Stuck Mash

[Mike COusineau]

So I just brewed my first batch last weekend and have a couple of questions:

1) I made a rookie mistake and had my mash tun on the ground, added water and then started to stir in the grain. About 30 minutes into the mash, I remembered I need to have it on my shelf in which I had to grab the mash tun and walk up 6 steps and goofed again and had to go back down the steps 10 min later as the shelf was too high, in which I believe at that time grain got under the FB. So when it was time to drain the wort nothing came out.
Tried to stick a metal rod in the tube but still nothing, ended up having to empty the wort into another cooler with and go from there.

So do you all believe that was the main cause to why it was stuck?

2) Its been 72 hours since I moved the wort into the fermentation bucket, and was getting one small burp every 10 seconds at the 48 hour mark but now I am getting nothing. I have read about the lid not being sealed, but I do have a very small layer of Krausen ..should I be worried or just wait it out until 7 days and test the SG?

 

[brewbama]

1) Hard to say. You could have jostled it around so much to compacted the grain bed.

How fine was your crush? So fine as to make an impenetrable mass? If so, loosen your mill setting to allow wort to flow through the bed.

How much did you stir? Enough to compact the grain bed? Don’t stir so much to keep the grain bed loose and permeable.

2) Wait a few days and ck SG. The best way to determine ferment progress is to measure gravity.

 

[Mike COusineau]

1) Hard to say. You could have jostled it around so much to compacted the grain bed.

How fine was your crush? So fine as to make an impenetrable mass? If so, loosen your mill setting to allow wort to flow through the bed.

How much did you stir? Enough to compact the grain bed? Don’t stir so much to keep the grain bed loose and permeable.

2) Wait a few days and ck SG. The best way to determine ferment progress is to measure gravity.

I got the grain milled at our local brew store, so I am assuming its a standard crush size???
As far as stirring, I stirred it really good when combining the water and grain, and again at the 30 minute mark prior to trucking it up and down the steps. On my next batch, should I just eliminate the stirring half way through the mash?

 

[kh54s10]

What was the recipe? Some grains are very "sticky" Wheat and rye are a couple of them. If you use them add a handful or two of rice hulls.
I would say that the grain bed got compacted. Stirring then another vorlauf will often work. Blowing into the valve can sometimes loosen grain around the exit.
Some cite a good increase in efficiency when stirring midway through the mash. I have not seen that, so I don't stir.

Your fermentation is probably not related to the stuck mash. Slow bubbling is one of two things. 1) co2 is escaping somewhere, 2) not enough co2 is being produced to make the bubbling rapid. Neither should be a problem. You can take a reading at day 7, but even then you might not be at FG. 10 days is common for the first reading. I wait at least til day 14. It is almost always done by then.

 

[Mike COusineau]

What was the recipe? Some grains are very "sticky" Wheat and rye are a couple of them. If you use them add a handful or two of rice hulls.
I would say that the grain bed got compacted. Stirring then another vorlauf will often work. Blowing into the valve can sometimes loosen grain around the exit.
Some cite a good increase in efficiency when stirring midway through the mash. I have not seen that, so I don't stir.

Your fermentation is probably not related to the stuck mash. Slow bubbling is one of two things. 1) co2 is escaping somewhere, 2) not enough co2 is being produced to make the bubbling rapid. Neither should be a problem. You can take a reading at day 7, but even then you might not be at FG. 10 days is common for the first reading. I wait at least til day 14. It is almost always done by then.

It was a Belgian Ale.

Grains/Fermentables
9 lbs (4.08 kg) Belgian Pilsner 2-Row (2 °L)
2 lbs (0.91 kg) Munich Malt (9 °L)
After Boil
4 oz (113.4 g) Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0 °L)
Hops
1 oz (28.35 g) Tettnanger 4.4% AA (Boil - 60 mins)
0.5 oz (14.17 g) Spalter 5.55% AA (Boil - 15 mins)
Yeast
Belgian Golden Ale Yeast (Whitelabs WLP570) (Liquid)

I was thinking it was not a big deal about the bubbles, but just trying to understand why it happened. Will be taking a FG around the 10 day mark like you mentioned.

TIA

 

[brewbama]

Nothing odd about that recipe and shops traditionally do not fine grind.

 

[Mike COusineau]

Nothing odd about that recipe and shops traditionally do not fine grind.

That's what I was thinking, only assuming moving around the mash tun ruined the grain bed and got grain under the FB.

THanks for all the helps guys

 

[brewbama]

I agree. Cheers.

 

[Mike COusineau]

After 96 hours this is what the beer looks like, seems to be getting a nice layer of krausen. Around what day is average to see the layer start to settle for a blonde ale?

 

[kh54s10]

After 96 hours this is what the beer looks like, seems to be getting a nice layer of krausen. Around what day is average to see the layer start to settle for a blonde ale?

I don't think there really is an average that is a useful number. There are so many factors that will change things.
Recipe
Method of brewing
Yeast choice
Yeast pitch rate
Yeast health
Added nutrients
Fermentation temperature
Other...

Close that up and leave it alone until day 10 or longer. I do 14 days minimum.
Each time you open your fermenter you risk contamination and you will introduce oxygen into the fermenter, which is bad after the fermentation begins to slow.

 

[bucketnative]

When you opened the valve on your mash to drain the wort, did you do it slowly or did you just open it very quickly? I tend to open it very slowly (just a trickle at first). This allows the grain bed to settle on it's own rather than getting sucked to the bottom with a whoosh of liquid. Also, you said nothing came out... do you really mean nothing? I have had a couple of stuck mashes over the years, and "something" usually starts flowing before it really gets stuck. What is your set up?

 

[Mike COusineau]

When you opened the valve on your mash to drain the wort, did you do it slowly or did you just open it very quickly? I tend to open it very slowly (just a trickle at first). This allows the grain bed to settle on it's own rather than getting sucked to the bottom with a whoosh of liquid. Also, you said nothing came out... do you really mean nothing? I have had a couple of stuck mashes over the years, and "something" usually starts flowing before it really gets stuck. What is your set up?

Hey there,

So absolutely nothing came out. I am using a 10 gallon mash tun with a 12 inch false bottom. When I opened it initially I went extremely slow, nothing came out....then try and to open fast and close a couple of time to see if that would help but nothing.


Again I believe that its because I had moved the mash tun twice during the 60 min mash out time period.

 

[Mike COusineau]

I don't think there really is an average that is a useful number. There are so many factors that will change things.
Recipe
Method of brewing
Yeast choice
Yeast pitch rate
Yeast health
Added nutrients
Fermentation temperature
Other...

Close that up and leave it alone until day 10 or longer. I do 14 days minimum.
Each time you open your fermenter you risk contamination and you will introduce oxygen into the fermenter, which is bad after the fermentation begins to slow.

Closed up and will take a look at it around Day 14. TIA

 

[BrewInspector]

Just totally disregard the airlock.

It is a comforting sight to see bubbles but all to often unwarranted concern arises when few or no bubbling occurs.

Fermentation varies from batch to batch, recipe to recipe, yeast to yeast. Some start slow, some appear to end quickly. Give it time but don't get stuck on a predetermined schedule, use a hydrometer if you want to know for sure when fermentation is complete.

 

[brewbama]

Yeah, you’re fermenting so leave to do its business. Grain wants to become wort and wort wants to become beer. It’s a gift. If you keep opening it you can cause problems.

 

[Mike COusineau]

Yeah, you’re fermenting so leave to do its business. Grain wants to become wort and wort wants to become beer. It’s a gift. If you keep opening it you can cause problems.

Thanks Brewbama, opening it around Day 14 to check FG.

 

[JaymzMF]

A couple brew days ago, I had my first stuck mash. I ended up pumping back into the mashtun valve. Had to go forward, reverse, forward, reverse a couple times to get it unstuck. If you don't have a pump, I'd imagine it would work manually?

 

[Batteman87]

Seems like your wort is turning into beer so thats good. I'd agree with the rest, leave it be now that you know its doing its thing.

In regards to the mash and moving it. In the past, I have had to move my full tun around for whatever reason (ground to table and back again.). When I have done this, I have not had an issue with grain sticking from under the false bottom. I did allow a period of time to allow it to settle once moved around.

Initial questions/thoughts on why nothing came out.
1. Did you have the lid open / cracked when you opened your valve to allow for some flow.
2. How fast did you open the valve? If you do this quickly, you will likely get a sucking effect and the grain bed will prevent any flow. I recommend doing it very slowly with proper venting.
3. Do you have a mash paddle long enough to reach the bottom of the MT? Might use it to move the grain around on the bottom while the valve is open. If your battle isn't long enough, you could use a broom handle today around and maybe open the flow.
4. Once flowing and grains coming out w/ the new wort, I would recommend collecting the first runnings in a bucket and gently put back onto the grain bed until the runnings are clear. My other piece of advice to shave some time is to add a sieve onto the top of the bucked or kettle to catch the grains that are coming out initially until the wort runs clear.

Hope some of this helps. Either way, sounds like you made some beer. Hiccups will happen. But you learned!
Cheers!

 

[Soulshine2]

So I just brewed my first batch last weekend and have a couple of questions:

1) I made a rookie mistake and had my mash tun on the ground, added water and then started to stir in the grain. About 30 minutes into the mash, I remembered I need to have it on my shelf in which I had to grab the mash tun and walk up 6 steps and goofed again and had to go back down the steps 10 min later as the shelf was too high, in which I believe at that time grain got under the FB. So when it was time to drain the wort nothing came out.
Tried to stick a metal rod in the tube but still nothing, ended up having to empty the wort into another cooler with and go from there.

So do you all believe that was the main cause to why it was stuck?

2) Its been 72 hours since I moved the wort into the fermentation bucket, and was getting one small burp every 10 seconds at the 48 hour mark but now I am getting nothing. I have read about the lid not being sealed, but I do have a very small layer of Krausen ..should I be worried or just wait it out until 7 days and test the SG?

without knowing your grain bill its hard to say why it stuck...too fine of a crush , too much flour.
Before your next brew I would suggest building a brew cart or a dedicated brew set up that your kettles and mash tun are positioned in relation to one another so youre not hauling a hot filled tun of mash up and down 6 steps. do a "dry run" without grains, just unheated water , so you can see how it flows and drains from one to the other consecutive vessel. also if youre planning a 3 vessel rig , you're going to need a chiller or some sort. get one figured out so youre not trying to figure it out on brew day . Preparation.

 

[Soulshine2]

Hey there,

So absolutely nothing came out. I am using a 10 gallon mash tun with a 12 inch false bottom. When I opened it initially I went extremely slow, nothing came out....then try and to open fast and close a couple of time to see if that would help but nothing.


Again I believe that its because I had moved the mash tun twice during the 60 min mash out time period.

do you have a bazooka tube in it? do you use a hose or tubing at t he valve? blow into the tubing to unstick it. restir and allow to settle ,then just crack the valve to allow it to lauter without a lot of suction of the grains clogging the bazooka tube. Next time use rice hulls or widen your mill gap.

 

[Mike COusineau]

do you have a bazooka tube in it? do you use a hose or tubing at t he valve? blow into the tubing to unstick it. restir and allow to settle ,then just crack the valve to allow it to lauter without a lot of suction of the grains clogging the bazooka tube. Next time use rice hulls or widen your mill gap.

Thanks for your response, since this post i have brewed 2 batches with no stuck sparge. And the reason it got stuck was because I moved the mash tun cooler up and down stairs twice in which it lodged grain under the FB.