Want to lager, not sure if I want to spend $$$s on Glycol...suggestions?

[stealthfixr]

Hello, I am a recently renewed homebrewer and currently BIAB'ing with good results. I have a couple BrewJackets that work fine for ale temperatures, but nowhere close for lager.

I would like to make a few kinds of lagers, or have the ability to cold crash ales before kegging. While glycol seems to be the gold standard for such a requirement, darn is it expensive! Even "The Stasis" is a $750 deal, and the $699 MoreBeer glycol chiller isn't going to be in stock until sometime this summer. Not sure I want my most expensive piece of brewing equipment to be a chiller.

I've looked at upright freezers and sometimes a good deal can be found used. I live in Tucson AZ and there has not been a lot of upright freezer action on craigslist. A new upright runs about the same as a glycol chiller (that can chill to fermenters at once vs. one in an upright freezer).

Any suggestions for getting fermenting beer down to 40F or so without using a gazillian frozen water bottles? Do aquarium chillers work? Is there a sub-$500 option for making lagers without using ice to chill.

 

[deuc224]

Honestly man i dont think there is any other option. Its why i bit the bullet and bought the Icemaster max4.

 

[RPh_Guy]

I assume you have some kind of kegerator or keezer... A good option is to lager after packaging.

 

[Transamguy77]

I agree with what @RPh_Guy said and you could ferment with Saflager 34-70, many people have had good results using that yeast and fermenting at ale temps. And you could then just lager after it’s packaged

 

[bleme]

I use a small kegerator fridge that my wife picked up at a yard sale for $100 (with keg, CO2 tank and regulator).
What kind of ferm vessel are you using?

 

[bracconiere]

i pcked up a fridge from the neighbors yard sale...they wanted $85 for it, i gave him $150....it was a good deal either way.....i can fit my 15 gallon fermenter in it fine....so you could probably fit 2 carboys in it also....

 

[bleme]

https://tucson.craigslist.org/app/d/tucson-refrigerator-for-fermentation/7133621037.htmlhttps://tucson.craigslist.org/app/d/tucson-fridge/7133056183.html

 

[Elric]

I just had some of my first “lager” with saflager 34-70 (a dunkel). It was brewed warm three weeks ago so it has never seen any true lagering, but it definitely had that lager taste. If you can't justify the expense of a true lagering setup but still want to try brewing a lager. i can't recommend this method enough.

 

[Redpappy]

Before my fridge died, I used a chest freezer with a ink bird controller for fermentation. Worked great for lagering. But since fridge died, I transferred my freezer into my keezer.

 

[Deadalus]

I've got a wine fridge and small dorm style fridge that I lager in, I think they were $75‐80 for both. Two temperature controllers were ~$40 for both. Each fridge fits a 6.5 gallon carboy. So far this year for lagers I've brewed a German pilsner, a marzen, a schwarzbier, and a Munich Helles. I also paid about $10‐15 each for two thermowells.

 

[CodeSection]

i pcked up a fridge from the neighbors yard sale...they wanted $85 for it, i gave him $150....it was a good deal either way.....i can fit my 15 gallon fermenter in it fine....so you could probably fit 2 carboys in it also....

Hmmm. Not a good sign on many levels...... BTW, was the ink dry?

 

[Cyclman]

Upright freezer to ferment, lager, store kegs, store bottles, store cans...great investment. I ultimately moved to a chest freezer for fermenting, but never regret buying my upright.

 

[bracconiere]

Hmmm. Not a good sign on many levels...... BTW, was the ink dry?

i don't know about the ink on the check....he was MORE then helpful, hauling it over to my place, up some stairs, and into the kitchen......

 

[CodeSection]

i don't know about the ink on the check....he was MORE then helpful, hauling it over to my place, up some stairs, and into the kitchen......

If you say so......that sounds good!!!! Wait! Ahhhh....... check washing?!?

Sorry, off topic I know but I couldn't resist.

 

[bracconiere]

check washing?!?

i actually had to google that term.....no i'm just generous...the dualality of the human race leaves me scratching my head on how to treat them.....

 

[Beermeister32]

Go find a 4.4 cubic foot under the counter type refrigerator. Get the type with no freezer. I have 8 of the old Sanyo's running currently, each plugged into its' own digital temperature control with beautiful red 7-segment display LED's. They don't make the Sanyos any longer, but there are other brands which are similar. These can lager two corny kegs at a time.

Set the refrigerator temperature down as cold as you can. Buy or build the temperature controller for the refrigerator to plug into. I take the thermocouple and attach it to the carboy or keg with a bungie cord and a little square of foam rubber between the bungie and the thermocouple. I can lager at 34F even in 110 degree garage temperatures here in Southern California. Or you could ferment a carboy right at 50F for that lager. Each refrigerator can be adjusted for any temperature you need from ambient down to freezing.

Used refrigerators are available on Craiglist for $50-100 and another $40 to fab a controller. Cheaper than a glycol setup, and you can do two kegs at once.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Can you deal with fermenting, crashing or lagering one batch at a time? I searched letgo and craigslist, eventually picking up one of those can-shaped merchandising refrigerators that gas stations and convenience stores use to sell cold energy drinks. I got it for $40 because the guy said the temp control didn't work and it was freezing his drinks. Perfect for my application since I would plug it into an inkbird temp controller anyway. It has drop-in baskets that I can use to keep bottled homebrew cold, or I can remove them and fit a carboy in there for temperature controlled fermentation and cold crashing finished beers. I can even drop a kegged beer in there for lagering though I would have to rig up some sort of insulation for the top since the keg would stick out. Works really well, has wheels which make it easy to roll about, and takes up very little floor space. I seriously wouldn't part with it for less than $300 and even then I would miss it.

Also, some people have converted them into single tap kegerators with a small table on top. Great for entertaining!

 

[shoengine]

Hello, I am a recently renewed homebrewer and currently BIAB'ing with good results. I have a couple BrewJackets that work fine for ale temperatures, but nowhere close for lager.

I would like to make a few kinds of lagers, or have the ability to cold crash ales before kegging. While glycol seems to be the gold standard for such a requirement, darn is it expensive! Even "The Stasis" is a $750 deal, and the $699 MoreBeer glycol chiller isn't going to be in stock until sometime this summer. Not sure I want my most expensive piece of brewing equipment to be a chiller.

I've looked at upright freezers and sometimes a good deal can be found used. I live in Tucson AZ and there has not been a lot of upright freezer action on craigslist. A new upright runs about the same as a glycol chiller (that can chill to fermenters at once vs. one in an upright freezer).

Any suggestions for getting fermenting beer down to 40F or so without using a gazillian frozen water bottles? Do aquarium chillers work? Is there a sub-$500 option for making lagers without using ice to chill.

I like @Jayjay1976 's approach. I currently use an old chest freezer in spring, summer and fall, or just keep them warm in winter. You should be able to find a used refrigerator for cheap, and any refrigerator should be able to go sub 40F.

I'm thinking of going glycol mainly due to space issues. Glycol and plumbing scale up better than a bunch of refrigerators and chest freezers.

 

[Thorrak]

Hello, I am a recently renewed homebrewer and currently BIAB'ing with good results. I have a couple BrewJackets that work fine for ale temperatures, but nowhere close for lager.

I would like to make a few kinds of lagers, or have the ability to cold crash ales before kegging. While glycol seems to be the gold standard for such a requirement, darn is it expensive! Even "The Stasis" is a $750 deal, and the $699 MoreBeer glycol chiller isn't going to be in stock until sometime this summer. Not sure I want my most expensive piece of brewing equipment to be a chiller.

I've looked at upright freezers and sometimes a good deal can be found used. I live in Tucson AZ and there has not been a lot of upright freezer action on craigslist. A new upright runs about the same as a glycol chiller (that can chill to fermenters at once vs. one in an upright freezer).

Any suggestions for getting fermenting beer down to 40F or so without using a gazillian frozen water bottles? Do aquarium chillers work? Is there a sub-$500 option for making lagers without using ice to chill.

DO NOT get the stasis unless you can deal with the noise.

 

[stealthfixr]

Thank you for the many responses and ideas. This forum is really excellent! To answer earlier questions, I use a Fast Ferment conical and a 6.5gal Big Bubbler, but I am eyeing either the Fermentzilla conical or (go big) the Spike CF-5 conical for pressure transfers.

I had not considered a fridge for fermentation, but obviously it's an option. Perhaps my info is either old or mistaken, but I thought there was a reason that freezers were considered advantageous over a refrigerator--something about their ability to cycle power on/off via a temperature regulator of some kind. However, that $50 one from Craigslist isn't much of an investment! My wife isn't thrilled to get a second fridge/freezer in the garage, however. Long story...not a done deal, but there are limited 110v outlets in my garage and we have a EV parked in it.

I used to use a chest freezer for fermentation, but lowering & raising the Fast Ferment conical was a chore and a half--good way to throw out the back. I would much rather use a side entered chamber of some kind.

I've looked at the Stasis, but now MoreBeer has a glycol chiller option at $699 (and may not be as noisy). I do really like the glycol chiller ability to control two, separate fermentations at the same time--big advantage. I don't brew concurrently a lot, but I do some.

 

[Beermeister32]

The refrigerators are stackable with a layer of plywood between the top and bottom refrigerator. I have two of them set up as fermentation chambers at any time. These are usually set at 50F for most lagers, anywhere from 58-75F depending what ales I'm running. The great thing is when you are running lagers, you can set the fermentation chamber refrigerator temperature near the end of fermentation for a D-rest at 65 degrees without touching the carboy.

I use 3 of the refrigerators for lagering storage in kegs at 34 degrees. Beer ages in the lager kegs for a long time, usually 3-5 months, sometimes more (I run a lot of lagers). You can lager 6 kegs at the same time. One of the lagering chambers I use for carbonating. Usually I carbonate 1 keg at a time at 34F, however in the past I was able to squeeze the 5LB CO2 bottle in with 2 kegs. The other 3 refrigerators are set to 38 degrees and hold bottled beer and get changed around a lot. You have a lot of flexibility with this setup for all 4 needs, fermenting, lagering, carbonating and finished beer storage. This allows you to keep a lot of beer in the pipeline so you aren't focused on finishing and drinking one specific batch. I also reserve one of the refrigerators for my vintage beer fridge. Makes me happy, beers from my days growing up in the Northwest.

 

[CodeSection]

Thank you for the many responses and ideas. This forum is really excellent! To answer earlier questions, I use a Fast Ferment conical and a 6.5gal Big Bubbler, but I am eyeing either the Fermentzilla conical or (go big) the Spike CF-5 conical for pressure transfers.

I had not considered a fridge for fermentation, but obviously it's an option. Perhaps my info is either old or mistaken, but I thought there was a reason that freezers were considered advantageous over a refrigerator--something about their ability to cycle power on/off via a temperature regulator of some kind. However, that $50 one from Craigslist isn't much of an investment! My wife isn't thrilled to get a second fridge/freezer in the garage, however. Long story...not a done deal, but there are limited 110v outlets in my garage and we have a EV parked in it.

I used to use a chest freezer for fermentation, but lowering & raising the Fast Ferment conical was a chore and a half--good way to throw out the back. I would much rather use a side entered chamber of some kind.

I've looked at the Stasis, but now MoreBeer has a glycol chiller option at $699 (and may not be as noisy). I do really like the glycol chiller ability to control two, separate fermentations at the same time--big advantage. I don't brew concurrently a lot, but I do some.

Here is a link to post #291 that reports real data on noise levels. The Stasis - A glycol system designed for homebrewers - Pre-Order now for $599

BTW, if you ever see the need to control your temps via WIFI, you may want to skip any chillers with built-in non-wifi controllers. There are two different threads on the Max2 and Max4 that address some of these differences.....

 

[Beermeister32]

On the digital temperature controls, I have a little LED nightlight plugged in to the controller for each refrigerator. This indicates when the refrigerator is kicked on to the "on" mode by the digital controller. There is a switch and an outlet on each control box.

 

[AzOr]

Hmmm. Not a good sign on many levels...... BTW, was the ink dry?

I laughed out loud when I read @bracconiere ’s post.

 

[AzOr]

I lost my keezer to the pandemic so I’ve been brewing with the seasons.

In March it was still cool enough to get some lagers done. Now it’s ales. Mid summer I may try out some kveik strains.

I’m actually ok with it. In a weird way it’s kinda nice to have limited options.

 

[Jayjay1976]

I lost my keezer to the pandemic so I’ve been brewing with the seasons.

In March it was still cool enough to get some lagers done. Now it’s ales. Mid summer I may try out some kveik strains.

I’m actually ok with it. In a weird way it’s kinda nice to have limited options.

I also really like brewing seasonally, something authentic about it. Plus, the calendar naturally leads you through a cycle of styles. If I had a basement with stable, cool temps year round I would stockpile lagers all through the cold months and then drink my ass off all summer long.

 

[waldoar15]

I use a chest freezer with an inkbird. Works just fine for me.

 

[Jag75]

If your going with Cf5 as well save some money and DIY your chiller . It's easy and works great . My set up was about 300$. I easily get beer into the 30's .

 

[mannye]

I use two GE freezers hooked into a Johnson Controls A419 temp controller. Literally 5 minutes to set up. Each freezer holds 3 Corny sized kegs (I use Sanke kegs) or one corny and one half as in this one.

If you go with a freezer, make sure you also include a fan (mine is kinda just sitting on the water and gas lines. One of these days I’ll mount it) otherwise the temps will vary A LOT from top to bottom. As much as 50 degrees on top and 30 at the bottom. Don’t ask me how I know.

this is a close up of the controller. I have it set up for serving temp right now but it can be set to anything from 70F to -30 or something like that. Way colder than you would ever need. Here in Tropical Miami Beach, beer and mead making would be nearly impossible most of the year without a setup like this. A second hand freezer is cheap as chips and the controller costs around 60 bucks I think.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

I use the brew jacket for a few lagers a year and I don’t have an issue in my air conditioned home using it. OP is in a hot climate.

 

[jdauria]

I use a mini-dorm fridge to pump cold water (with some glycol mixed in to keep water from freezing) to a cooling jacket around the carboy. I can hold in low 50's to ferment, but really can't use to cold crash or hold at lager temps.

 

[mannye]

I use a mini-dorm fridge to pump cold water (with some glycol mixed in to keep water from freezing) to a cooling jacket around the carboy. I can hold in low 50's to ferment, but really can't use to cold crash or hold at lager temps.

That’s the beauty of the chest freezer. Assuming you have the room, of course. Many people just don’t have space for a big freezer.

But if you do, it can be used to lager, ferment when it’s too hot, serve as a Keezer, you name it. I think the OPsaid he has a garage this can go into but his wife isn’t enamored of the idea of adding more stuff.

the other alternative is to cool the room itself but that is way more expensive.

 

[Jayjay1976]

View attachment 683379
I use two GE freezers hooked into a Johnson Controls A419 temp controller. Literally 5 minutes to set up. Each freezer holds 3 Corny sized kegs (I use Sanke kegs) or one corny and one half as in this one.
View attachment 683380
If you go with a freezer, make sure you also include a fan (mine is kinda just sitting on the water and gas lines. One of these days I’ll mount it) otherwise the temps will vary A LOT from top to bottom. As much as 50 degrees on top and 30 at the bottom. Don’t ask me how I know.
View attachment 683382
this is a close up of the controller. I have it set up for serving temp right now but it can be set to anything from 70F to -30 or something like that. Way colder than you would ever need. Here in Tropical Miami Beach, beer and mead making would be nearly impossible most of the year without a setup like this. A second hand freezer is cheap as chips and the controller costs around 60 bucks I think.

How are you managing the second freezer with just one temp controller? Also, does the fan run only when the compressor kicks on? I know what you mean about the temp variation, looking into adding a fan myself.

 

[SmallScaleOperator]

This may be going in a different direction than you want, but how about fermenting under 15psi with a spunding valve and fining with gelatin upon packaging? I have done a couple lagers now using this method and they have really turned out great. You can build a Spunding valve for like $30 especially if your planning on going the conical fermenter route.

 

[mannye]

How are you managing the second freezer with just one temp controller? Also, does the fan run only when the compressor kicks on? I know what you mean about the temp variation, looking into adding a fan myself.

I don’t . I have a controller on each freezer. The fan runs 24/7. Actually. I think it wouldn’t be as effective if it only kicked in with the compressor.

 

[stealthfixr]

I didn't want to spend the $$$ on a glycol, but after turning over the options for a few weeks, I just pre-ordered the MoreBeer Icemaster 2. While expensive, I am sure it's going to do the job. I may run with the Fermzilla conical instead of a Spike CF-5, as the Fermzilla has a all-covering insultation bag as an option, so better to drop to and hold lagering temps.

 

[Thorrak]

I didn't want to spend the $$$ on a glycol, but after turning over the options for a few weeks, I just pre-ordered the MoreBeer Icemaster 2. While expensive, I am sure it's going to do the job. I may run with the Fermzilla conical instead of a Spike CF-5, as the Fermzilla has a all-covering insultation bag as an option, so better to drop to and hold lagering temps.

When you get it, shoot me a PM - I'd love to get you to pull a noise level off of it.

 

[AJinJacksonville]

As others have said, if $ is a factor (and it usually is for most of us), a chest freezer or fridge with temp control is the most viable option. That being said, the pandemic has put a run on both new and used chest freezers and fridges. I have been keeping on CL for a buddy for chest freezers, and there are way fewer postings than pre-pandemic. Also, most of the big box stores started selling out of freezers when the quarantine happened. I'm serious about brewing, but big bucks on a chiller is not on my horizon...until my chest freezer breaks perhaps...haha.

 

[mannye]

I didn't want to spend the $$$ on a glycol, but after turning over the options for a few weeks, I just pre-ordered the MoreBeer Icemaster 2. While expensive, I am sure it's going to do the job. I may run with the Fermzilla conical instead of a Spike CF-5, as the Fermzilla has a all-covering insultation bag as an option, so better to drop to and hold lagering temps.

you can’t go wrong with that I enjoy DIY as much as the next guy but sometimes a nice compact commercial solution lets us get back to brewing and away from fiddling with equipment.

It’s a lot like audio. It’s easy to get bogged down by tweaking your setup when the whole point is to listen to music.

Of course, convenience comes at a cost. But when all you have to do is click and a few days later you’re making beer or mead or wine it’s all worth it!

 

[bkboiler]

I picked up a side by side on craigslist for $1 and converted it with an inkbird, old johnson controller, 110ac fan, and gravity 4" dryer damper to do lagers, ales and even hot stuff (like saisons and kveiks) with a heating mat...total cost $101 approximately since i bought all the other stuff new...
I can fit my stir plate, 4L flask and 8 gal kegmenter on one side...and maybe even a 3 gal carboy too and a few glasses in the door..
And the cold side holds my serving (3-4 kegs eventually, just 2 right now), previously a freezer.
My energy bills are pretty affordable (since a side by side is more efficient than running two separate compressors, and lifting things into it is easier too...