Summit rhizomes

[jester5120]

Now of course we'll see if it really is in fact a summit. Probably just a cascade, like I need yet another cascade

I wondered about this. Besides wvh the only other company that claims to have them is a little known place in Georgia (barleynvine). How would they get their hands on them if no one else can?

 

[sweetcell]

I wondered about this. Besides wvh the only other company that claims to have them is a little known place in Georgia (barleynvine). How would they get their hands on them if no one else can?

STOP IT JUST STOP IT RIGHT NOW

on a somewhat more serious note, how will we know? i don't think anyone here is going to pay for chemical analysis, let alone DNA analysis.

i'll have a known cascade growing nearby, so i could visually compare the two once they grow, produce cones, etc. if they're different it won't prove it's a summit - would only prove it's not a cascade.

because summit is a patented/protected variety, i don't think anyone has ever seen a summit plant before so we don't know what they look like.

 

[Dougan]

Those of you who got them, when they came, did the packaging say "Sommet rhizomes -- Made In China"?

 

[mux]

Those of you who got them, when they came, did the packaging say "Sommet rhizomes -- Made In China"?

It came with this barcode on it.

 

[sweetcell]

weird - mine were made in north korea. glorious leader took a wild hop and turned it into a summit!

 

[jester5120]

STOP IT JUST STOP IT RIGHT NOW

on a somewhat more serious note, how will we know? i don't think anyone here is going to pay for chemical analysis, let alone DNA analysis.

i'll have a known cascade growing nearby, so i could visually compare the two once they grow, produce cones, etc. if they're different it won't prove it's a summit - would only prove it's not a cascade.

because summit is a patented/protected variety, i don't think anyone has ever seen a summit plant before so we don't know what they look like.

Haha sorry I'm just trying to make myself feel better about not getting any

 

[Randar]

because summit is a patented/protected variety, i don't think anyone has ever seen a summit plant before so we don't know what they look like.

In my own yard? No. But you can probably discern if it is summit in 2-3 years if...
1) It has a semi-dwarf growth habit
2) Hop teas smell like summit
3) acid content is very high in comparison to some known hops

Definitive as a DNA test? No. As close as you'll get? Probably.

 

[mux]

weird - mine were made in north korea. glorious leader took a wild hop and turned it into a summit!

Same communist agenda.

 

[jester5120]

we're building a pretty good story here. we've got conspiracy, scandal, deceit, and of course beer. Now all we need is a murder and some softcore porn and we've got a good novel. I can't say i'd read it, i'd just wait for the movie version. "Hops, a fall to the Summit."

 

[pm5k00]

I just put my Summit rhizomes in the ground monday and one has already poked through the soil. They where big too, bigger around than a nickel and 6 inches long with multiple shoots comming out. The Columbus I got where tiny though.

Did any one else think that the included instruction card was odd in that it said to plant the rhizomes vertical instead of horizontal?

 

[Dougan]

Different places say different things, I've heard both.

 

[sweetcell]

Haha sorry I'm just trying to make myself feel better about not getting any

oh, i know for my part, i'm trying to not worry about the mold that formed on my summits before i planted them. it formed because they were kept damp and without air circulation in the fridge. i cleaned them up and then planted them - where they will be damp and without air circulation. ugh. hopefully the mold will be eaten by other microorganisms in the soil, or the warmer temps will help. and if they don't make it, i'll jump on your they-weren't-summits-anyways band-wagon

Definitive as a DNA test? No. As close as you'll get? Probably.

actually, it's just occurred to me that my brother-in-law does DNA-level research on cancer. maybe i could convince him to sequence some summit hops from the store (i.e. a known sample), then compare it to what i'm growing... humm...

 

[sweetcell]

I just put my Summit rhizomes in the ground monday and one has already poked through the soil. They where big too, bigger around than a nickel and 6 inches long with multiple shoots comming out. The Columbus I got where tiny though.

my summit 'zomes were pretty small, disappointingly so. 3-4 inches long, definitely thinner than a permanent marker (more like a thick ball-point pen, or a smallish piece of asparagus). i planted on saturday and have been away on biz travel all week. i'll be back home tomorrow - fingers crossed that i can report some bines poking out too.

 

[Dougan]

I know my dad's 3rd year hops haven't shown any green yet, I went over and checked on them today. That's in Wisconsin, though. But we've been having southern temperatures all month so we shouldn't be too far behind you this year, if at all.

 

[Tangelo]

I was lucky enough to get one early from wvh. Planted in a pot a week and a half ago. She's nearly 20" now.
I live in zone 5 so I'm waiting a bit before getting her planted in the yard.

 

[bob1852]

we're building a pretty good story here. we've got conspiracy, scandal, deceit, and of course beer. Now all we need is a murder and some softcore porn and we've got a good novel. I can't say i'd read it, i'd just wait for the movie version. "Hops, a fall to the Summit."

Don't forget communists. We just need Nazi's and we've reached Godwin's law.

 

[Paulasaurus]

I just put my Summit rhizomes in the ground monday and one has already poked through the soil. They where big too, bigger around than a nickel and 6 inches long with multiple shoots comming out. The Columbus I got where tiny though.

Did any one else think that the included instruction card was odd in that it said to plant the rhizomes vertical instead of horizontal?

Mine came exactly the same, diameter was huge. MIne only had one bine about 1" long on it but it shot through the soil days after it was in the ground. I planted mine horizontal, not that it matters though.

 

[jester5120]

In the email i got from WVH they said since they couldn't legally send summit they'd give me double the rhizomes of my choice of varieties. I originally ordered summit 4 rhizomes. They sent me the 8 that i requested plus an extra 5 of some other varieties. Pretty decent of them.

 

[hitecgmblr]

where do commercial growers get their rhizomes?

 

[sweetcell]

8 days in the ground and no signs of life yet. ugh. how long did other folks' rhizomes take to poke up shoots?

between my 'zomes small size and the mold, i'm still a little afraid they won't pull through. i'll give them another week in hopes that they're just having a slow start. i know, i know... RDWHAHB.

besides, they weren't even real summits, right? :cross:

 

[Paulasaurus]

8 days in the ground and no signs of life yet. ugh. how long did other folks' rhizomes take to poke up shoots?

between my 'zomes small size and the mold, i'm afraid they won't pull through. i'll give them another week in hopes that they're just having a slow start.

besides, they weren't even real summits, right? :cross:

My rhizome came with a 1" white bine and was 2" above soil in a couple days and here it is a week later. I don't have any recent pictures but its currently about 1' tall and leaves are finally starting to fold out.

But of course this is just a Cascade

 

[B-Hoppy]

I've seen quite a bit of variability in the time it takes for rhizomes to begin sprouting but never really paid that much attention because they'll eventually come up. I think it may have to do with the location from where they were cut on the rhizome. Kinda think that the cuttings from closer to the crown will take a little longer to come out of dormancy (only a postulation). Go have a beer and check next week.

 

[Paulasaurus]

I've seen quite a bit of variability in the time it takes for rhizomes to begin sprouting but never really paid that much attention because they'll eventually come up. I think it may have to do with the location from where they were cut on the rhizome. Kinda think that the cuttings from closer to the crown will take a little longer to come out of dormancy (only a postulation). Go have a beer and check next week.

Very well said, I had never thought about where the rhizome came from in relation to the crown and time it takes to develop but that makes sense from what i've seen in my recent hands on experiences.

Agree with let it be and check in a week or two.

 

[Dougan]

Agreed, some of the ones we planted a year or two ago came up the next day, some took a few weeks. The ones that took a few weeks didn't grow large that year but on year 2 they were fully ready.

I think it all has to do with the size of the rhizome... you had said yours was smaller, right? If it's smaller, it's not going to get nutrients as quickly. So I would expect those to take longer than other rhizomes. Although I'm far from an expert.

 

[wrench]

My rhizomes were on the smaller side and still haven't poked through the surface. But the weather here has gotten chilly again, which could also be playing a part. All my other hops were already in the ground when we had 10+ days of well above average temps. The Summit went in the ground just as that was ending, so I expect them to lag quite a bit.

 

[sweetcell]

thanks guys. between your assurances that such delays are normal, and a little searching here which revealed that mold on the rhizomes isn't a big deal, i'm feeling a lot better. i wish i was at home so i could have a homebrew, for now i'll just have to relax without one (and grab a Duvel tonight at the hotel).

 

[Dougan]

No problem. It's not unheard of for a hop rhizome to not sprout but it's pretty unlikely that they both wouldn't make it. Even if you screwed up I'm sure at least one of them will make it through unscathed.

 

[Dougan]

thanks guys. between your assurances that such delays are normal, and a little searching here which revealed that mold on the rhizomes isn't a big deal, i'm feeling a lot better. i wish i was at home so i could have a homebrew, for now i'll just have to relax without one (and grab a Duvel tonight at the hotel).

Sounds like you are on the road a lot. If you need someone to take care of your beer while you are gone, let me know.

 

[sweetcell]

I'm sure at least one of them will make it through unscathed.

that's certainly my hope: if at least one makes it through, i can harvest a rhizome for the other site. plus, i wanna be able to hook up others here who didn't get a crack at ordering before the kibosh came down. summit for all!

Sounds like you are on the road a lot. If you need someone to take care of your beer while you are gone, let me know.

yeah, i travel every week for work. gets old fast. it means that i can only brew or do anything homebrew-related on weekends. luckily beer can take care of itself and does well with extended periods of not being disturbed, but i do thank you for your offer of help

 

[jester5120]

that's certainly my hope: if at least one makes it through, i can harvest a rhizome for the other site. plus, i wanna be able to hook up others here who didn't get a crack at ordering before the kibosh came down. summit for all!

you're a good man sweetcell

 

[pm5k00]

^^^ I was thinking the same thing... my dog ate the growth tip of one of my summit plants today, so that was annoying, I'll be putting a fence around them very soon (I am aware hop flowers are toxic to some dogs).

 

[Dougan]

(I am aware hop flowers are toxic to some dogs).

I read the first few words and was all excited to tell you that you had opened a can of worms. We may never know the bandwidth you saved by adding this disclaimer.

 

[Paulasaurus]

Summit/Cascade as of yesterday. About 1' tall now. Contemplating transplanting it into the hop garden but afraid to move it at this point so it may spend its first year in a pot.

 

[Randar]

Summit/Cascade as of yesterday. About 1' tall now. Contemplating transplanting it into the hop garden but afraid to move it at this point so it may spend its first year in a pot.

Don't move it unless you want to risk breaking any/all growth nodes at this point.

 

[Paulasaurus]

Don't move it unless you want to risk breaking any/all growth nodes at this point.

I've been going back and forth on whether to transplant it or not being that the only reason its in a pot is because I just moved and had to get it in dirt while at the old house so I opted for a large pot. At this point i'll be leaving it in the pot and growing up to my deck instead of in the hop garden. I'll transplant it early next year.

Thanks for the concern, its been on my mind lately.

 

[lurker18]

Are the hops police going to come knocking on the doors of anyone who bought the rhizomes already?

"No, no... those aren't hops. That's oregano!"

Not trying to be the downer or support big brother, but yes they could. It has happened before by the big companies, and they will do everything they can to get what is thiers back.

Google Percy Schmieser, all about Monsanto vs Percy, and him using their product without permission (Roundup Ready Canola).

It seems that only a few people got "lucky" here and got the rhizomes before the error was discovered, and I assume the WVH has pretty good records of where they went, so if the patent holder of Summit wants to push it far enough, you just might be getting a knock on your door. Hope it doesn't happen to anyone here.

 

[pm5k00]

It seems that only a few people got "lucky" here and got the rhizomes before the error was discovered, and I assume the WVH has pretty good records of where they went, so if the patent holder of Summit wants to push it far enough, you just might be getting a knock on your door. Hope it doesn't happen to anyone here.

I have 7 other varieties growing so They will be getting something else if they come to my house.

 

[lurker18]

Very easy for them to figure it out. At work, we have a DNA code for every variety of grain ever registered, and we can figure out what what variety a seed is in less than a day. All they would need is a leaf from each plant, and they could figure out what you have. Really not that difficult.
Every grain boat that leaves the port, random samples, and anything that "looks funny" are DNA checked for unregistered varieties, so this happens every day at work.

 

[jester5120]

All summit rhizomes should be grown in a protective custody garden. If the hops cops come lie and tell them they were ****ty rhizomes and didn't grow.

but seriously I don't think it would ever get to that, atleast i hope not. Monsanto seems to want a monopoly over their seeds and plants. the hop growers seem to just want us to wait till we can grow them.

 

[lurker18]

I hope it doesn't get to that as well. I could use a new variety to try out every couple of years.