PC Fan for Ferm Chamber

[AQUILAS]

So on Monday afternoon, I set my ferm chamber to cold crash my blonde ale at 38F, coming down from 72F. Tuesday morning, the temperature was hitting just about 50F. Thought to myself that it seemed like it took a long time to drop down just 20 degrees. Then I figured, it may have been because there's no air circulation to spread the cold air around the chamber. I ended up finding our old PC tower, took the fan out of it, and found a 12v adapter. I hooked the two up and it worked just fine. Stuck it to a wall inside my ferm chamber and it seemed to help drop the temp a bit quicker.

Anyways, this morning before leaving for work, I check the chamber and the fan had stopped working. It couldn't have been the wiring since it worked from the start and it can't be the outlet it was plugged into as it was the same outlet my temp controller was plugged into. I'd hate to think it's simply that the fan has just died.

Anybody have any idea?

Here's a picture of the fan and the adapter I used

 

[Homercidal]

Take it out and test directly into the wall (using adapter of course...)

And FYI those fans fail very often. If it's got a few years on it, it's a crap shoot.

Normally you can just smell the spindle area and smell smoke. You might carefully peel the sticker off the spindle and lift the rubber stopper covering the shaft and see if it's really dark colored and smell for smoke. Generally you'll hear the thing making noise for a while before it fails, but it's possible that it got overloaded and cooked the circuit rather than getting bound up over time and overheating.

 

[Homercidal]

Take it out and test directly into the wall (using adapter of course...)

And FYI those fans fail very often. If it's got a few years on it, it's a crap shoot.

Normally you can just smell the spindle area and smell smoke. You might carefully peel the sticker off the spindle and lift the rubber stopper covering the shaft and see if it's really dark colored and smell for smoke. Generally you'll hear the thing making noise for a while before it fails, but it's possible that it got overloaded and cooked the circuit rather than getting bound up over time and overheating.

 

[Takuie]

look at your power supply again. Your fan is 12 DC, your supply was 12v AC.

the fan is cooked. toss it and get either a new one. Make sure that the output of the adapter matches volts, has more amps and that the flavor of power match each other (AC vs DC)

 

[PlexVector]

So on Monday afternoon, I set my ferm chamber to cold crash my blonde ale at 38F, coming down from 72F. Tuesday morning, the temperature was hitting just about 50F. Thought to myself that it seemed like it took a long time to drop down just 20 degrees. Then I figured, it may have been because there's no air circulation to spread the cold air around the chamber. I ended up finding our old PC tower, took the fan out of it, and found a 12v adapter. I hooked the two up and it worked just fine. Stuck it to a wall inside my ferm chamber and it seemed to help drop the temp a bit quicker.

Anyways, this morning before leaving for work, I check the chamber and the fan had stopped working. It couldn't have been the wiring since it worked from the start and it can't be the outlet it was plugged into as it was the same outlet my temp controller was plugged into. I'd hate to think it's simply that the fan has just died.

Anybody have any idea?

What type of ferm chamber do you have? If its a chest freezer with controller then its probably not air circulation.

 

[brandondrury]

You may have over-worked your power supply. If the resistance of the fan is low, then you are going to pull serious current from that power supply. That's what I'd check first.

According to this (http://www.blackfiveservices.co.uk/fanspeed.shtml ) the resistance of a fan is 60 ohms. Using Ohm's Law V = I * R, so 12V = I * 60. That works out to 5A of current. I'd be shocked if you made it over night with that. I suspect that power supply was VERY hot.

Another thing, I see your power supply is AC, but the fan is asking for DC. I can't remember the details on that one. We did it in college 15 years ago. I'd definitely put a DC power supply there.

I think you've got 2 options.
1) You can get a fan speed controller on Ebay. (I bought one for a stir plate last month for $7) That will take care of all the electronics mumbo jumbo with a computer fan although you can count on it not running quite as fast as it did in your initial setup.

2) You can just find a tiny little fan that plugs into the wall. In our 8-bucket fermenter temp box we've got a little 3-4" fan that my buddy had that plugs directly into the wall. Amazon has one for $8.

Lastly, it does take a LONG time to get the temp down in a fermenter if you've got any thermal mass at all. 5 gallons of wort takes quite a bit of power to yank down just 5 degrees in most instances particularly when you are relying on cold air to drop the temp of the box. (I'm theorizing a mist in my head for the same reason that 40 degrees feels a LOT colder when it's raining, but I'm still working out the details on that one.)

Also, be hyper careful of leaks in your temp box. Leaks are murderous in this situation.

Brandon

 

[PlexVector]

look at your power supply again. Your fan is 12 DC, your supply was 12v AC.

the fan is cooked. toss it and get either a new one. Make sure that the output of the adapter matches volts, has more amps and that the flavor of power match each other (AC vs DC)

Good catch! I looked at the voltage and current and skimmed right past the "AC".

The fan may have heated up, but it was in a relatively cool environment. May be worth a try with a proper DC supply...

 

[AQUILAS]

Take it out and test directly into the wall (using adapter of course...)

And FYI those fans fail very often. If it's got a few years on it, it's a crap shoot.

Normally you can just smell the spindle area and smell smoke. You might carefully peel the sticker off the spindle and lift the rubber stopper covering the shaft and see if it's really dark colored and smell for smoke. Generally you'll hear the thing making noise for a while before it fails, but it's possible that it got overloaded and cooked the circuit rather than getting bound up over time and overheating.

Takuie below noted that the fan has more than likely fried since the power supply is AC and the fan was DC. But age probably did play a factor as it did come from a computer that was very, very, very old. I took the sticker off and smelled for any smoke smell, but nothing.

look at your power supply again. Your fan is 12 DC, your supply was 12v AC.

the fan is cooked. toss it and get either a new one. Make sure that the output of the adapter matches volts, has more amps and that the flavor of power match each other (AC vs DC)

Ahhh dammit. You're right. Okay, looks like I'm on the hunt for another set up.

What type of ferm chamber do you have? If its a chest freezer with controller then its probably not air circulation.

It's a mini-fridge. Fits a single 6.5 gal ferm bucket with airlock.

 

[JordanKnudson]

Ahhh dammit. You're right. Okay, looks like I'm on the hunt for another set up.

Why a whole new setup? You can replace that fan and get the right adaptor at any electronics store all for a couple bucks.

 

[govner1]

Go to Wally World and pick up one of their small (6"-7") fans. They come with a base or a clamp for mounting. I paid about $8 each for a couple & they've been great. The one in male chamber runs constantly & I hooked up the one in my lager chamber to come on w/ the freezer compressor.

 

[AQUILAS]

Why a whole new setup? You can replace that fan and get the right adaptor at any electronics store all for a couple bucks.

Ooo that's what I meant. Haha. Just a new fan and an appropriate adapter for it. I'm probaby gonna head to a thrift store on my lunch break and see if I can find anything there.

Go to Wally World and pick up one of their small (6"-7") fans. They come with a base or a clamp for mounting. I paid about $8 each for a couple & they've been great. The one in male chamber runs constantly & I hooked up the one in my lager chamber to come on w/ the freezer compressor.

Ahh right on. I'll check my local wal mart after work for it! Thanks!

 

[AQUILAS]

The fan may have heated up, but it was in a relatively cool environment. May be worth a try with a proper DC supply...

I'm hoping for this to be the case. There's a thrift store near my work and I'm going there on my lunch break to see if I can find a 12v DC adapter.

 

[PlexVector]

I'm hoping for this to be the case. There's a thrift store near my work and I'm going there on my lunch break to see if I can find a 12v DC adapter.

I have dozens of wall warts from years of toys, cell phones, hubs, switches, routers, lap tops, electronic gadgets, etc. Never threw any of them away, so usually I just dig around until I find one close.

 

[PlexVector]

It's a mini-fridge. Fits a single 6.5 gal ferm bucket with airlock.

I would think you would not need a fan, although it will help.

Check the following:

I assume you're using a temp controller, so verify the "fridge thermostat" is set for coldest setting. if twisted to the coldest setting then back off a little, they can be a little weird at the stops. Also, the fridge thermostat may not let it go that low, in which case you need to bypass it or wire the compressor directly to your temp controller.

If the ice tray chamber is frozen over. the ice will insulate the chamber from the evaporator and make it less efficient.

Check for leaks in the door seal. Stick a flash light inside and see if you see light coming out anywhere.

Where is the temp probe? tape it to the side of the fermentor with some insulation material so it is only measuring the fermentor. A coozy will work. There are some great discussion of this on HBT and google.

The fridge is under powered for that mass and temperature, and will take longer to pull the temp down.

The compressor is toast and/or low Freon, or the voltage from the wall receptacle is low or you have it on a long underrated extension cord. check the voltage at the fridge plug while the compressor is running.

Any of the above.
All of the above.
None of the above.

 

[Homercidal]

look at your power supply again. Your fan is 12 DC, your supply was 12v AC.

the fan is cooked. toss it and get either a new one. Make sure that the output of the adapter matches volts, has more amps and that the flavor of power match each other (AC vs DC)

Wow, can't believe I missed that! I rarely see a 12V wall wort like that.

Yeah, that thing is history. Thankfully case fans are a dime a dozen. I have a Bunch and starting sending them with the PCs when I recycle them these days.

Hit up any computer repair store nearby and see if they have any. I bet those geeks probably have a hundred in the parts bins.

 

[AQUILAS]

I have dozens of wall warts from years of toys, cell phones, hubs, switches, routers, lap tops, electronic gadgets, etc. Never threw any of them away, so usually I just dig around until I find one close.

Haha yeah. I'm not quite sure where this wall wart came from. I just started scavenging around the house and it was the first 12V I saw. I didn't even bother to think about the AC/AC of it.

I would think you would not need a fan, although it will help.

Check the following:

I assume you're using a temp controller, so verify the "fridge thermostat" is set for coldest setting. if twisted to the coldest setting then back off a little, they can be a little weird at the stops. Also, the fridge thermostat may not let it go that low, in which case you need to bypass it or wire the compressor directly to your temp controller.

If the ice tray chamber is frozen over. the ice will insulate the chamber from the evaporator and make it less efficient.

Check for leaks in the door seal. Stick a flash light inside and see if you see light coming out anywhere.

Where is the temp probe? tape it to the side of the fermentor with some insulation material so it is only measuring the fermentor. A coozy will work. There are some great discussion of this on HBT and google.

The fridge is under powered for that mass and temperature, and will take longer to pull the temp down.

The compressor is toast and/or low Freon, or the voltage from the wall receptacle is low or you have it on a long underrated extension cord. check the voltage at the fridge plug while the compressor is running.

Any of the above.
All of the above.
None of the above.

I'll check the fridge thermostat. If I remember correctly, I remember setting it to the coldest setting after I had finished wiring my ITC1000. But I'll check when I get home.

Leaks. I bet I have leaks in the door seal due to the cords running out. I'll have to find a way to fix that.

As far as the compressor being toast, dear all that is mighty, I hope not. I got the fridge for free from my girlfriend's work as they were moving offices and I'd rather not have to buy a new one. Haha. But if that be the case, so be it. I'm see if my dad might have a voltmeter I could borrow to check.

Wow, can't believe I missed that! I rarely see a 12V wall wort like that.

Yeah, that thing is history. Thankfully case fans are a dime a dozen. I have a Bunch and starting sending them with the PCs when I recycle them these days.

Hit up any computer repair store nearby and see if they have any. I bet those geeks probably have a hundred in the parts bins.

I'll have to check a computer store. Might even see if our IT department might have some that they wouldn't mind 'tossing'.

 

[Beernik]

What I did was wire a PC fan to a disused UBS phone charging cable and then plugged it into a cheap charging block.

 

[Brian77095]

Sorry for the hijack... but, if he puts a fan in: Should it be set to run all the time? 24/7 or could it be on a timer to say run every 30 minutes for 30 minutes?

I have see threads were they set the fan to come on ever time the compressor comes on but seems like that would let the temp get warmer in area. Is that not and issue because you are putting the temp sensor next to or against the carboy?

thanks! OP sorry for the loss of your fan but at least that is a cheap and easy fix. If by chance the worst has happend and you lost the compressor. Start hunting craigs list. It might take a while but you can certainly find something to fit your needs for 50 bucks or less. I got a freezer for 40 bucks. Looks like hell but works great.

 

[Spartan1979]

Why not just use a 120V fan?

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B009OWRMZ6/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

[Beernik]

The way I have my ferm chamber set up (and upright freezer) is with a 120 v desk fan in the bottom constantly blowing upwards and a panel of 3 computer fans in the top constantly blowing downwards. I keep fairly uniform temperatures throughout my ferm chamber this way.

I have occasionally run it with only the computer fans. The ferm chamber gets thermally stratified and the top is about 5F warmer (heat source is at the top) than at the bottom.

 

[day_trippr]

It doesn't take much air movement to equalize the temperature inside a typical fridge or freezer.
I have a 120mm 12V fan running on 9V in my 13cf keezer and there is virtually no difference between the probe at the floor in one corner and the probe perched atop the keg in the diagonally opposite corner...



I run that fan at 9V because that's all it needs to do its job, and the less thermal energy input, the lower the compressor duty cycle (and that plot shows my keezer's running around 20%)...

Cheers!

 

[AQUILAS]

Thanks for everyone's suggestions and concerns!

Just an update, I was at my girlfriend's parents over the weekend and I saw that they had a computer tower sitting outside, by their shed. Apparently, it's been there for years, and the fan was still in it. Her parents let me take the fan out. We literally just got home a a few minutes ago and I stripped the wires and connected it to this 12v DC fan I bought at a thrift store and the fan still works! Now it's sitting in its new home =]