The Color Of This Beer Is Pale Ale

[Keffa]

So a couple friends and I got together and brewed a beer that was supposed to be a Pale Ale, but turned out to be more IPA like. Since that time, I've been wanting to revisit a Pale Ale, as I love the style.

Started playing around with Beersmith, and this is what I came up with, and granted, not everything is 100% completed, but hey, I'll finalize it when I go to brew it:

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 6.41 gal
Estimated OG: 1.060 SG
Estimated Color: 6.3 SRM
Estimated IBU: 42.0 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 80.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
8 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 80.00 %
12.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 7.50 %
12.0 oz Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 7.50 %
8.0 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 5.00 %
1.00 oz Northern Brewer [9.50 %] (60 min) Hops 32.4 IBU
0.75 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (15 min) Hops 6.8 IBU
1.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
0.75 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (5 min) Hops 2.8 IBU
1.00 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (10 min) (Aroma Steep)Hops -
2.00 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (Dry Hop 14 days) Hops -
1 Pkgs SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04)

Yeast will be in a 1L starter. Mash is 153.


Any suggestions, comments, and opinions are more than welcome. Gotta run this past the other guys first, if it passes their test, we'll brew it, and I'll post the final recipe.

More to follow...

 

[gstrawn]

Personally id go without the wheat but that's just me. Otherwise it looks pretty good. The hop schedule is solid I think. The grain bill is pretty standard to my pale ales also. Pretty good over all I think

 

[BBL_Brewer]

With an OG of 1.060 you should just pitch a pack of S-04 and skip the starter. Most people frown on making starters with dry yeast anyway.

 

[1Mainebrew]

That will be awfully sweet with Maris otter as your base malt and the crystal malt and the gravity.

Why the American citrusy hops and the estery british yeast? Which are you going for? APA or EPA? Hybrid?

You could try a SMaSH pale ale with Vienna malt to like 1.045, hop of choice to like 30 ibu's, and a clean fermenting American yeast like AA 1056- it's simple and delicious. It's a fun malt to work with for pale ales.

1056 is a beast too. If you pitch properly and keep it at 68, you can be from grains to glass in 17 days- 10 day primary, 7 days bottle priming and you're fully carbed, without off flavors. Good procedure and a simple recipe can have some awesome (and quick) results.

 

[Keffa]

Thanks for the info.

Being only my 2nd beer ever (and 2nd AG batch), I can't say I know everything. I'm still learning


FWIW, all the ingredients used are on hand, and the wheat was just to help retention and body along with the Carapils.

 

[Keffa]

That will be awfully sweet with Maris otter as your base malt and the crystal malt and the gravity.

Why the American citrusy hops and the estery british yeast? Which are you going for? APA or EPA? Hybrid?

You could try a SMaSH pale ale with Vienna malt to like 1.045, hop of choice to like 30 ibu's, and a clean fermenting American yeast like AA 1056- it's simple and delicious. It's a fun malt to work with for pale ales.

1056 is a beast too. If you pitch properly and keep it at 68, you can be from grains to glass in 17 days- 10 day primary, 7 days bottle priming and you're fully carbed, without off flavors. Good procedure and a simple recipe can have some awesome (and quick) results.

I think the yeast is what is available without needing to make a 60 mile trek to the LHBS to get a different strain. You don't think the hops would be able to stand up to any sweetness?

 

[Jwood]

to me, it is too much crystal malt for an APA. I am not a fan of a lot of crystal malt in APA's and especially not in IPA's (in fact, usually no crystal malt in an IPA for me).

For my tastes, i go for more of a malty backbone in my APA's. Focusing more on the Vienna/Munich Malts (typically vienna for me), a little bit of victory, some crystal 20-40 (around 5%), with the base malt being just US 2-row.

Then i adjust my mash temp to get where i want FG wise.

Ultimately it is up to your tastes, what you and your buddies like. If you list a couple of APA's you guys REALLY like, maybe we could help you adjust your recipe a bit in that direction.

 

[BBL_Brewer]

He's using 12 oz of 20L. How is that too much crystal?

 

[1Mainebrew]

I just think crystal and MO make for a very sweet beer. Just an observation from my experience. To each their own...

 

[ashplub]

Sounds good to me as is. That is a very hoppy pale ale (4.5 oz of late Cascade) and will not come across as sweet. Brew it as is.

 

[ashplub]

BTW this one will be "IPA like" also. Not that that is a bad thing.

 

[Piratwolf]

I have to agree with lowering the crystal, at least in my taste. When I first went AG, I played with some very simple small batches and found that 5% C60 made for a too-sweet beer in an IPA at 101 IBUs. Granted C20 is much less sweet, but with lower IBUs I would maybe drop the C20 to 5% or less. I guess it depends on your tastes.

 

[Keffa]

Thanks for the suggestions so far. I may tweak it a bit, but I thought it looked pretty tasty

Like I said, going to run it by the other guys and see what they think.

 

[Yooper]

He's using 12 oz of 20L. How is that too much crystal?

Plus 8 ounces of carapils- so the total for crystal malt is over 12%.

I like some crystal sweetness in my APAs, so I'd be inclined to leave it. But I would not use maris otter, I'd definitely use either plain US two-row, or even pilsner malt, so the hops can shine and not be "muddied" with all of that bready malt sweetness.

 

[Keffa]

Plus 8 ounces of carapils- so the total for crystal malt is over 12%.

I like some crystal sweetness in my APAs, so I'd be inclined to leave it. But I would not use maris otter, I'd definitely use either plain US two-row, or even pilsner malt, so the hops can shine and not be "muddied" with all of that bready malt sweetness.

Duly noted, but question on the Carapils, I was under the impression that it didn't add hardly anything in terms of flavor, it was more or less only for head retention and body. When did it become bad to use it with other crystal?

 

[Yooper]

Duly noted, but question on the Carapils, I was under the impression that it didn't add hardly anything in terms of flavor, it was more or less only for head retention and body. When did it become bad to use it with other crystal?

Oh, it's not bad at all! But it IS a crystal malt as well, and I always account for it in the percentages of crystal malt.

I rarely use it, though, as it's redundant if you already have head/foam enhancers in the beer (like wheat, crystal malt, flaked barley). I use it in some beers, like a Bohemian pilsner that is all pilsner malt and carapils, as I don't want the flavor added from other crystal malts.

 

[Keffa]

Oh, it's not bad at all! But it IS a crystal malt as well, and I always account for it in the percentages of crystal malt.

I rarely use it, though, as it's redundant if you already have head/foam enhancers in the beer (like wheat, crystal malt, flaked barley). I use it in some beers, like a Bohemian pilsner that is all pilsner malt and carapils, as I don't want the flavor added from other crystal malts.

Ok, I just wondered.

I tweaked it a bit, everything is the same except:

.5 oz of NB for bittering
Late additions to 1oz each
Dry hop is going to be 1.5oz.
Yeast is going to be US-05 instead of -04 (found out the local place has a fresh shipment of it in stock)

Since I'm already using wheat to help retention/body, would it be smarter to just up the wheat amount and drop the Carapils, or what would you do? And would it be an okay idea to use a 50/50 of 2 row Pale and MO for the base? I know we've got a good bit of MO, but the 2 Row stock is pretty low at the moment, but we might have 3-4 lbs of it for this beer.


Thanks for the suggestions fellas, I appreciate it. Can't learn without trying

 

[BBL_Brewer]

Plus 8 ounces of carapils- so the total for crystal malt is over 12%.

I like some crystal sweetness in my APAs, so I'd be inclined to leave it. But I would not use maris otter, I'd definitely use either plain US two-row, or even pilsner malt, so the hops can shine and not be "muddied" with all of that bready malt sweetness.

That's true, technically carapils is crystal but it really doesn't add any sweetness (which was the primary concern with using too much crystal in this recipe). I really don't think of it and or use it as I would darker crystals. It affects the body and head retention but doesn't do much for flavor. As you said, may be a bit redundant, but certainly not going to make a cloyingly sweet beer combined with 12 oz of 20L.