Sulphite/sorbate oops

[primerib]

Here’s one for you. Any advice is, as always, greatly appreciated.

Racked my country wine (5 gallons of danger Dave’s dragons blood) to a new carboy and added the K meta and K sorbate, appropriately dosed, at the end, mixed in with a little bit of extra wine I had set aside. I should have just poured it in the carboy first. Unfortunately it was up to the neck, and when I went to gently stir it in, the stir stick displaced about a cup of wine from the top of the carboy onto the counter.

I really don’t know how much of the kmeta/sorbate had already dispersed through the wine vs. how much ended up on the counter, and as such I am assuming it may have been underdosed.

Wanting to sweeten before bottling, I feel I have 2 options at this point and wanted to see what advice anybody might have.

1. Proceed as planned, clearing with sparkalloid, sweetening to taste, then checking gravity and monitoring for obvious signs of refermentation over a couple weeks/rechecking gravity to make sure it remains stable before bottling.

2. Redosing Kmeta/sorbate? Perhaps someone could recommend an additional “safety dose” I could safely add which wouldn’t likely have an effect on taste?

Thanks!

 

[Squeegee]

I would split the batch. Dose half again with an amount that doesn’t surpass ppm limits of sulfite and sulfate content, when accounting for your previous addition. Tricky situation.

 

[Squeegee]

If I was in a production situation and had a tap room, I would just keg that **** and serve. Sparkling wine.

 

[RPh_Guy]

What amount of each did you add?
Did you also use sulfite before fermentation?

I have some other ideas...

Measure the sulfite level and adjust if needed.
https://***************.com/wiki/SO2_testing

You can add sodium benzoate on top of the sorbate.

I would definitely recommend waiting to make sure it is stable before bottling in this case.

 

[primerib]

Thanks for the ideas! To the 5 gallon batch I added 1/4 tsp potassium metabisulphite and 3 tsp of potassium sorbate. Obviously unsure of how much of each dose actually made it into the wine.

I did not use sulphite before fermentation, which I realize is not the norm when working with fresh/frozen fruit, but was working from an anecdotally tried and true recipe from winemakingtalk so decided to skip it.

And yes, I will be absolutely sure it is stable before bottling, even if it means having to bottle dry or use a nonfermentable sweetener (the latter of which I’m not particularly crazy about) I’ll look into the testing, I’m not familiar with it and whether it’s a particularly costly or complex route.

 

[primerib]

If I chose to go the sodium benzoate route, would another addition of the 1/4 tsp of Kmeta likely have a perceptible impact on the taste/smell of the wine?

 

[RPh_Guy]

For best results you'll want to get a scale that can measure 0.01g, because measuring spoons aren't so great for this.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07PHLL1LG

If I chose to go the sodium benzoate route, would another addition of the 1/4 tsp of Kmeta likely have a perceptible impact on the taste/smell of the wine?

Sulfite dosage is dependent on pH, so a pH meter would be extremely useful.
Without knowing the pH we don't know whether the wine is successfully stabilized, or what level might contribute an off-aroma.

 

[primerib]

Thank you for the advice, I appreciate it. Measuring acidity/sulphite content seems at the moment a bit daunting and above my ability/equipment level for this very simple and cheap wine.

I think that initially I may take the simplest road and proceed as though it is stabilized and once clear, sweeten according to original plans, then monitor for at least a couple weeks before even considering bottling. If fermentation occurs again, I will accept the bump in alcohol and re-evaluate my plan.

Good learning experience and to be sure, a lesson in being precise and accurate.

 

[ETLMT]

For best results you'll want to get a scale that can measure 0.01g, because measuring spoons aren't so great for this.
Amazon.com: Brifit Digital Kitchen Scale, 500g/ 0.01g Mini Pocket Jewelry Scale, Cooking Food Scale with Back-Lit LCD Display, 2 Trays, 6 Units, Auto Off, Tare, PCS Function, Stainless Steel, Black: Kitchen & Dining



Sulfite dosage is dependent on pH, so a pH meter would be extremely useful.
Without knowing the pH we don't know whether the wine is successfully stabilized, or what level might contribute an off-aroma.

Hello Master of Preservatives!

I am making Kombucha and just starting to sell it. Between COVID and a 130mph windstorm that went through the area it is hard to gauge how quickly my customers will go through the 5+ gallons that I sell them, so I am thinking until I know the flow of sales I want to add some preservatives, but eventually I will stop.

I read somewhere that sodium benzoate would be the best to use for kombucha, but now I cannot find the article again and I do not know how to gauge how much to put in.

Can you tell me how to calculate the dosage for Sodium benzoate based on the volume and the pH?

Is Sorbic Acid the way I really want to go?

 

[ShadesManna]

Hello Master of Preservatives!

I am making Kombucha ....

You might have better luck in the Kombucha section of the Forums:

Kombucha & Fermented Tea Forum

The specifics might be different between wine and kombucha.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Hello Master of Preservatives!

I am making Kombucha and just starting to sell it. Between COVID and a 130mph windstorm that went through the area it is hard to gauge how quickly my customers will go through the 5+ gallons that I sell them, so I am thinking until I know the flow of sales I want to add some preservatives, but eventually I will stop.

I read somewhere that sodium benzoate would be the best to use for kombucha, but now I cannot find the article again and I do not know how to gauge how much to put in.

Can you tell me how to calculate the dosage for Sodium benzoate based on the volume and the pH?

Is Sorbic Acid the way I really want to go?

Generally sodium benzoate used is at a rate of 0.1% (the legal limit in many countries), which means 0.1 g per 100mL. You need to refer to your country's regulations about food additives. I think that benzoate is probably a better choice than sorbate. In either case you need to remove the vast majority of yeast from the kombucha before stabilization. The pH of the kombucha should be low enough that you don't need to worry about it.

Cheers