New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[Dgallo]

now regarding the different times. Compound develops over time so it makes sense that at different times of the harvest you will have sone compounds more prevalent than others

 

[beervoid]

Copper is a fungicide to prevent powdery/Downey mildew and any other possible fungus also used in the us and across the world for all sorts of plants, fruits, and veggies. Think of hops like buds, depending on the soil content and specific trait, you can achieve different percentages of compounds

I don't remember where I read it or heard but they mentioned its much lower or even not at all being used in the usa for hops.
Probably bs podcast with stan hieronymus

 

[Shenanigans]

Getting back on topic .....

I just brewed a session/micro NEIPA with an OG of 1.035 using Imperial Juice (A38) with a half litre starter.
I had planned on waiting 2 weeks before kegging as I only have time on the weekend
I reckon it will be done in 3 or 4 days as it only has to drop about 25 points.
If that happens with such a small beer could I keg it after only a week or does that yeast, or London III, need more than 3 or 4 days to clean up after fermentation is finished?

Thanks

 

[isomerization]

Getting back on topic .....

I just brewed a session/micro NEIPA with an OG of 1.035 using Imperial Juice (A38) with a half litre starter.
I had planned on waiting 2 weeks before kegging as I only have time on the weekend
I reckon it will be done in 3 or 4 days as it only has to drop about 25 points.
If that happens with such a small beer could I keg it after only a week or does that yeast, or London III, need more than 3 or 4 days to clean up after fermentation is finished?

Thanks

I would bet a lot of people in this thread are kegging at the 1 week mark. I know I have in the last with no (apparent) issues.

The whole clean up off flavors phase is likely an artifact of poor yeast health (from the supplier, pitch rate, ferm temp, etc).

 

[Shenanigans]

I would bet a lot of people in this thread are kegging at the 1 week mark. I know I have in the last with no (apparent) issues.

The whole clean up off flavors phase is likely an artifact of poor yeast health (from the supplier, pitch rate, ferm temp, etc).

Cool, it's only 1 day in the fermenter but I don't want to miss the chance to dry hop before it's finished. I'll take a reading right now and see how far along it is, if under 1.020 then I might dry hop already.

 

[Shenanigans]

Cool, it's only 1 day in the fermenter but I don't want to miss the chance to dry hop before it's finished. I'll take a reading right now and see how far along it is, if under 1.020 then I might dry hop already.

It's down to 1.024 from 1.035 after 30 hours so there should be still some activity in about 20 hours. I'll dry hop it then and keg on the weekend.

 

[leesmith]

It's down to 1.024 from 1.035 after 30 hours so there should be still some activity in about 20 hours. I'll dry hop it then and keg on the weekend.

When did bubbles start in the airlock?

With a starting gravity of 1.035...I’d expect the yeast to chew through that in no time.

At 30 hours I’d think it should be in the teens.

 

[Shenanigans]

When did bubbles start in the airlock?

With a starting gravity of 1.035...I’d expect the yeast to chew through that in no time.

At 30 hours I’d think it should be in the teens.

Not sure exactly I pitched it around 8 in the evening and the next morning it was bubbling. I mashed extra high at 160 to leave some body so maybe that has slowed it down a bit.

 

[Dgallo]

Not sure exactly I pitched it around 8 in the evening and the next morning it was bubbling. I mashed extra high at 160 to leave some body so maybe that has slowed it down a bit.

At 160 mash you may only get down to 1.018-1.020. That’s where I would be with a 1.060ish og at least

 

[isomerization]

At 160 mash you may only get down to 1.018-1.020. That’s where I would be with a 1.060ish og at least

Should scale down with the lower OG though right? I’d assume 1.012, which is about 65% AA for a 1.035 OG. Assuming nothing too weird in the grain bill.

 

[Shenanigans]

yeah according to beer smith it should finish around 1.010 which is my aim. A low alc. beer not too thin with loads of hop aroma and some bitterness. I never mashed that high before so hopefully it works.

 

[flintoid]

I'd like to thank a lot of you in this thread. My last batch of London Ale III fermented NEIPA didn't have hop burn once it was carbonated. 10 days in the fermenter, 24 hours of cold, pressurized dry hopping, and 4 days of carbonation.

One of the best batches I've done. Keeping hop additions low before fermentation anc dry hopping after letting the yeast settle out helps kill astringency. There's quite a balance to be struck. I did add some small amounts of hops once the yeast got rolling, but I kept it small (1-2 oz total).

 

[stickyfinger]

I've had some great success on making low ABV versions of these beers by mashing at 165F, doing a mashout to 170F for 10 minutes and then only adding dry hops once the yeast has been dropped at like 60F for 2-3 days. You might give that a try next time. No hop creep and lots of mouthfeel with sub-5% ABV beers.

yeah according to beer smith it should finish around 1.010 which is my aim. A low alc. beer not too thin with loads of hop aroma and some bitterness. I never mashed that high before so hopefully it works.

 

[ttuato]

I just had my first experience with "hop creep" compliments of Mosaic. I made a split batch (9gal 1.065SG - target 1.015FG) - Each had three hops - Mosaic, Simcoe, Idaho 7 & Citra, Simcoe, Idaho 7. I split the wort and whirlpooled separately - each had 1.5 oz of the hops in the blend. Then split into different fermenters in temperature controlled ferm chambers using WLP007, followed by a initial dryhop at 1.022 of 1oz each hop on day three. I left for vacation and returned seven days later to and dropped to 58* before adding the final dryhop. The batch with Citra was at 1.013 - the batch with Mosaic was at 1.009. I was shocked to see that much of a difference between the two and the only variable was one hop. At this point I cannot tell a difference in the body / mouthfeel between the two but hopefully it wont be noticeable.

 

[Shenanigans]

I've had some great success on making low ABV versions of these beers by mashing at 165F, doing a mashout to 170F for 10 minutes and then only adding dry hops once the yeast has been dropped at like 60F for 2-3 days. You might give that a try next time. No hop creep and lots of mouthfeel with sub-5% ABV beers.

Thanks I'll see how this one turns out and maybe try your process if I feel it needs some tweaks.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Mosaic is kinda notorious for hop creep.

 

[stickyfinger]

If you mash hot, that difference can be magnified even more, due to the extra dextrins available to be broken down! I've seen an almost 2% difference in ABV between a split batch with the only difference was a warm dry hop in one and not the other!

I just had my first experience with "hop creep" compliments of Mosaic. I made a split batch (9gal 1.065SG - target 1.015FG) - Each had three hops - Mosaic, Simcoe, Idaho 7 & Citra, Simcoe, Idaho 7. I split the wort and whirlpooled separately - each had 1.5 oz of the hops in the blend. Then split into different fermenters in temperature controlled ferm chambers using WLP007, followed by a initial dryhop at 1.022 of 1oz each hop on day three. I left for vacation and returned seven days later to and dropped to 58* before adding the final dryhop. The batch with Citra was at 1.013 - the batch with Mosaic was at 1.009. I was shocked to see that much of a difference between the two and the only variable was one hop. At this point I cannot tell a difference in the body / mouthfeel between the two but hopefully it wont be noticeable.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

If I remember correctly it has more to do with the types of pesticide being used. Less thiols are formed cause they use copper in the pesticides in Europe.

The copper sulphate story is complicated, but I know the paper you're thinking of and it's a bit out of date - in fact Brussels keeps trying to ban copper altogether, and it's not used as much in some countries as in others.

But in any case, thiols are just one part of the story, the monoterpenes responsible for a lot of floral/citrus flavours do seem to be heavily linked to sunshine. It's a real factor in variable climates like Britain, you can really taste the difference in eg the 2017 vintage where August was really cloudy.

In fact I reckon if you gave me SMaSHes made with samples of the last few years of EKG, I could fairly reliably identify blind which beer was from which year - the hard bitterness of the heatwave year of 2018, the earthiness of the cloudy 2017s, the modest 2016s, the all-round brilliance of 2015 and so on.

 

[beervoid]

The copper sulphate story is complicated, but I know the paper you're thinking of and it's a bit out of date - in fact Brussels keeps trying to ban copper altogether, and it's not used as much in some countries as in others.

But in any case, thiols are just one part of the story, the monoterpenes responsible for a lot of floral/citrus flavours do seem to be heavily linked to sunshine. It's a real factor in variable climates like Britain, you can really taste the difference in eg the 2017 vintage where August was really cloudy.

In fact I reckon if you gave me SMaSHes made with samples of the last few years of EKG, I could fairly reliably identify blind which beer was from which year - the hard bitterness of the heatwave year of 2018, the earthiness of the cloudy 2017s, the modest 2016s, the all-round brilliance of 2015 and so on.

Fascinating stuff. It makes sense as the southern hemisphere hops are very fruity and I bet they got a whole lot of more sunshine.

 

[NickC]

Off topic really quick. Anybody have any tips for GABF tickets? Heard they sell out quick. Should I get the AHA membership?

 

[jakturner]

How far have you guys pushed imperial dryhop temp wise? I recently use it for the first time in a all Medusa brut IPA and it’s probably the most estery yeast I’ve ever used! The pre dryhop sample smelled like fruity bubble yum. I pitch at 75 and quickly cooled it to 68 within an hour, I let it free rise to a couple degrees at day up to 74. I’m kinda hoping it will tone down or blend with the dryhop, it’s a little overwhelming. Anyways, bout to use it in a NEIPA this weekend and wondering if I should raine in the temp a little

 

[Dgallo]

How far have you guys pushed imperial dryhop temp wise? I recently use it for the first time in a all Medusa brut IPA and it’s probably the most estery yeast I’ve ever used! The pre dryhop sample smelled like fruity bubble yum. I pitch at 75 and quickly cooled it to 68 within an hour, I let it free rise to a couple degrees at day up to 74. I’m kinda hoping it will tone down or blend with the dryhop, it’s a little overwhelming. Anyways, bout to use it in a NEIPA this weekend and wondering if I should raine in the temp a little

I always push it from 68-74/5 over the course of the first 2-3days. I love the ester profile of dryhop and have never had it conflict with the hops. I’ve also never got bubble gum. Just peach/nectarine and citrus. If you go above 76 you’ll get fusel alcohol from the A04 portion of dryhop.

 

[jakturner]

I always push it from 68-74/5 over the course of the first 2-3days. I love the water profile of dryhop and have never had it conflict with the hops. I’ve also never got bubble gum. Just peach/nectarine and citrus. If you go above 76 you’ll get fusel alcohol from the A04 portion of dryhop.

Ok thanks, the hottest wort temp I measured was 74.8* it’s not like bubble gum per se, more like the Fruit punch bubble yum (fruity with slight gumminess? Maybe those peach gummy rings?) it has a sweet profile despite a FG of 0.998, It was pre dryhop so we will see how it works with Medusa. Also I fermented under head pressure. Have you ever pitched hotter and cooled down to target temp post pitch? Maybe I chill down to 68 before pitching in a NEIPA this weekend.

 

[stickyfinger]

i think hot pitching with immediate cooling works fine in the summer. i just did an ipa with 1318. pitched at 77 and set fridge to cool to 72 immediately. no off-flavors i can detect. i suppose it may depend on the yeast though

 

[isomerization]

Ok thanks, the hottest wort temp I measured was 74.8* it’s not like bubble gum per se, more like the Fruit punch bubble yum (fruity with slight gumminess? Maybe those peach gummy rings?) it has a sweet profile despite a FG of 0.998, It was pre dryhop so we will see how it works with Medusa. Also I fermented under head pressure. Have you ever pitched hotter and cooled down to target temp post pitch? Maybe I chill down to 68 before pitching in a NEIPA this weekend.

I do this with pretty much every beer I make, regardless of strain (ale, lager, kveik). No issues here!

Caveat, you need to have active cooling measures, or you will be actively fermenting before the wort passively cools.

 

[Dgallo]

Ok thanks, the hottest wort temp I measured was 74.8* it’s not like bubble gum per se, more like the Fruit punch bubble yum (fruity with slight gumminess? Maybe those peach gummy rings?) it has a sweet profile despite a FG of 0.998, It was pre dryhop so we will see how it works with Medusa. Also I fermented under head pressure. Have you ever pitched hotter and cooled down to target temp post pitch? Maybe I chill down to 68 before pitching in a NEIPA this weekend.

It pairs well with Medusa. I did a Medusa & Huell Melon combo using it and it worked really well. I usually try to pitch it at 68, yeast produce the most esters during the growth stage which is Typically the first 36 hours. so if you pitch hot and it doesnt make its way back down to correct temps before they take off, the potential for fusel alcohol increases.

 

[jakturner]

It pairs well with Medusa. I did a Medusa & Huell Melon combo using it and it worked really well. I usually try to pitch it at 68, yeast produce the most esters during the growth stage which is Typically the first 36 hours. so if you pitch hot and it doesnt make its way back down to correct temps before they take off, the potential for fusel alcohol increases.

Nice, no Fusels I can detect, I pitched an active starter but I did get the wort temp down within an hour or two (actually over shot down to the low 60’s) but it equaled out to 68 by that evening. I soft crashed last night gonna dryhop tonight then into the fridge in on Sunday.
I was just curious on what u guys do for temps, I usually use London III or hornidal but the esters on this one are way more pronounced.

 

[flintoid]

i think hot pitching with immediate cooling works fine in the summer. i just did an ipa with 1318. pitched at 77 and set fridge to cool to 72 immediately. no off-flavors i can detect. i suppose it may depend on the yeast though

I've been doing 1318 at a start of 72 with an immediate cool down to 65. It never has off flavors, and creates the typical esters with this yeast which are subtle. I have held at 65 until kegging and also ramped it back up to 72 after a few days to "finish it off" and can tell no difference between the two methods.

 

[murphyslaw]

I've been thinking of moving towards fermenting in cornys. I tried it with an APA and it was a disaster bc my disconnects clogged. I'm thinking of trying Scott Janish's dip tube filter.

Has anyone had success keg fermenting beers with loads of dry hops? If so, any tips/tricks to share?

 

[stickyfinger]

You will likely have few issues if you do the following:

-Put in a floating dip tube (such as the clear beer draught system)
-Load in dry hops and let rest at whatever temp you like to dry hop at
-Set the freezer to chill down to 30s F 48 hrs before you want to rack
-Push beer from fermentation keg at 30-35 psi into serving keg with a spund valve on the serving keg set to 28-32 psi (could use other pressures if you desire, but i like high pressure as you need to carbonate it anyway once it is racked.)
-If you prefer to spund to carbonate before racking, then you have to be gentle with the transfer to avoid foaming into the spund valve

One possible issue I have had sometimes is the tubing on the floating dip tube can kink on occasion. If that happens, you have to shake around the keg a bit, let settle and then rack the rest off.

I've been thinking of moving towards fermenting in cornys. I tried it with an APA and it was a disaster bc my disconnects clogged. I'm thinking of trying Scott Janish's dip tube filter.

Has anyone had success keg fermenting beers with loads of dry hops? If so, any tips/tricks to share?

 

[NickC]

I've been thinking of moving towards fermenting in cornys. I tried it with an APA and it was a disaster bc my disconnects clogged. I'm thinking of trying Scott Janish's dip tube filter.

Has anyone had success keg fermenting beers with loads of dry hops? If so, any tips/tricks to share?

My recommendations-

1) floating dip tube
2) cold crash before racking
3) no more than 4.25 gal batches and I recommend ferm cap
4) transferring cold seems to be easier (I transfer at about 5 psi and pull PRV on receiving keg every couple minutes)

Had a couple of issues early on with clogged xfers but the cold crash and transfer cold have solved those issues.

 

[murphyslaw]

Thank you both. For a while, the smaller batch size presented a mental hurdle for me. But then I realized that I find myself without a tap for my next beer more often than I find myself with an empty tap, so I'm over that.

Sounds like a floating dip tube is preferable to the dip tube filter/screen. Might as well get one for fermenting and serving kegs, I suppose.

 

[stickyfinger]

the floating dip tubes are also great for nitro beers where you want super clear beer for the densest foam. you can transport with less issues due to resuspension of yeast as well.

I also use no more than 4.25-4.5G of wort in my corny

 

[BeerFst]

Thank you both. For a while, the smaller batch size presented a mental hurdle for me. But then I realized that I find myself without a tap for my next beer more often than I find myself with an empty tap, so I'm over that.

Sounds like a floating dip tube is preferable to the dip tube filter/screen. Might as well get one for fermenting and serving kegs, I suppose.

I have both, 2 CBDS and a janish dip tube. the CBDS is a much easier solution, though slightly more expensive. both work for serving direct from fermenting keg, i have one of each on tap right now. but when it came to buying another keg fermenting device i just stuck with CBDS. That said not all the orings for the mesh filter screen addon to the CBDS is available form that company, i know i can get similar ones at home depot but havent found the exact size yet. I asked the company but they didnt respond.

 

[Loud Brewing]

I dont ferment in keg but I use a version of the clear beer system in all my kegs for serving and even in the fermenter for transfers. If your cheap like me you can just use silicon tubing and an improvised float, something like a small pill bottle works great.

 

[Dgallo]

Just some FYI stuff.

So for the past couple of years I’ve been toying with the idea of brewing a NEIPA with Lavender and I finally did it. Two weeks ago I brewed my typical NEIPA grain bill (I’ve posted the gist previously) using Columbus/Citra hotside and Citra/Amarillo coldside. As I was whirlpool, I used 1oz of dried lavender flowers along with the hops at 165 for 30 minutes. That was the only lavender addition. Finished it with kviek Voss and went grain to glass in 7.5 days with soft crashing for yeast, dryhoping back at 65-70, and cold crashing before racking to keg. Went from 1.063-1.012 in 36 hours.

This beer smacks you on the nose and lips with lavender. Not perfumie or like grandmas soap but as if you’re holding fresh picked lavender. My wife, who genuinely knows beer, really likes it but I think it’s a tad too much and doesn’t show off the hops at all. It really shows some signs of brilliance but I think it needs to be dialed back some and it could really be something. In the mean time, I’m going to let this cold condition and see how it develops

 

[kevink]

Free float, cold crash for at least24hrs, Install a filter in your transfer line and discard the first few ounces that exposed to air in the line then proceed with transfer.

https://www.amazon.com/Line-Strainer-stainless-filter-screen/dp/B00CH2JSIY

I dryhop 1.5-2 oz per gallon. No more issues after I added the inline filter. If you don’t cold crash the filter will clog though.

Just wanted to mention that I tried the 20 mesh version of this filter on my last massively dry hopped (over 2 lbs) 10 gallon batch and it worked beautifully in preventing clogged poppets. The whole batch transferred no problem to two kegs. It did clog at the very end of the transfer, but that's to be expected, and I didn't really mind as there was mostly just hop sludge left in the fermenter at that point.

Sanitation was pretty simple. I just assembled it and attached tubing to each end of it under starsan and then pushed beer through it until the sanitizer was purged. I originally wanted to push the starsan out with CO2, but decided this was the better way to go.

The filter is extremely small, though, so it's not capable of filtering out much hop debris. I could never get away with not cold crashing and using this. For now, it's a keeper and I'll continue to use it. Thanks for the heads up and first-hand experience, @ttuato.

 

[kevink]

Again, that beer looks so good, @Dgallo. How would you compare that yeast to 1318 or A24 for this style, or is it hard to tell with the lavender in there?

 

[Dgallo]

Again, that beer looks so good, @Dgallo. How would you compare that yeast to 1318 or A24 for this style, or is it hard to tell with the lavender in there?

I only pitched 1/2 the pack and used the other 1/2 on a Galaxy Pale ale. It def will work well for the style. I got lots of orange from it and a slight saison/bubblegumie note in it as well. So it adds a bit of complexity which is nice when fermented hot, like 90-95. I still prefer dryhop for my own taste but I will def be using it in some of my recipes to see how it changes things

 

[isomerization]

Just wanted to mention that I tried the 20 mesh version of this filter on my last massively dry hopped (over 2 lbs) 10 gallon batch and it worked beautifully in preventing clogged poppets. The whole batch transferred no problem to two kegs. It did clog at the very end of the transfer, but that's to be expected, and I didn't really mind as there was mostly just hop sludge left in the fermenter at that point.

Sanitation was pretty simple. I just assembled it and attached tubing to each end of it under starsan and then pushed beer through it until the sanitizer was purged. I originally wanted to push the starsan out with CO2, but decided this was the better way to go.

The filter is extremely small, though, so it's not capable of filtering out much hop debris. I could never get away with not cold crashing and using this. For now, it's a keeper and I'll continue to use it. Thanks for the heads up and first-hand experience, @ttuato.

I picked up the same filter, but using a water test, couldn’t prevent lots of bubbles from forming at the exit of the filter. Any suggestions from those using it?