No Boil Mash

[Optx]

Was listening to a podcast and the host mentioned a recipe with no boiling. I'm tempted to try this since my gravity has been off consistently with my ClawHammer system. My assumption is that I may be boiling for too long or my efficiency is off. Anyone have any information or experience with not boiling your mash?

 

[bracconiere]

i've never boiled my mash? wort afterwards, but not the mash....i have done a few rice beers that i didn't boil, just dry hopped...

mashing is kinda like making a tea, you want it hot enough that when you add your grains it sits at 145-158f (depending how much attenuation you want), then you drain that liquid, unless you brew in a bag, you rinse the grains with 168f water to get the residule sugar from your grains, then boil that till your final volume....(adding hops during the boil, at different times for different effect)

 

[Miraculix]

I think he means not boiling the wort, as he speaks of a no boil recipe.

It can be done and I did quite a few of those, see the raw pilsener thread in the lager recipe forum (the lazy German).

You have to be careful with the wort so that it does not get infected. Heat it up to 75c, but not above, hold it there for a few minutes and it is pasteurised.

You have to boil the hops separately in a hop tea, but instructions for this are all written in the above thread.

 

[bracconiere]

I think he means not boiling the wort, as he speaks of a no boil recipe.

lol, my post was half tongue and cheek, just wanted to make sure.....

 

[Optx]

Sorry wort was my intended terminology. I've never attempted it and was curious about the results. I'm interested in the benefits and perhaps using a variation of this method. I consistently come in about 7 points higher then my intended OG (10.060->10.067). I'm thinking maybe im boiling for too long. Although I follow my recipes exactly my gravity readings are consistently off. I've changed my efficiency in Beersmith to around 65% to compensate.

 

[Miraculix]

Sorry wort was my intended terminology. I've never attempted it and was curious about the results. I'm interested in the benefits and perhaps using a variation of this method. I consistently come in about 7 points higher then my intended OG (10.060->10.067). I'm thinking maybe im boiling for too long. Although I follow my recipes exactly my gravity readings are consistently off. I've changed my efficiency in Beersmith to around 65% to compensate.

Just thin it out with bottled water, after the boil. No problem at all.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

I consistently come in about 7 points higher then my intended OG (10.060->10.067). I'm thinking maybe im boiling for too long. Although I follow my recipes exactly my gravity readings are consistently off. I've changed my efficiency in Beersmith to around 65% to compensate.

If you use Beersmith, then you should be able to take measurements along the way, match those up with the predictions, and determine which numbers in Beersmith are off. Beersmith's prediction are based off the losses and efficiency numbers that you give it.

Boiling has only an indirect impact on efficiency. It just removes water which concentrates the sugars...so higher gravity but lower volume. If you are ending up with your target volume but a higher gravity, then it sounds like the efficiency value entered into Beersmith is low. If you are ending up with less volume than expected then maybe your boil off rate, grain absorption or one of the loss values is off.

 

[Optx]

That sounds correct. I probably should of been more specific to what my gravity reading problems are. The most common problem is coming up low on my gravity readings and then having to add DME to make up the points. Speaking with my local home brewer supply store they recommended going with a lesser efficiency percentage.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

That sounds correct. I probably should of been more specific to what my gravity reading problems are. The most common problem is coming up low on my gravity readings and then having to add DME to make up the points. Speaking with my local home brewer supply store they recommended going with a lesser efficiency percentage.

I have not done any no-boil all-grain batches (have done some no boil or 10 min boil extract batches). I have to think that a no boil all-grain batch will push your efficiency lower since you will use less mash/sparge water and you won't have the boil to drive off water and concentrate the gravity.

From what I have seen no-boil/raw-ale seems interesting and viable, but I don't see it as a way to fix efficiency issues.

If you are trying to address efficiency and consistency...I expect your issues are in your mash efficiency. What is your mash process? I BIAB now and I feel like grain crush is a driving factor on efficiency (and sparging can be added in to help out). When I was fly sparging, a consistent grain crush helped (a big reason I got my own mill) but a slow and steady sparge was a major factor (something I always struggled with...I could have had mash pH issues back then as well since I did not adjust).

 

[papz]

I've done no boil beers and drank other peoples no boil beers.
They are fine as long as you get it hot enough to pasteurize.
If your efficiency is low, there are a few more bits of information needed.
1-what temp do you mash at?
2-how long do you mash?
3-what method of sparging do you do & what temp/how long?
Try mashing at 150-f for a full hour.
I batch sparge for 20-30 minutes.
I will also do a second sparging all the way down to 1.010
(yes, i take gravity reading of each running)
You can also make up the difference by merely adding a few LBS of grain over what you already do.

 

[Optx]

@papz

I can't remember off the top of my head but I believe it was 156f for 60mins using a ClawHammer system. So I was recirculating my water during the process once I came up to temp. I moved my mash out and let it sit to allow the excess to drip for about 15-20min. I'm thinking my issue may also be related to how my grains were milled at my local home brew shop. I'm considering in asking for my grains to be double milled.

 

[Kenmoron]

@papz

I can't remember off the top of my head but I believe it was 156f for 60mins using a ClawHammer system. So I was recirculating my water during the process once I came up to temp. I moved my mash out and let it sit to allow the excess to drip for about 15-20min. I'm thinking my issue may also be related to how my grains were milled at my local home brew shop. I'm considering in asking for my grains to be double milled.

You need to double mill if you are using a mill set up for traditional 3-vessel brewing. You will definitely see an increase in efficiency if this is the case. Mashing at 156 is a little high for most beers, but shouldn't effect efficiency as much as the fermentability of the wort. One last thing that hasn't been mentioned is what is your brewing water like? Do you check pH? If not, do you happen to at least know your water profile?

 

[Optx]

It's RO water so I'd say a ph of 7. I'm already taking steps to adjust my water profile to match my style.