Tweaking high CaCO3 water for american IPAs?

[Hjandersen]

I recently got around to start looking into brewing water after many of my IPAs had a bit of muddy/harsh bitterness to them (kind of lingering but astringent hoppy/tart taste). Additionally, although not bad beers many of them where a tad similar even though made after completely different recipes.

Here's my local tap water report:

• CaCO3 - 212.39 PPM
• Nitrat - 41 PPM
• Ammonia - 0.02 PPM
• Chloride - 35 PPM
• Chlorine - 0 PPM
• Fluoride - 0,15 PPM
• Iron - 0.01 PPM
• Mangan - 0,005 PPM
• Nitrate - 41 PPM
• Nitrite - 0,0050 PPM
• Phosphor - 0,011 PPM
• Sulfat - 21 PPM

Other parameters:

• Non Volatile Organic Carbon - 0,72 mg/l
• Conductivity at 12°C - 52 mS/m
• pH at 12°C - 7,7 pH

Total microbes:
< 1 no./per 100 ml

For use in IPAs I'd want to decrease my alkalinity and increase my sulfate concentration right? How should I go about it - would boiling the brew water and adding gypsum do that trick?

80 % of what are brew are APAs or AIPAs so for now I'm mainly interested in how to improve my water in that context.

Any comments or advice are welcomed..

 

[Corey_SS]

You probably wanna refer to the beer science forum but I'll give you my opinion as a layman. Since they don't show calcium separately, I'm judging from the CaCO3 that the Ca ppm is ~90ppm. Adding gypsum would give you the sulfates you want but I wonder if you're gonna be pushing your calcium too high that way.

I'm guessing you probably want epsom salt (magnesium sulfate). But again, please take my advice with a grain of salt. There are a lot of guys in the science forum that know what the hell they're talking about.

EDIT: For a frame of reference, I use about 20mL of phosphoric acid (10% strength) in my beer and my water isn't as alkaline as yours. I don't cut my water though, you may look into cutting it with some distilled water or RO water.

 

[Braufessor]

I have very hard water as well. I brew all of my IPA's/APA's with 80% RO water and 20% tap water (for Mash and Sparge). I end up adding about 1 gram of gypsum per gallon and about .2-.3 grams of CaCl per gallon. I make the same additions to mash and sparge water.

In addition, I would say I generally use 2-4 ounces of Acidulated Malt in each batch of this style of beer. Usually brings me in around 5.2-5.3 on pH.

My APA's and IPA's were very harsh, astringent before I started doing this. They are consistently very good now. B'run water is a great tool to dial in your water and keep track from one batch to the next in determining what works best for you. Personally, I like to keep my bicarbonate down in the 60-80ppm range and keep my Sulfate in the 175ppm range with Chloride down around 40-50. Be careful with Epsom Salt - many people recommend against using it. I use some in very small doses from batch to batch (.1 gram per gallon). A number of people feel it is not a great way to add the flavor ions you are shooting for.

+1 on the brewing science forum.

 

[Wynne-R]

Where did you get those numbers? They show a crazy high nitrate level, but then don’t bother to mention calcium, magnesium or sodium. EPA sets max legal nitrate level at 10 ppm. Don’t feed that water to infants.

My guess is that you got a ‘water report’ from somebody trying to scare you into buying a water filter. They left out some numbers so nobody can check to see if they add up; they have to balance or they’re wrong.

If you’re on city water you should be able to get useful information from the water company. The numbers you want are called ‘secondary constituents’ and are not usually on the EPA water report. You can call or email to get it.

If you’re on a well you need a reliable water report. Ward Labs is what most people use.

Your symptoms sound like your water is too alkaline and you will need some treatment, but you need a starting point to figure out what to do. You need alkalinity, calcium, magnesium, chloride, sufate and sodium on your report.

Get a decent water report and post the numbers on Brew Science.

 

[Hjandersen]

Where did you get those numbers? They show a crazy high nitrate level, but then don’t bother to mention calcium, magnesium or sodium. EPA sets max legal nitrate level at 10 ppm. Don’t feed that water to infants.

My guess is that you got a ‘water report’ from somebody trying to scare you into buying a water filter. They left out some numbers so nobody can check to see if they add up; they have to balance or they’re wrong.

If you’re on city water you should be able to get useful information from the water company. The numbers you want are called ‘secondary constituents’ and are not usually on the EPA water report. You can call or email to get it.

If you’re on a well you need a reliable water report. Ward Labs is what most people use.

Your symptoms sound like your water is too alkaline and you will need some treatment, but you need a starting point to figure out what to do. You need alkalinity, calcium, magnesium, chloride, sufate and sodium on your report.

Get a decent water report and post the numbers on Brew Science.

Thanks a lot! - I'll ask my water supplier very politely for info on the "brew-relevant" ions you've listed and post in the brew science subcategory.

Just for the record - I'm from Denmark. These numbers are derived directly from the public water-supplier - they're most definitely not tampered with or meant to scare anyone..
Further more the nitrate max legal limit (in Denmark and the entire EU) is 50 ppm and as far as I know the the "claimed detrimental health effects" has been largely disproven.
Anyways the legal limits differ between "NO3" (50ppm en EU and 44ppm in US) and "NO3-N" (11.3ppm in EU and 10ppm in US) - Correct me if I am wrong?

 

[Hjandersen]

I have very hard water as well. I brew all of my IPA's/APA's with 80% RO water and 20% tap water (for Mash and Sparge). I end up adding about 1 gram of gypsum per gallon and about .2-.3 grams of CaCl per gallon. I make the same additions to mash and sparge water.

In addition, I would say I generally use 2-4 ounces of Acidulated Malt in each batch of this style of beer. Usually brings me in around 5.2-5.3 on pH.

My APA's and IPA's were very harsh, astringent before I started doing this. They are consistently very good now. B'run water is a great tool to dial in your water and keep track from one batch to the next in determining what works best for you. Personally, I like to keep my bicarbonate down in the 60-80ppm range and keep my Sulfate in the 175ppm range with Chloride down around 40-50. Be careful with Epsom Salt - many people recommend against using it. I use some in very small doses from batch to batch (.1 gram per gallon). A number of people feel it is not a great way to add the flavor ions you are shooting for.

+1 on the brewing science forum.

Thanks a lot!

 

[Wynne-R]

You’re right about the NO3-N thing, I missed that.

Amazing that the EPA would be stricter than the EU about anything.

Re the water dept, an email would be easier, but a phone call would be more fun. If everything’s going smoothly, the water dept doesn’t have much to do. They go to meetings and fill out reports. They LOVE to talk about water.

Out of curiosity, are all the beers in Belgium amazing?

 

[Hjandersen]

You’re right about the NO3-N thing, I missed that.

Amazing that the EPA would be stricter than the EU about anything.

Re the water dept, an email would be easier, but a phone call would be more fun. If everything’s going smoothly, the water dept doesn’t have much to do. They go to meetings and fill out reports. They LOVE to talk about water.

Out of curiosity, are all the beers in Belgium amazing?

Yep - that surprised me quite a bit. I think proportionally a larger part of the EU is farmed intensively.

Belgium have insipid beers as well - think Stella and various commercial Krieks

I'd trade my local beer supply of northern European Beers for a good American bottle shop any day (assuming a switch in prices too!)..
Sure my local dealer always have various beers from Cantilion, Westvleteren, Rochefort and Mikkeller - but their prices are beyond what american would believe and the selection of american craft beers is small and expensive..
I recently payed 22,50 kr (just above 4 dollars) for a Sierra Nevada Pale ale.. (1,5 month old).