No Krausen?

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DamageCT

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I brewed a lager on Saturday and pitched an appropriate amount of yeast (a pop pack plus a starter that used a pop pack).
I oxygenated the wort before pitching, yet I see no krausen.

I pitched when the wort was at 52 degrees. It's been 4/5 days yet I have seen no krausen at all. The wort was only 1.05 OG and highly fermentable. Is it possible it is fermenting with no signs of bubbling or krausen?
 
The airlock doesn't seem to be bubbling and theses def no krausen. I've never had that issue with lager before. Thanks for the heads up
 
What did you use to clean/sterilize your carboy?

If there is still nothing tomorrow, check a gravity and go from there either reyeasting or letting it go.
 
I use B-Brite to clean and star San to sterilize.

I pitched Saturday with a 2L starter and then a wyeast pop pack yesterday since it didn't seem like there was much activity. The air lock does seem to be floating but not bubbling
 
First of all, you underpitched if your starter was only two litres. You didn't pitch an appropriate amount of yeast. Adding a second smack pack may help, but the easiest thing is to just pitch the proper amount in the first place.

Secondly, the only way to know for sure what's going on is to take a gravity reading.

Report back after you have done so.
 
Took the reading, it's at 1.04 as of right now. It went down .01, so it seems like it is doing something but not much.

Another thing I noticed is the middle part of my 3 piece airlock seems to get suctioned to the bottom/fills with water?
 
osagedr said:
First of all, you underpitched if your starter was only two litres. You didn't pitch an appropriate amount of yeast. Adding a second smack pack may help, but the easiest thing is to just pitch the proper amount in the first place.
Click to expand...

Wow. What nonsense. The guy pitched a 2L starter from a smack pack, and you're criticizing for underpitching? He's got 200 to 300 billion yeast in there before putting in a second smack pack. Seriously? You think his fermentation didn't take off because he only has 300 billion yeast?

OP, did your starter show signs of life?
 
Regardless of whether he pitch correctly or not, he should probably re pitch. It sounds to me like his yeast wasn't healthy and/or in enough quantity for some reason.
 
Cromwell said:
Wow. What nonsense. The guy pitched a 2L starter from a smack pack, and you're criticizing for underpitching? He's got 200 to 300 billion yeast in there before putting in a second smack pack. Seriously? You think his fermentation didn't take off because he only has 300 billion yeast?

OP, did your starter show signs of life?
Click to expand...

The starter had a frothy white foam on top, looked like it started kicking off, and to get even more cells I threw in another pop pack 2 days later...
You can TELL there is yeast on the bottom, theres already a yeast cake goin going in the carboy...
I think it might be since none of the air seems like it is escaping since the floater in my 3 piece airlock keeps filling with water... is that a possibility?
 
MaynardX said:
Regardless of whether he pitch correctly or not, he should probably re pitch. It sounds to me like his yeast wasn't healthy and/or in enough quantity for some reason.
Click to expand...

I have already re pitched. Still has only dropped .01 in 3 days since repitching.
 
Cromwell said:
Wow. What nonsense. The guy pitched a 2L starter from a smack pack, and you're criticizing for underpitching?
Click to expand...

Mr. Malty recommends 350 billion yeast cells for a 1.050 lager. So for a simple starter (the OP didn't indicate otherwise) the pitching rate calculator suggests a five litre starter with two packs of yeast if those packs were produced around the end of October. In case you were wondering, 5 > 2. But you probably know more about yeast than Jamil does.

Maybe you don't know much about lager fermentation, but anyone who does would agree a 2 litre starter is underpitching a 1.050 lager. Consider doing some research before running your mouth next time. It might save you from looking foolish.
 
osagedr said:
Mr. Malty recommends 350 billion yeast cells for a 1.050 lager. So for a simple starter (the OP didn't indicate otherwise) the pitching rate calculator suggests a five litre starter with two packs of yeast if those packs were produced around the end of October. In case you were wondering, 5 > 2. But you probably know more about yeast than Jamil does.

Maybe you don't know much about lager fermentation, but anyone who does would agree a 2 litre starter is underpitching a 1.050 lager. Consider doing some research before running your mouth next time. It might save you from looking foolish.
Click to expand...

It was a stir plate starter, and the wort was oxygenated using a williams oxygen wand.

And I have had a 1.09 lager ferment just fine with a 2L starter with two packs in in so I figured one pack in the starter (stir plate for 24 hours and oxygenated with the wand before the yeast was pitched) and one pack after should have been enough...
 
DamageCT said:
It was a stir plate starter, and the wort was oxygenated using a williams oxygen wand.

And I have had a 1.09 lager ferment just fine with a 2L starter with two packs in in so I figured one pack in the starter (stir plate for 24 hours and oxygenated with the wand before the yeast was pitched) and one pack after should have been enough...
Click to expand...

A rule of thumb I like to follow for lagers is 1.5 million cells per millilitre of wort per degree Plato. So your 1.090 lager would require something like 664 billion cells. Your 1.050 lager needs 369 billion cells. Using Braukaiser's pitching rate table (Fermenting Lagers - German brewing and more) for your 1.090 lager the recommended pitching rate is about 30 million yeast cells per millilitre of wort (assuming you pitch and ferment cool). That's 570 billion cells or so for five gallons (19 litres exactly, adjust upward if you brew 20 or 21 litres to end up with 19 in the keg).

So I am happy that your underpitched 1.090 lager turned out for you, and hope that it did well in competition to show that you can make great beer even if you make mistakes. Still, the easiest thing is to pitch enough yeast at the start; that way you are less likely to run into stuck fermentations, diacetyl, other off-flavours, etc. later on. You need a lot more yeast for lagers than for ales, especially if you pitch and ferment cool (I regularly go around 45 degrees).

I really hope the current batch works out for you. Good on you for using a stir plate and oxygen. Fermentation is everything.
 
Thanks Osagedr.
I agree fermentation is everything, that is why I am paniced with this current batch.
It is very strange because you can see the yeast cake and everything forming... its looking to be a normal size yet I havent seen ANY signs of fermentation other then a .01 gravity drop.

Ill post a picture later.
 
I know you pitched at 52, but what is your temp now? I would verify the FC isn't too cold for the strain using a reliable thermometer.
 
1Mainebrew it's about 50-52 degrees (johnson temp controller)


Osagedr! You brought me luck! My beer shows signs off life and krausen (6 days later)!!
 

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