New Cider Brewer Looking For Help!

[PlayedDan]

After doing a lot of research I was very interested in brewing my own cider, not because I want to get out of my face 24/7 but because I was intrigued of how many different ways there were to get such a different result. I put the idea behind me as I didn't think I had enough time. After receiving a magnum 'kit' for my birthday I got to work with in the hour, it's been 5 days and is bubbling away nicely.

I have looking over the instructions time and time again but I'm aware that there are so many different possible outcomes in this hobby, so I'm going to chuck all my questions in one thread and hope someone out there will be able to answer most of my newbie questions. (I've done a lot of googling but seem to be getting different answers everywhere, some things I would just like clarification to my understanding)

To start I will ask questions about my current cider.

The kit didn't come with a bubbler, so I've left one half of the lid slightly off so I am not sure on the current 'bubbles per minute'. So I'm wondering how I'm gonna know when to siphon it into a second fermentation bin. (I use these instructions http://www.the-home-brew-shop.co.uk/acatalog/11290-magnum-instruction.pdf)

1. Will the scummy substance on top drop to the bottom when it's finished?

I bought a hydrometer after starting so I don't have a before reading. My understanding is that I take a reading when I think it's done, then the day after and if they are the same then it should be done.

2. So will I need to take some cider out from under the scum (if it doesn't drop) and take a reading? Or will it definitely not be done until that drops (if yes to question 1)

I read somewhere that I should leave the flavouring in the secondary bin for 2 days rather than instantly bottling like the instructions say so I will most likely do this. I also received 24 (750ml/1Litre I can't remember) screw top plastic bottles, will these be suitable for making the sparkling cider?

3. If so, would I literally put a spoonful of sugar in, then put the cider in?

4. Would it be okay to put these bottles back where the fermentation is currently happening (airing cupboard) or is that too warm?

That's all I have about the current cider, now for future ciders I have a few questions.

I don't wish to make another 5 Gallon batch, quite frankly I don't want to waste that much and not like it (I wouldn't say I'm a fussy drinker but I have been known to turn my nose up at a few, and 5 gallons of something I don't like? no thanks) So I was wondering, I think I would rather make say five 1 gallon batches of different things and then if I like one of those, scale it up to 5 gallons. So my questions for this are:

5. What are the best containers to make smaller batches in? (Please reply with some names and materials)

6. If I were to make 1 gallon batches, would it be suitable to scale down a 5 gallon recipe by 5x or would it be completely different? (Same for up scaling, say I made a nice one and wanting to scale up, would I times everything used by 5?)

7. If I were to experiment with 1 gallon batches and make my own recipes, how much head room would I want to leave for this gunk stuff?

If I think of anything else I will add it to the bottom of this, but I am an extremely new brewer.

Apologies if something doesn't make sense I've quickly typed this at work, if you want me to elaborate or anything I can.

Thanks,

Dan

 

[PlayedDan]

Anyone?

 

[trev12110]

dan I only have two ciders under my belt but i have also made mead and a good amount of beer and I have to say an airlock is necessary! It stops infections in your brew by allowing nothing to get in and filling your headspace with CO2 instead of oxygen. that being said, the krausen (Thats what it is called in beer, not sure about cider) should go away and then you can take readings to make sure the fermentation is finished.
I'm not sure about the bottles, i have never used twist ons sorry.

For 1 gallon batches I use 1 gallon glass carboys, you should be able to multiply everything by 5 and get the same result only in 5 gallons, and on the carboys I stop for headspace when the liquid gets to the curve in the neck. Hope this helps some

 

[TexasWine]

The kit didn't come with a bubbler, so I've left one half of the lid slightly off so I am not sure on the current 'bubbles per minute'. So I'm wondering how I'm gonna know when to siphon it into a second fermentation bin.

1. Will the scummy substance on top drop to the bottom when it's finished?

I bought a hydrometer after starting so I don't have a before reading. My understanding is that I take a reading when I think it's done, then the day after and if they are the same then it should be done.

2. So will I need to take some cider out from under the scum (if it doesn't drop) and take a reading? Or will it definitely not be done until that drops (if yes to question 1)

I read somewhere that I should leave the flavouring in the secondary bin for 2 days rather than instantly bottling like the instructions say so I will most likely do this. I also received 24 (750ml/1Litre I can't remember) screw top plastic bottles, will these be suitable for making the sparkling cider?

3. If so, would I literally put a spoonful of sugar in, then put the cider in?

4. Would it be okay to put these bottles back where the fermentation is currently happening (airing cupboard) or is that too warm?

5. What are the best containers to make smaller batches in? (Please reply with some names and materials)

6. If I were to make 1 gallon batches, would it be suitable to scale down a 5 gallon recipe by 5x or would it be completely different? (Same for up scaling, say I made a nice one and wanting to scale up, would I times everything used by 5?)

7. If I were to experiment with 1 gallon batches and make my own recipes, how much head room would I want to leave for this gunk stuff?

First of all, thanks for organizing all your Qs in such a way that they're easy to address. Let's see how many I can answer before my thumbs get tired of typing on my phone.

A. You'll know when to siphon based on hydrometer readings. Rack it to secondary when the gravity is in the 1.010 - 1.020 range (usually around 5-7 days, depending on fermenting temp). As far as a bubbler goes (airlock), if you don't have one you can substitute with a drilled rubber stopper and a length of hose. Put the rubber stopper into the carboy, slip the hose into the rubber stopper, make sure it's a snug fit, and put the other end of the hose into a container of water. Voilà! Homemade airlock.

1. Yes. For future reference, if using a wine or champagne yeast it doesn't develop a krausen like a beer yeast.

2. Take a reading whenever you want. However the krausen should drop before you rack to secondary.

Not sure about the flavoring. And the plastic bottles will be fine if they're food grade and are rated for pressure, like a soda pop bottle.

3. No. To achieve a consistent carbonation level across every bottle you would prime the entire batch by racking the cider into a container with a sugar solution. The amount of sugar you use will be determined by the carbonation level you desire.

4. Put them any place where the temp is around 65-75F. Avoid direct sunlight.

5. Don't have any names for you, but here we can find one gallon glass jugs of cider at the local grocery store. After the cider had been consumed you're left with a nifty gallon jug, perfect for smaller batches.

6. Yes, except for the yeast. Typical rule, one packet is good to 6 gallons or so.

7. It's typical to do primary fermentation in a food grade bucket with lots of headspace. Helps avoid blow off and if you're doing a real fruit batch it allows you to stir and remove the fruit when needed. Headspace is also driven by the yeast you use. Some create a lot of krausen. Others, like Montrachet, barely even bubble.

 

[PlayedDan]

First of all, thanks for organizing all your Qs in such a way that they're easy to address. Let's see how many I can answer before my thumbs get tired of typing on my phone.

A. You'll know when to siphon based on hydrometer readings. Rack it to secondary when the gravity is in the 1.010 - 1.020 range (usually around 5-7 days, depending on fermenting temp). As far as a bubbler goes (airlock), if you don't have one you can substitute with a drilled rubber stopper and a length of hose. Put the rubber stopper into the carboy, slip the hose into the rubber stopper, make sure it's a snug fit, and put the other end of the hose into a container of water. Voilà! Homemade airlock.

1. Yes. For future reference, if using a wine or champagne yeast it doesn't develop a krausen like a beer yeast.

2. Take a reading whenever you want. However the krausen should drop before you rack to secondary.

Not sure about the flavoring. And the plastic bottles will be fine if they're food grade and are rated for pressure, like a soda pop bottle.

3. No. To achieve a consistent carbonation level across every bottle you would prime the entire batch by racking the cider into a container with a sugar solution. The amount of sugar you use will be determined by the carbonation level you desire.

4. Put them any place where the temp is around 65-75F. Avoid direct sunlight.

5. Don't have any names for you, but here we can find one gallon glass jugs of cider at the local grocery store. After the cider had been consumed you're left with a nifty gallon jug, perfect for smaller batches.

6. Yes, except for the yeast. Typical rule, one packet is good to 6 gallons or so.

7. It's typical to do primary fermentation in a food grade bucket with lots of headspace. Helps avoid blow off and if you're doing a real fruit batch it allows you to stir and remove the fruit when needed. Headspace is also driven by the yeast you use. Some create a lot of krausen. Others, like Montrachet, barely even bubble.

I now have bubblers that I will be installing for my next brew.

1. Do you recommend using these instead of beer ones then?

2. I'll take a full reading after the whole week is up and see what it is the day after.

3. Well, this makes a lot more sense, how much sugar would I think about using for a 5 gallon brew? Also what do you mean by solution, what else would I put in?

4. I think the current temp is 24C, which is slightly over the range you said, would that be okay?

5. I think we have the same I'll look into it.

6. My understanding is it doesn't matter how much I put in aslong as it's enough due to it multiplying?

7. The first time I do it I will leave a fair bit of headspace, don't want any mess!

Thanks again for taking your time to answer my questions!

 

[TexasWine]

1. Do you recommend using these instead of beer ones then?

• Not at all. As an example, Nottingham is a go-to yeast for many cider makers and it's technically an ale yeast.

3. Well, this makes a lot more sense, how much sugar would I think about using for a 5 gallon brew? Also what do you mean by solution, what else would I put in?

•To determine the amount of sugar to add you need to arrive at how many volumes of CO2 you want. I'd start by thinking about beverages you enjoy the carbonation level of. Do some research to figure out how many volumes of CO2 those beverages have. Then use this calculator http://www.northernbrewer.com/priming-sugar-calculator/ to determine the amount of priming sugar you need. Then follow these directions for adding it.
http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter11-4.html

4. I think the current temp is 24C, which is slightly over the range you said, would that be okay?

•Yes, 24C will be just fine.

6. My understanding is it doesn't matter how much I put in aslong as it's enough due to it multiplying?

•Some folks get concerned about scaling the yeast with the other ingredients. Just use the same amount of yeast for everything between 1 and 6 gallons and you'll be fine.