S33 ringwood?

[Jloewe]

Simple question. I heard on apartment brewer s33 was ringwood and in fact not a Belgian yeast. The second part I’ve seen many post it’s English so I’ll accept that easily. But is it really ringwood? Because I’m making a shipyard clone and my local(ish) brew store closed and now it’s a 45 min drive or ice packs and hoping people k live with don’t leave it out while I’m at work…. I was also thinking either Windsor or London Ale from lallemond.

Thanks

 

[tjensen3618]

It's the Edme strain, I dont really have any frame of reference for what that really means, because I never used the original.
It tends to get a bad wrap in homebrew forums, but I use it in my Hoppy Amber and really like it. It has no traditional Belgian characteristics.

 

[D.B.Moody]

S33 is the Edme strain. I started brewing in 1994, and I used to use Edme yeast. Edme quit selling malt extract and then quit selling the yeast. When Fermentis first started selling S33, it was identified as the Edme strain, and I started using it. I still use it. I particularly like it in dark ales. It is an English yeast.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

I have only used S-33 once that I recall. That was in a split batch of Pale Ale split with US-05 and S-33. I thought that S-33 made a nice Pale Ale with a little more sweetness and body with what I detected as some apricot notes. While I like the US-05 version better, some of my homebrew club friends liked the S-33 version better. I don't really have a reference for Edme or Ringwood.

 

[hotbeer]

S-33 doesn't attenuate as much as US-05. In the high ABV craze maybe that's why some badmouth it. However for the lower ABV IPA I just brewed it seemed to do fine.

If I'd used the US-05 that I've been using for the prior six to ten batches, I probably would have gotten a lower SG resulting in a little bit more ABV. But that wasn't the desired result of this last batch.

 

[Protos]

I wonder why Fermentis chose to mislabel S-33 as severely as suggesting it's a "Belgian" yeast.
It's a wonderful low-attenuating classic English yeast which has a lot of styles to shine in, styles where you need a lower attenuation of 67-70%.
I think the bad rap for this yeast comes from those mislead by the weird "Belgian" advertising, who inevitably failed to attain any kind of Belgian flavour with this yeast.

Mentioning EDME pedigree may tell little to those who picked up the hobby recently (me, f.ex., I don't know what did EDME yeast taste like back in the 1980s and 1990s, I never drank anything with it, I actually rarely drank beer at all, preferring Rum or Wodka, MUCH of friggin Rum or Wodka ).

Mangrove Jack's M10 Workhorse and Lalbrew London are essentially the same strain as S-33, so those two yeasts are the closest reference when it comes to describe S-33. S-33 is better than those two, in my humble opinion.

 

[hotbeer]

I wonder why Fermentis chose to mislabel S-33 as severely as suggesting it's a "Belgian" yeast.

I don't see where they say it's a Belgian yeast. They do suggest it might be good for Belgian Ales.

So if one thinks it's a true Belgian yeast from that, then I'd just think they are mistaken.

 

[D.B.Moody]

Mentioning EDME pedigree may tell little to those who picked up the hobby recently (me, f.ex., I don't know what did EDME yeast taste like back in the 1980s and 1990s

Edme (S33) is very closely related to Muntons. Both are lower on attenuation and floculation compared to something like Nottingham. They leave more mouth feel and maltiness. They are not as neutral a Nottingham, and I think S33 might produce a little more flavor/esters than Muntons, but I won't swear to it. I use S33 in my stout, my porter and one of my browns. I don't specify Muntions in any recipe, but I use it some times in my bitters and pales.

I don't do liquid yeast, so I've never used Ringwood. I gather it's closely related to White Labs 005 British Ale, but I've never used that either. That also doesn't help pick a dry yeast closest to Ringwood.

I did find this chart that suggests that S33 is the closest dry yeast to Ringwood, or Ringwood itself. So, @Jloewe, maybe S33 is the way to go.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

I don't see where they say it's a Belgian yeast. They do suggest it might be good for Belgian Ales.

The statement "Ideal for Belgian Ales (Blond, Dubbel, Tripel, Quadrupel Styles)" just seems so wrong. I just cannot imagine how sweet and thick a Tripel or Quad made with S-33 would turn out. I am also not sure about the "...and strong English ales (ex. Imperial Stouts)." As far as "It is also ideal for New England IPAs." I have been wanting to use it in a Hazy Pale Ale where I think it would do well. I am not so sure about using it in a 1.075+ OG NEIPA.

To me, S-33 seems like a very good choice for lower ABV English/UK styles. If S-33 is the same or similar to London...well the description from Lallemand on London Ale is MUCH different than what Fermentis says about S-33 and is much more in line with how I would use S-33:

LalBrew London™ is a true English ale strain selected for its ability to produce authentic, traditional UK beer styles. Fermentation performance is fast and consistent producing moderate esters and lower attenuation due to an inability to metabolize maltotriose. LalBrew London™ is one of the original Heritage Strains selected from the Lallemand Yeast Culture Collection when Lallemand Brewing was founded in 1992. A more subdued yeast character allows the flavors and aromas of malt and hops to shine through in styles such as Extra Special Bitter Pale Ale, Bitter and Mild. LalBrew London™ may also be used in the production of Ciders.

 

[jtgoral]

https://fermentis.com/en/product/safale-s-33/

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Simple question. I heard on apartment brewer s33 was ringwood and in fact not a Belgian yeast. The second part I’ve seen many post it’s English so I’ll accept that easily. But is it really ringwood? Because I’m making a shipyard clone and my local(ish) brew store closed and now it’s a 45 min drive or ice packs and hoping people k live with don’t leave it out while I’m at work…. I was also thinking either Windsor or London Ale from lallemond.

We now have DNA sequences for a lot of the common yeast strains so we know for certain that S-33, Muntons ordinary and Windsor are nothing to do with Ringwood but in fact form their own little subgroup in the "Mixed" group at 10 o'clock on this family tree :
https://beer.suregork.com/?p=4112
This group look like they all share a common ancestor with the EDME yeast, and both Lallemand London and T-58 are close cousins as well.

From a genetic perspective, S-04 and BE-256 are the closest dry yeasts to Ringwood - but genetic proximity is not everything, your closest relatives include your mother and sister but you don't necessarily look like them!

 

[Slim M]

We now have DNA sequences for a lot of the common yeast strains so we know for certain that S-33, Muntons ordinary and Windsor are nothing to do with Ringwood but in fact form their own little subgroup in the "Mixed" group at 10 o'clock on this family tree :
https://beer.suregork.com/?p=4112
This group look like they all share a common ancestor with the EDME yeast, and both Lallemand London and T-58 are close cousins as well.

From a genetic perspective, S-04 and BE-256 are the closest dry yeasts to Ringwood - but genetic proximity is not everything, your closest relatives include your mother and sister but you don't necessarily look like them!

I did not see Coopers dry yeast on the chart but I might have overlooked it. I’ve been told the big pack of Coopers is not the same as the small ones that used to come in the kits and big 15g packs are actually repackaged Muntons. Makes since but never seen it confirmed.

Did use the big Coopers once and it was a prolific fermenter blowing the lid of a brew pail. Found the lid on the other side of the room. Hit fg in 3 days at 68-70 degrees. At the time I was thinking it must be the strain Coopers used in sparkling ale, I’ve since realized it’s not but it made a good sparkling ale.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

I did not see Coopers dry yeast on the chart but I might have overlooked it. I’ve been told the big pack of Coopers is not the same as the small ones that used to come in the kits and big 15g packs are actually repackaged Muntons.

There's no sequence for Coopers in the public domain AFAIAA, but somebody posted extensively about the various Cooper yeasts in the comments to one of the earlier genome posts on Suregork's blog. I can't remember the detail, but no, the homebrew yeasts are nothing to do with the brewery yeast.

Also you've got to be careful to distinguish between the ordinary Munton which is a low-attenuation EDME descendant (ie S-33/Windsor-like) and Munton Gold which is higher attenuation and probably a derivative/cousin of Nottingham.

 

[Slim M]

There's no sequence for Coopers in the public domain AFAIAA, but somebody posted extensively about the various Cooper yeasts in the comments to one of the earlier genome posts on Suregork's blog. I can't remember the detail, but no, the homebrew yeasts are nothing to do with the brewery yeast.

Also you've got to be careful to distinguish between the ordinary Munton which is a low-attenuation EDME descendant (ie S-33/Windsor-like) and Munton Gold which is higher attenuation and probably a derivative/cousin of Nottingham.

Whatever was in it the big gold 15 gram pack labeled Coopers yeast wasn’t messing around. The fermentation pace & rigor reminded me of my experience with dried Lutra. I looked back at my notes from 12 years ago when I used it and it was kegged from primary on day 7 on tap on day 14 and apparently I felt it was a good Aussie style sparkler according to my notes.