Storingchilled keg at room temp help...

[zephed666]

I'm sure this has been asked before so forgive if it's redundant...

I keep my kegerator at about 40 degrees and it holds two kegs. I just kegged a third one and want to remove one of the kegs from the kegerator since the two in there are both the same beer. I have a few questions about that...

1 - I just pull it out and leave at room temp ~72 degrees with no CO2 connected?
2 - Should I leave the CO2 connected to it - I do have another tank and regulator.
3 -I can store it in my extra fridge but it would have to be on it's side. Would that be bad to store that way fro about 2 weeks?

Thanks for any help!!!

 

[Elkobrewer]

As long as there is no leak and your keg holds co2 psi it will be fine to pull it out and leave it a room temp.

 

[55x11]

I would choose 1. Assuming it's fully Carbed. The problem with #2 is that you won't carb it unless you apply like 50 psi and you could lose carbonation. You can serve it that warm anyways. So no reason to connect to CO2. The keg should hold it carbed.

Finally. No real problem with 3 either. But you probably can't serve from it so it just takes space. I like to keep keg warmer if you are not serving the beer to allow for more conditioning. Assuming it's not above 70-75F.

 

[zephed666]

I would choose 1. Assuming it's fully Carbed. The problem with #2 is that you won't carb it unless you apply like 50 psi and you could lose carbonation. You can serve it that warm anyways. So no reason to connect to CO2. The keg should hold it carbed.

Finally. No real problem with 3 either. But you probably can't serve from it so it just takes space. I like to keep keg warmer if you are not serving the beer to allow for more conditioning. Assuming it's not above 70-75F.

The beer is fully carbed now, just needed space. I don't plan on serving on it's side just wanted to make sure with storage...

It was carbed at 10-12 psi in my kegerator. So it's okay at room temp? no need to add more pressure since the beer is already carbed?

 

[55x11]

The beer is fully carbed now, just needed space. I don't plan on serving on it's side just wanted to make sure with storage...

It was carbed at 10-12 psi in my kegerator. So it's okay at room temp? no need to add more pressure since the beer is already carbed?

I do this all the time, including current (I have only room for 7 kegs and extra kegs of beer have to stay outside the fridge once carbed).

Carbing to 10-12 psi at what I assume is about 40F or so is perfect. That should give you 2.5 volumes or so.

When you take the sealed, carbonated keg out of 40F and warm it up to say 65F or 70F, the solubility of CO2 in water/beer will decrease by a factor of 2-2.5. So now some CO2 will drop out of solution until head pressure is more like 30 psi. So if your keg is leaking, for example you may want to connect CO2 to the keg and now you have to apply 30 or more PSI just to keep it carbed at the same level. But if your keg is sealed, don't do anything - it's just wasting CO2. When you put it back into the fridge and temperature goes back to 40F, all CO2 that left the beer will dissolve into the beer again and you will be at the same carbonation state you starter from.

One small difference - at warmer temperatures beer will "condition" itself much much faster. So some bad flavors will disappear and normally you will get a better tasting beer (except beers like IPA or HeFe which should be drank quickly). On the flip side, keeping beer very cold clears it out faster - but you shouldn't shake or move the keg, ideally, so tipping it on the side defeats that purpose. So my best advice is to warm up your carbed beer, condition it for a few days or weeks or whatever. then make it cold again, let it clear for a bit and then serve it. Should be the best beer you can ever get.

 

[makisupapolice14]

There's no need to purge with co2 before storing at room temp correct? I have a stout that should be fully carbonated by this wed. I've tried a few samples so far and carbonation is almost there. Do I just disconnect the gas and put in the basement?

 

[zephed666]

There's no need to purge with co2 before storing at room temp correct? I have a stout that should be fully carbonated by this wed. I've tried a few samples so far and carbonation is almost there. Do I just disconnect the gas and put in the basement?

From what everyone told me and from what I did I just disconnected the CO2 when it was fully carbed and stored it.
I'll be drinking it this weekend so I'll let you know how it is...
It's only been two weeks at room temp though...

 

[makisupapolice14]

Ok great keep me posted mine should be around 2-3 weeks also

 

[zephed666]

Ok great keep me posted mine should be around 2-3 weeks also

Tasted great. No worries at all!
Just need to get more kegs now so I can store more!

 

[SGTSparty]

Tasted great. No worries at all!
Just need to get more kegs now so I can store more!

Quick question on this as I have yet to do it. I'm assuming (and everyone correct me if I'm wrong here) that if fully carbed at serving temp, then removed from the kegerator to room/cellar temp that some of the CO2 would come out of solution into the head space since the amount of CO2 that will dissolve into a liquid is temp dependent. So my question is how long did it take for that CO2 to go back into solution once you put it back in the ice box? Or if you weren't sampling how long did you leave it before you started drinking it and was it once again fully carbed?

 

[55x11]

Quick question on this as I have yet to do it. I'm assuming (and everyone correct me if I'm wrong here) that if fully carbed at serving temp, then removed from the kegerator to room/cellar temp that some of the CO2 would come out of solution into the head space since the amount of CO2 that will dissolve into a liquid is temp dependent. So my question is how long did it take for that CO2 to go back into solution once you put it back in the ice box? Or if you weren't sampling how long did you leave it before you started drinking it and was it once again fully carbed?

If the keg is full, it will not be noticeable. The amount desorbed from CO2 that goes into headspace will be relatively small.

lets say your headspace is 10% of the keg and beer is 90% of the keg. (4.5G of beer, 0.5G of headspace) - at 10psi, 40F, at 2.5 volumes.
This means you have 10+15=25psi of CO2 in the headspace, for about 1.66 volumes (10% volume) and 2.5 CO2 volumes at 90% of the volume.

That's 88g of CO2 in beer and 6g of CO2 in headspace (so most of CO2 is in the beer).

If you warm the beer to 70F, the pressure goes up to 35 psi for 2.5 volumes (using carbonation chart), or 50 psi in absolute units. So it doubles the amount of CO2 in headspace, to about 12g of CO2, leaving 82g of CO2 in the beer. (I neglect the expansion of the beer which will now occupy slightly more than 4.5 Galons, and the fact that pressure increases with temperature at constant volume - both effects, if corrected, will lead to slightly *less* CO2 in headspace at higher temperature).

So bottom line, even at room temperature, your keg (if mostly full) will still remain carbed to >2.3 volumes, losing less than 10% of CO2 to headspace.
So reabsorbing is not much of an issue.

If the keg is mostly empty, the math changes quite a bit though. For example, if the keg is 40% full, so you have 2G of beer and 3G of headspace, you will have about 40g of CO2 in the beer and 64g of CO2 in headspace - which means warming it up will dissolve almost all CO2 into the headspace.

 

[SGTSparty]

If the keg is full, it will not be noticeable. The amount desorbed from CO2 that goes into headspace will be relatively small.

lets say your headspace is 10% of the keg and beer is 90% of the keg. (4.5G of beer, 0.5G of headspace) - at 10psi, 40F, at 2.5 volumes.
This means you have 10+15=25psi of CO2 in the headspace, for about 1.66 volumes (10% volume) and 2.5 CO2 volumes at 90% of the volume.

That's 88g of CO2 in beer and 6g of CO2 in headspace (so most of CO2 is in the beer).

If you warm the beer to 70F, the pressure goes up to 35 psi for 2.5 volumes (using carbonation chart), or 50 psi in absolute units. So it doubles the amount of CO2 in headspace, to about 12g of CO2, leaving 82g of CO2 in the beer. (I neglect the expansion of the beer which will now occupy slightly more than 4.5 Galons, and the fact that pressure increases with temperature at constant volume - both effects, if corrected, will lead to slightly *less* CO2 in headspace at higher temperature).

So bottom line, even at room temperature, your keg (if mostly full) will still remain carbed to >2.3 volumes, losing less than 10% of CO2 to headspace.
So reabsorbing is not much of an issue.

If the keg is mostly empty, the math changes quite a bit though. For example, if the keg is 40% full, so you have 2G of beer and 3G of headspace, you will have about 40g of CO2 in the beer and 64g of CO2 in headspace - which means warming it up will dissolve almost all CO2 into the headspace.

Wow. I'm gunna be honest, I did not follow all that math first pass but I if I'm understanding correctly since the CO2 wants to be in equilibrium and there is very little head space, it will take less CO2 coming out of solution in the beer to build up the pressure in that small head space to the equilibrium point. End result being a small amount of CO2 coming out of the beer, probably not that noticeable.

Thanks for the info, that's really interesting and good to know.

 

[55x11]

Wow. I'm gunna be honest, I did not follow all that math first pass but I if I'm understanding correctly since the CO2 wants to be in equilibrium and there is very little head space, it will take less CO2 coming out of solution in the beer to build up the pressure in that small head space to the equilibrium point. End result being a small amount of CO2 coming out of the beer, probably not that noticeable.

Thanks for the info, that's really interesting and good to know.

Yes, you got the gist of it!

At 2.5 volumes and say 40F or below the liquid actually contains almost double amount of CO2 as compared to headspace, per volume.
At room temperature the headspace can double the CO2 content, basically making it equal to liquid content.

When headspace is small, the CO2 stored there and additional amount that goes into headspace from warming is actually quite negligible.