twice. We offer immediate exchange or refund on unopened ingredients and all equipment. No ifs, ands or buts about it. If your LHBS does not, then, again, I would think twice. We can offer QUALITY service above and beyond online.....we have to. And don't forget the free knowledgeable advice....or heck, just an ear to bend over a homebrew.....yours or ours

AVAILABILITY
We opened our store because frankly we got fed up with online mistakes and missing items and knew we could do better. No, we don't carry every ingredient or piece of equipment but we do have a lot and we can get anything. Again, any LHBS should do the same. And since we are not across the street and we do understand time is valuable, we encourage you to call and check with us about availability....we hold it for you no problem. Online inventory management is difficult....a physical check is real time!

IT'S WHAT WE CAN OFFER
Service; friendly people that actually share the hobby, not just employees. Corporations like to tell employees, "act like you are in business for yourself." Well, we are.
Price; yes, try us....negotiate. Give us a chance.
Camaraderie; we have beer on tap.....nuff said.
Credit; store accounts, just don't stiff us....we have never been stiffed, never had a bad check, never had to charge a customer late fee. We find homebrewers to be an honest bunch. Build a good report with your LHBS and perhaps you can get by in tight times.
Convenience; we often think that is the only reason we have some customer visits...."OSWO, run to the LHBS."
Knowledge; "Don't ask me how I know not to do that or what will happen." Personal demonstration, hands on learning.

We know we can't stop you from online ordering and frankly we don't expect to. But every little sale helps a little local business. If you can spend that extra time now to buy from the LHBS, consider it an investment in the chance that you may need something suddenly in the future. Because if you don't, we won't be here.

thanks...it's February, always a bad month because everyone got their CC bills in Jan and can't spend in Feb....and I just needed to vent

 

[TheMadKing]

I just order online from my LHBS store and have them ship it to me. I don't look for the cheapest deal so much as the best selection, and they are well stocked. I can usually find stuff that northern brewer or morebeer are missing! They charge cheap shipping and it arrives at my house the next day. Yeah it's a few bucks more than driving down there, but it saves me 2+ hours of driving and it's the same price as ordering from a large online store, and I know that my ingredients will be handled with care.

Edit: I define LHBS as the closest one to my house - which is an hour down and an hour back if traffic is good...

 

[Jag75]

My 'LHBS' is 45 minutes away. I visited once, when I was in Fresno for something else anyway. For me, it isn't worth having to deal with Fresno so I order everything online.


There used to be a HBS in Bakersfield but the guy ran it on his own and would just close up shop to run his errands. Out of the 5 times I visited, twice the store was closed during advertised business hours. He seemed like a really nice guy but he had no idea how to run a business.

I see a LOT of people on here who are fanatical about supporting local small business but if I get crappy service at the local steak house, I'm going to eat at Outback.

Bleme, have you went to the new HBS on distric Blvd? I'm about 45 min away from Bakersfield. Ive gone to the new one in Bakersfield ( central valley homebrew ). Nice guys so I try and give em business. My aunt owns a HBS in NM so I order stuff from her even though it may cost me 20$ more just to give her some business. I do however order from Morebeer as well. I use my LHBS more then not though.

 

[odie]

The new LHBS here is killing it on grain prices...sack or by the pound...I’m shocked and happy...beating the hell outta Amazon

 

[bleme]

Bleme, have you went to the new HBS on distric Blvd? I'm about 45 min away from Bakersfield. Ive gone to the new one in Bakersfield ( central valley homebrew ). Nice guys so I try and give em business. My aunt owns a HBS in NM so I order stuff from her even though it may cost me 20$ more just to give her some business. I do however order from Morebeer as well. I use my LHBS more then not though.

I had no idea Bakersfield got another one. My work doesn't send me to Bakersfield much any more, but I'll check them out next time I'm down there.

I usually order from Williams because if I order before noon, I get it the next day.

 

[Jag75]

I had no idea Bakersfield got another one. My work doesn't send me to Bakersfield much any more, but I'll check them out next time I'm down there.

I usually order from Williams because if I order before noon, I get it the next day.

What I like about them is i can send an email of what i want . Tell them what time I'll be there and when I show up its bagged and ready to go . They're open M-F 4pmto 8pm then Sat and Sun 8 am to 4 PM I believe .

 

[ListerH]

My LHBS is about 45 minutes away and so the round trip is a bit of a hassle and I have thought about ordering online... but actually what keeps me from doing that is that I always enjoy having a bit of a nose round the store, weighing and milling my grain there, having a chat with whoever’s in about what they’re brewing this weekend, getting a bit of advice from the owner... and of course getting a sample of whatever they have on their in store taps as I have a look around...

It reminds me that I’m part of a local home brewing community and that’s an important part of what brewing is about for me... I’d miss it if I went the online route I think.

 

[Edward's Beer Cellar]

I live in SW Ohio and buy 95% of my supplies and misc. equipment from LHBS in Indianapolis, Cleveland and Asheville, NC. My experiences are this.

Indianapolis - close to one of my work sites; nationally known, carry every thing, but not the most friendly folks - I only buy my fill-in needs here

Cleveland - awesome family owned shop, friendly, helpful, offer AHA discount, carry locally produced malts, and have good pricing. I order a year's worth of grains and yeast on line for local pick-up when I'm in town.

Asheville - friendly store owner, carry local malts, I stock up a couple of times a year when I visit

I buy bulk hops at the farm from from a couple of very small growers in NE Ohio when my travels take me there.

My goals are to brew beers using locally produced malts and hops as much as possible, and purchase as much as I can from small businesses.

 

[Home_alone1]

Im extremely lucky as I have 3 home brew shops in 30 min proximity. There isn’t much I can’t get locally !

 

[MaxStout]

I've had generally good experiences at my LHBS but their prices have been creeping up steadily the past few years, to the point where I now buy much of my gear and ingredients online. Particularly grain, as I cannot justify $2.50-$3.00 a pound when I can order from Morebeer for much less with free shipping to boot. Much as I'd like to spend local, I'm a consumerist, first and foremost.

I do buy yeast locally, as I know it will be fresh, and if I need something immediately I can go to the local shop.

 

[day_trippr]

I'm lucky to have a full lhbs 15 pleasant back-road minutes away with an owner I've known for 15 years - and staff that knows that
I bought all of my kettles and burners from them over the years, buy all of my grains there, some hops (though far and away I buy bulk on-line), occasionally yeast (if I'm trying a strain not currently farmed) and random stuff like water salts, cleaners and sanitizers.

The next closest stores are 30 minutes away west and east and would suffice if it came to that...

Cheers!

 

[Sadu]

I've just shifted from a town 3.5 hours from the nearest LHBS to having one 10 mins away. I'm still getting used to the concept. Truth be told, I kinda like ordering ingredients in bulk, getting a good deal and free shipping, getting a great selection too. It just means being a bit more organised.
The LHBS seems fine but the prices aren't great, they don't vacuum seal hops and I don't ever need to hassle them for advice or tips.

I've also built up really good relationships with the online shops, also owned by smallish operators, and I feel they have earned my business too.

I guess what I'm saying is that being local isn't enough. The whole package needs to be good because our online options are fantastic. And all the places I buy from are likely in the 3-10 staff range, so not huge soulless corporates or anything.

 

[shetc]

There are 2 shops by me. Unfortunately, I live right between the two so that they are a 40 min drive in opposite directions. But I live in South Florida so I use them as much as possible cuz I know they have fresh, well maintained liquid yeast! (Also they are both situated near really good breweries.)

 

[Nagorg]

Sadly the closest LHBS in my neck of the woods closed. It was because of the death of an owner and a family decision but I know that they felt pressures from BigBox online sales. I bought all my grain and yeast from them and a lot of my equipment too including my grain mill when I could have easily bought direct. I buy hops by the pound and they would give me competitive pricing when I asked!

There are a couple other LHBS locations within driving distance but they are both ~45-60 minutes out (or worse if DFW traffic strikes). Because of this, I'm afraid some of the other online options are on my radar now but I'll still try to order local if timing and pricing is right.

With no conveniently located LHBS, I still haven't figured out what to do about 50# 2-Row orders just yet. I'll most likely drive to these locations when I need that much grain because of freight impact. Other than that, online ordering and shipping to my door is now more of a fact of my HomeBrew life now. Sadly... I miss being able to weigh out my own grains in their grain room and the small talk. Sniff...

 

[BrewMan13]

My LHBS is only like 20min away and I try to support it as much as I can, but I don't use them exclusively. I buy all my yeast, grains, and other odds and ends there, but I usually buys hops in bulk online, as well as other random stuff depending on the specifics. I don't think they've caught onto the hops thing yet as the last few visits I keep getting asked "don't you need any hops?" as I'm checking out.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

I generally like to support the local businesses. I've also gotten to know the proprietor at the "LHBS" (quotes because they're two cities away), which makes me want to support them even more. I really have a couple issues with them that prevent me from using them more often:

1) They're about a 55 minute round trip drive through annoying traffic. This includes trying to get out of their place where I'm turning left onto a busy street that has near constant 45mph traffic. Most times I give up, turn right, take the next left, turn around in a parking lot so that I can turn right to go the direction I want to go.
2) They are struggling and have cut down their hours. They're open Thursday most of the day, and a couple hours in the afternoon on Saturday and Sunday. The weekend hours don't work if I need a last minute brew day thing as I'm usually done brewing by the time they open. Thursday works from a time perspective, but if I stop by to get something for the weekend, I'm screwed if they don't have it. They're frequently out of my favorite yeast choices and I was having to sub in different yeast more often than not.

I don't buy hops from them because I only buy hops that are vacuum sealed in mylar bags...I've found they are much better that way. I buy in bulk from Yakama or Farmhouse.

I get my base grains "locally" via my homebrew club that works with a local brewery. I get bags of Briess for $25. The LHBS can't come close to competing with that.

I feel bad, but I only stop in once a year or so. They just aren't convenient enough to justify the higher prices.

 

[catdaddy66]

My current LHBS has been awesome! It opened in 2014 on my side of town, maybe 15 minutes away. It has had 2 owners, both great guys that really know brewing. I have been to about 80-90% of their monthly tastings as well as a half dozen onsite brewing demos that they put on. I can use their chest freezer for lager fermentation if it's not being used for other purposes. Hell, I've even bottled a few batches up there!

There is another store across town that has been open at least 30 years. It's an option for emergency purchases if I am ever in the vicinity. I believe that they are more wine people but are quite nice also.

I will buy from Morebeer about once every year or two. As a matter of fact I just got an order from them a week ago.

 

[chezhed]

We appreciate all these comments. It helps us to know what customers in general like, whether you are ours or not. You are our target no matter where you are. So if you are in deep south Texas (not sure why you would be, but......) , come visit the best little homebrew store....where we do vacuum pack hops in mylar, keep all hops and yeast refrigerated, pick and pack to order for pickup and will negotiate prices for bulk. but $25 for a bag of Briess ain't happening....

 

[A_McG]

I've taken to buying most everything at my "local" store, tho it's 40 miles away. The price is similar to online but I'm able see dates on yeast, freshness of grain and the expensive equipment is opened and checked for quality and damage before leaving the store. I got fed up with buying new items that had clearly been returned and sold as "new".

That said, sometimes I get that northern Brewer email and it's just the deal I'm looking for. Rare now, but still happens.

Bonus of local store is getting to talk to fellow Brewers in person, check out some new equipment they have set up and support a small business.

 

[lump42]

I'm there with the OP, one store an hour one direction, another an hour and a half the other. If I have businesses in town I place an order or stop by the stores as I can. Otherwise, I'll order online.

 

[Nagorg]

So if you are in deep south Texas

Holy Chit you ARE in deep south Texas... Damn near Mexico! LOL

 

[Lefou]

I only really frequent two shops.
One is within 15 minutes and gets the majority of my business. Some days I'll hang around waiting for an order to be filled when it's truly busy, other days it's in-and-out with free stuff in minutes! Love2Brew carries a wider array of items but I despise driving in North Jersey and do it only rarely. If it was a necessity to order online my homebrewing would be something done much less often.

 

[chezhed]

Holy Chit you ARE in deep south Texas... Damn near Mexico! LOL

Actually Northern Mexico provides a large number of customers for us....and they drive 2-3 hours on a weekend because we are the only place for 1000 km for them.
Yep....my house is 2 miles from the border....

 

[Nagorg]

Actually Northern Mexico provides a large number of customers for us...

Very cool! Its awesome to hear that Home Brewers in Mexico come to the US for supplies! The "Wall" will topple from Home Brewers coming for supplies... Beer unites us all!

 

[njviking]

Actually Northern Mexico provides a large number of customers for us....and they drive 2-3 hours on a weekend because we are the only place for 1000 km for them.
Yep....my house is 2 miles from the border....

Very cool! Its awesome to hear that Home Brewers in Mexico come to the US for supplies! The "Wall" will topple from Home Brewers coming for supplies... Beer unites us all!

I always wondered where home brewers and breweries in mexico get their stuff. I can see Modello or any of the other big guys get containers full, but what about breweries on say the Yucatan? Same as the rest of Central/South america.
I have property in Panama and its hard to get a first aide kit let alone wlp 308....

 

[buckinin]

I live in SW Ohio and buy 95% of my supplies and misc. equipment from LHBS in Indianapolis, Cleveland and Asheville, NC. My experiences are this.

Indianapolis - close to one of my work sites; nationally known, carry every thing, but not the most friendly folks - I only buy my fill-in needs here

Cleveland - awesome family owned shop, friendly, helpful, offer AHA discount, carry locally produced malts, and have good pricing. I order a year's worth of grains and yeast on line for local pick-up when I'm in town.

Asheville - friendly store owner, carry local malts, I stock up a couple of times a year when I visit

I buy bulk hops at the farm from from a couple of very small growers in NE Ohio when my travels take me there.

My goals are to brew beers using locally produced malts and hops as much as possible, and purchase as much as I can from small businesses.

If I may ask, what is the store in Cleveland that you like? I’m fairly new to the Cleveland area and still trying to figure out where I’d like to shop. Thanks!

 

[chezhed]

I always wondered where home brewers and breweries in mexico get their stuff. I can see Modello or any of the other big guys get containers full, but what about breweries on say the Yucatan? Same as the rest of Central/South america.
I have property in Panama and its hard to get a first aide kit let alone wlp 308....

Grain is plentiful and not taxed heavily for import so they have plenty of that. Not many brewers/brewpubs/nano breweries use liquid yeast and have learned to harvest yeast because of supply. Hops are another story entirely for these guys.....sometimes they come in and clean me out of certain varieties. No tax either...it's "rabbit food." Probably one of the more interesting aspects of our store is being "international.".....as for "the wall," but show me the right thread and I will jump in with a perspective of a resident affected.

 

[Tbagger]

My LHBS is about a 1.5 hour round trip. Which isn't bad considering I live out in the boonies. I do however commute right by it every day but my problem is that I work graveyard so it's closed each direction. So I end up sitting in the parking lot for about an hour on my way home because I like to support local. The prices are pretty good and they are friendly so I don't mind the inconvenience too much.

 

[Kickass]

I'm currently stressing over this. I live 5miles, 15min-1hour round trip depending on traffic, from the SoCal morebeer store and am moving to Tehachapi. Morebeer has always been incredible. Rob and the gang are amazing stewards of the passion and hobby. The thought of having to be so much more organized and detailed is sobering. The days of waking up and brewing on a whim will sadly be a thing of the past.

 

[yourlastchance89]

I am blessed. I have three lhbs in my vicinity with one of them just opening in the past month. Two of them are within 10-15 minutes away and one is about 30 minutes away. Two of the three have online components and all three of them have taproom/bottleshop components in them which seem to generate a huge portion of their business. They all have their strong points in terms of ingredients, equipment, and knowledgeable staff. I order online maybe 3-5 times a year and usually for a special piece of equipment or unique ingredient I know they don't have in stock.

 

[madscientist451]

I added up the extra time and gas money I was using going to the LHBS, which I can hit on the way home, but it adds at least an hour to the already long commute, and I decided that getting a mill and buying grain in bulk was the way to go.
Once you build up an inventory, you don't need to go to the store very often.
I still stop in there now and then, but not as often as before.