Oats causing poor head retention ?

[jfr1111]

I have a oatmeal stout on tap right now and it is amazing. The only problem is that altough the beer will pour with a good tight head, it dies down to a ring in about a minute and it leaves no lacing. Carbonation is medium low, but is enough to insure that there will be some foam, as is evident by the initial pour.

The same glass with my pale ale in it will have lacing right to the bottom of the glass and the foam doesn't dissipate, so that means it isn't the glass, but the beer itself.

The beer has around 2 pounds of oats (about 18%), a pound of wheat malt and a pound of caramel type malt, so head retention shouldn't be a problem, but it is.

Could the oily nature of the oats kill the head retention ? If so, I would be tempted to do a token dry hop with something like EKG since dry hopping can enhance foam stability.

 

[TasunkaWitko]

I always thought that oats would go a long way to improve head retention, but I could be wrong.

My guess (and that's all that it is) is that you're cleaning equipment with dish soap along the way, which I have read will pretty much destroy any hopes for head retention.

I would suggest (if you're not already) cleaning equipment and bottles with OxyClean and rinsing very thoroughly - twice - with very hot water.

 

[BrewMeister49]

I have always thought oats are awesome for head. I would venture to say it was more something to do with mash temp/time?

 

[cyanmonkey]

Yes, it could be the oats. They contain lipids that can kill head retention and you have quite a lot of it in your recipe.

 

[jfr1111]

I always thought that oats would go a long way to improve head retention, but I could be wrong.

My guess (and that's all that it is) is that you're cleaning equipment with dish soap along the way, which I have read will pretty much destroy any hopes for head retention.

I would suggest (if you're not already) cleaning equipment and bottles with OxyClean and rinsing very thoroughly - twice - with very hot water.

No soap touches anything. This beer was kegged, not bottled.

 

[jfr1111]

I have always thought oats are awesome for head. I would venture to say it was more something to do with mash temp/time?

Mash was 152F for 75 minutes, which is my standard mash temp for everything these days apart from some special beers (saisons, strong ales, etc.). The pale ale got the same mash regimen.

 

[jfr1111]

Yes, it could be the oats. They contain lipids that can kill head retention and you have quite a lot of it in your recipe.

That's what I thought. The beer has a silkyand full mouthfeel (almost oily). I will try to add (more) adjuncts that promote head retention for the next iteration since I don't want to reduce the amount of oats.

 

[jrcrilly]

My oatmeal stout is also in the keg, was also mashed at 152 degrees, is also well carbonated, and also has terrible head retention. It used only one pound of flaked oats. The recipe came from the LHBS. It will be a while before this keg empties, but some time before it does I want to try again but improve this factor.

8 lbs Pale Ale
.75 lbs Black Roast Barley
1 lb Flaked Oats
.25 lb Chocolate
.50 lb Crystal
.13 lb Black Malt

Sadly, I doubled this up and made ten gallons so I also have two cases of bottles with no head retention.

 

[jfr1111]

My oatmeal stout is also in the keg, was also mashed at 152 degrees, is also well carbonated, and also has terrible head retention. It used only one pound of flaked oats. The recipe came from the LHBS. It will be a while before this keg empties, but some time before it does I want to try again but improve this factor.

Did you use brewer's oats or just regular grocery store flaked oats ? I used a fresh bag of instant oats from the store since they cost basically nothing, but maybe (altough I doubt it) the stuff made for brewers is different and has less fat content ?

Sorry to hear the beer isn't what you hoped it would be. Mine is still very, very good though (it uses far more chocolate than what you posted, and has no black malt).

 

[jrcrilly]

The stout tastes OK (and is improving by the day). It's just the head retention is irritating. The flaked oats came from the same LHBS as the recipe. Some day, when I'm in a really good mood, I'm going to give them a call and talk to the recipe guy to see what to change next time.

 

[MaxStout]

I've made a few oatmeal stouts, none of which had an appreciable amount of head retention. I think I used about 1/2 lb. in a 5 gal. batch. Next time I might sub a pound or two of wheat malt for some of the pale, to see if that might boost the head.

 

[Algonzo]

Anecdotal evidence: I've found also that when I go over a certain point with oats that I have the same issue as you - head rapidly dissipates. Some of my brews:

10/2.1% = magnificent thick head, long retention & clumpy lacing
12/3% = large head, near immediate dissipation to nothing
13/4% = large head, near immediate dissipation to nothing

I'm currently conditioning another ale the same as the 12/3% except without the oats to see if I get a better head. Note my % after the slash is the weight of the oats compared to the weight of the wort being fermented.

 

[henchman24]

Oats can hurt head retention. I usually beef up the head with some carapils, flaked barley, and/or some wheat to compensate nowdays when I'm using oats. 18% oats would likely kill the head retention.

 

[Yooper]

That's what I thought. The beer has a silkyand full mouthfeel (almost oily). I will try to add (more) adjuncts that promote head retention for the next iteration since I don't want to reduce the amount of oats.

I always wonder about head retention when I read other homebrewers suggest adding oats for head retention- it tends to kill foam retention.

It's got a silky creamy mouthfeel to it- almost "slick" and even oily when large amounts are used, so I love oats for that, but not for head retention.

Instead of reducing the oats, in the next batch try adding 1/2-1 pound of flaked barley. It helps keep a rocky dense head. It's not used very often in lighter colored beers because it creates a haze- but in a stout that's fine since you won't see it.

flaked barley is my "secret ingredient" in my stouts and other dark beers. It's even better than wheat in this case.

 

[jfr1111]

I always wonder about head retention when I read other homebrewers suggest adding oats for head retention- it tends to kill foam retention.

It's got a silky creamy mouthfeel to it- almost "slick" and even oily when large amounts are used, so I love oats for that, but not for head retention.

Instead of reducing the oats, in the next batch try adding 1/2-1 pound of flaked barley. It helps keep a rocky dense head. It's not used very often in lighter colored beers because it creates a haze- but in a stout that's fine since you won't see it.

flaked barley is my "secret ingredient" in my stouts and other dark beers. It's even better than wheat in this case.

I feel the beer is 90% there, with head retention and a bit of "something else" missing. The suggestion of flaked barley is a good one, but I feel a pound might not be enough, from my foray into dry stouts. I'll sub the pound of wheat and some base malt for a pound and half of flaked barley and half a pound of victory or biscuit for complexity.

 

[Queequeg]

Torrified wheat provides the best head ime.