numbers on OG off

[walker111]

Brewed my 49 th batch in under 2 years . Never was off this much. Goose IPA clone double batch.
OG calls for 1.065. I got 1.05!!!!!!
Boiled some DME and cooled and added to the 2 carboys but time will tell.
I noticed when I bought my grain at LBS that some of the malts looked bigger and very little white powder( opened grains) inside compared to normal.
Possible that the grain was not milled properly to leave the numbers off so much?????

I have had great success with kits, BIAB, and now 20 plus of all grain and have brewed this beer a few times and always on the mark.

thoughts?

 

[ccous]

Sounds like a poor crush

 

[GPP33]

I’ve certainly received poor crushes from the LHBS, also had them completely miss adding certain grains. I always double check the crush quality before leaving, peer over their shoulder as they weigh and double check the full weight when I get home.

 

[RM-MN]

So somebody adjusted the mill to make a coarser crush and you noticed the difference in the look and now that you have mashed you noticed the difference in the efficiency by measuring a different than expected OG. Now you have to decide what to do about it. You can complain to the LHBS or you can get control of the crush by purchasing a mill of your own.

 

[WBB]

What should an optimal grain crush look like? I picked up the cereal killer and crush my own grains now. I set the rollers so a credit card can go up and down easily in the rollers, but maybe not the right setting?

I brewed a made up recipe recently that called for an OG of 1.070 and got 1.063 measured by a refractor.

 

[harry_the_face]

I was going to say to test the calibration on your hydrometer because I have had the paper slide down inside mine before and screw up the readings, but it looks like you are using a refractor so make sure it is calibrated.

 

[walker111]

Thanks all. I email the shop for my grain orders and the owner is top notch. I have had a few grain bills where there was an issue but it seems it was always when one of his part time staff did the milling. Never off like this and I am never there to see the crush. I did do one crush myself with the owner present for help.
Possible on the hydrometer calibration.

For 25 pounds of grain there was not as much fine open crush as I expected so assuming this is the issue. I am not going to complain to them as things happen and that is not my style. I just wanted to ask members here if this issue is the probable cause. I know there are lots of factors at hand. Hey......... it will still make a nice beer in the end .........I hope!!!!

 

[GPP33]

Absolutely not worth complaining about, just double check before you leave the shop in the future. I have had them double crush for me when it’s not to my liking, it’s never an issue.

 

[kh54s10]

Seems like you have been brewing long enough that it is time to purchase a mill and take that variability out of your brew sessions. You can then buy grains in bulk and save some money in the process.

 

[wepeeler]

I also recommend getting a mill. You seem super serious about brewing, so why not? I picked up the cereal killer, and it's made a world of difference. Not to mention, it's just fun to crush your own grain!

 

[GPP33]

I also recommend getting a mill. You seem super serious about brewing, so why not? I picked up the cereal killer, and it's made a world of difference. Not to mention, it's just fun to crush your own grain!

The "why not" for me is it's probably $150-$200 I don't need to spend then have to store and maintain the mill. I get the best price on bulk grains from my LHBS and he already has the mill. I go there to get the other grains anyway since buying bulk grains that are used in small qtys just doesn't make sense. I've thought a lot about it and it'd be fun but I have neither the space nor the money burning a hole in my pocket to do it. If I didn't have two great LHBS (one where I can mill them myself if I feel so inclined) within 10 minutes and I was ordering on line then it'd be a no brainier.

 

[wepeeler]

The "why not" for me is it's probably $150-$200 I don't need to spend then have to store and maintain the mill. I get the best price on bulk grains from my LHBS and he already has the mill. I go there to get the other grains anyway since buying bulk grains that are used in small qtys just doesn't make sense. I've thought a lot about it and it'd be fun but I have neither the space nor the money burning a hole in my pocket to do it. If I didn't have two great LHBS (one where I can mill them myself if I feel so inclined) within 10 minutes and I was ordering on line then it'd be a no brainier.

I spent $100 at Home Brew Adventures with free shipping. Just seems like a variable you can control, especially if you're not getting a consistent crush from your LHBS. You can forever spend more and more money on this hobby, so I understand not wanting to invest more. Just saying it's made a big difference for me, personally.

 

[walker111]

Thanks all again. Have been thinking about a mill myself for some time. The $ is worth it but still not sure if I want to go that route .

 

[GPP33]

I spent $100 at Home Brew Adventures with free shipping. Just seems like a variable you can control, especially if you're not getting a consistent crush from your LHBS. You can forever spend more and more money on this hobby, so I understand not wanting to invest more. Just saying it's made a big difference for me, personally.

The problem is I wouldn’t stop at just the base hand crank on a 5 gal bucket unit. It’d be motorized on a VFD with a touch screen hooked up to a PLC and stepper motors to control the gap based resistance or grain crack frequency or something equally as crazy. All sitting on a nice oak cabinet. I’ll probably get one at some point but with access to two locally where I buy my grains it definitely falls into the “nice to have” category.

Just providing a perspective from someone who doesn’t think a mill is necessary, everyone’s case will obviously be different.

 

[RM-MN]

Thanks all. I email the shop for my grain orders and the owner is top notch. I have had a few grain bills where there was an issue but it seems it was always when one of his part time staff did the milling. Never off like this and I am never there to see the crush. I did do one crush myself with the owner present for help.
Possible on the hydrometer calibration.

For 25 pounds of grain there was not as much fine open crush as I expected so assuming this is the issue. I am not going to complain to them as things happen and that is not my style. I just wanted to ask members here if this issue is the probable cause. I know there are lots of factors at hand. Hey......... it will still make a nice beer in the end .........I hope!!!!

When you make beer several times and then have one batch with much lower than expected OG, crush is the most likely culprit. Most LHBS will have their mill set coarse enough that most people won't have a stuck mash or sparge. If you have your own mill you can adjust it to your system, experimenting with the setting to get the highest efficiency without problems draining the mash tun. However, if you cannot just leave the mill alone and not try to automate everything about it, then it is probably best to let someone else own the mill.

 

[WBB]

I was going to say to test the calibration on your hydrometer because I have had the paper slide down inside mine before and screw up the readings, but it looks like you are using a refractor so make sure it is calibrated.

Yup calibrated it when I first got it with distilled water. This is the first in used it in the wild.

 

[WBB]

So what should an optimal crush look like? I have my own mill and I crushed after calibrating the rollers with a credit card. Looks like the rollers are just a tad over .025.

I wonder if I should go finer?

 

[RM-MN]

So what should an optimal crush look like? I have my own mill and I crushed after calibrating the rollers with a credit card. Looks like the rollers are just a tad over .025.

I wonder if I should go finer?

Did you have any trouble getting the mash to drain? How about the sparge, did it come out easily? I you had no trouble with either, tighten the mill. Then tighten it some more. When you get a stuck mash or sparge, you know you went just a little too far.

 

[kh54s10]

So what should an optimal crush look like? I have my own mill and I crushed after calibrating the rollers with a credit card. Looks like the rollers are just a tad over .025.

I wonder if I should go finer?

It depends largely on your style of brewing. Fly sparging relies on intact husks to allow the sparge water to move pretty freely through the grain bed. So it requires a coarser crush. Batch sparging is a little more forgiving, so a bit finer crush is doable. BIAB with sparging can handle an even finer crush and no sparge BIAB can handle a very fine crush.

If you have your own mill you can experiment and find a sweet spot. If you sparge tighten things a little over a few brews until sparging gets slow. Then back off a little.

 

[WBB]

Did you have any trouble getting the mash to drain? How about the sparge, did it come out easily? I you had no trouble with either, tighten the mill. Then tighten it some more. When you get a stuck mash or sparge, you know you went just a little too far.

Now that you mention it, I was right on the cusp of getting a stuck mash. I was draining the first runnings and it started dribbling out and when I looked in the cooler, there was still a little more water to drain. I dumped in the sparge water and stirred and heard a gurgle when I stirred up right above the false bottom. Almost like the grains were plugging up the holes in the false bottom. The sparge drain went fine.

I had 14lbs of grain using 1.5qts/lb for water.

Maybe it was the refractormeter or maybe brewersfriend had a bad day.

 

[PADave]

So what should an optimal crush look like? I have my own mill and I crushed after calibrating the rollers with a credit card. Looks like the rollers are just a tad over .025.

I wonder if I should go finer?

How do you brew? If doing the traditional 3 vessel method, you have to watch you don't go too fine and get a stuck sparge. If doing BIAB, set those rollers as tight as they can go and crush fine.

 

[PADave]

Brewed my 49 th batch in under 2 years . Never was off this much. Goose IPA clone double batch.
OG calls for 1.065. I got 1.05!!!!!!
Boiled some DME and cooled and added to the 2 carboys but time will tell.
I noticed when I bought my grain at LBS that some of the malts looked bigger and very little white powder( opened grains) inside compared to normal.
Possible that the grain was not milled properly to leave the numbers off so much?????

I have had great success with kits, BIAB, and now 20 plus of all grain and have brewed this beer a few times and always on the mark.

thoughts?

Spend $99 on a Cereal Killer and problem solved.

 

[WBB]

How do you brew? If doing the traditional 3 vessel method, you have to watch you don't go too fine and get a stuck sparge. If doing BIAB, set those rollers as tight as they can go and crush fine.

Traditional 3 vessel. Mash tun cooler, HLT, and kettle. The sparge (batch) defnitely did not get stuck. The mash almost did.