Need some help clearing beer

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

I'm trying to take the next step in producing awesome beer. I've got my fermentation temperature controlled, my kegging system is going good, and my conversions are a respectable 70-80%. The next step for me is getting a crystal clear lager, and that's what I need help on.

I use whirlflock in the boil, and I've attempted to whirlpool. I say attempt because I don't have a pump to help me whirlpool. I manually stir the neck out of the wort after I've cooled it and wait 15-20 minutes. I've never been succesful getting the trub to mound in the center of the kettle, so all the trub ends up in the fermenter anyway. I then ferment, cold crash and fine with gelatin. Two or three days after fining, I keg the beer and lager it at 32%. I let the beer finish lagering while I begin carbonating it. I then serve the beer at 38°.

Using this procedure, I have never had any sediment in a pour. The beer is clear in that respect. However, I can't get it crystal clear to where you could read a newspaper through it. It seems to have a slight haze. What else can I do to get that crystal clear lager?

 

[Big Monk]

I'm trying to take the next step in producing awesome beer. I've got my fermentation temperature controlled, my kegging system is going good, and my conversions are a respectable 70-80%. The next step for me is getting a crystal clear lager, and that's what I need help on.

I use whirlflock in the boil, and I've attempted to whirlpool. I say attempt because I don't have a pump to help me whirlpool. I manually stir the neck out of the wort after I've cooled it and wait 15-20 minutes. I've never been succesful getting the trub to mound in the center of the kettle, so all the trub ends up in the fermenter anyway. I then ferment, cold crash and fine with gelatin. Two or three days after fining, I keg the beer and lager it at 32%. I let the beer finish lagering while I begin carbonating it. I then serve the beer at 38°.

Using this procedure, I have never had any sediment in a pour. The beer is clear in that respect. However, I can't get it crystal clear to where you could read a newspaper through it. It seems to have a slight haze. What else can I do to get that crystal clear lager?

We were just talking about this at our forum:

http://www.********************/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=402

So a high level clarity overview would be:

1.) Mash with a bag (pseudo mash filter)/gallotannins in mash (think Brewtan B)
2.) Remove hot break (whirlpool)
3.) Precipitate cold break and remove (chill fast and whirlpool)
4.) Use as high a floccing yeast as you can get away with
5.) Pitch trub free healthy yeast
6.) Carry over as little yeast as possible to serving vessel (while still getting the right carbonation)
7.) Lager properly (time and temperature)

You might be seeing the combined effects of 2.) and 3.)

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

Thanks Scotty. Do you have any tips on how I can more effectively manually whirlpool?

 

[Big Monk]

Thanks Scotty. Do you have any tips on how I can more effectively manually whirlpool?

I've only ever done it with a pump so I can't help there. Sorry!

Many people do it many different ways but ideally you'd have a non-immersion chiller (CFC or Plate) that could drop temps rapidly (drop out cold break) and a pump feeding a whirlpool inlet (to "gather" hot break, cold break and trub).

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

Hmmm....I may be doing as good as my set up will allow. I may need to increase my batch size, so I can leave more in the boil kettle rather than transferring it all to the fermentor.

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

Since my setup doesn't allow for whirlpooling very effectively, is there some other type of filtering system that I can use when tranferring from boil kettle to fermentor? FWIW, I use an immersion chiller and then just gravity the wort into a carboy or bucket.

 

[Morrey]

Seems you are doing everything right based on your current equipment. You mention cold crashing which is the right time to add gelatin after the temps are down. When you crash make sure you step it down slowly as too fast can set protein haze. I made this mistake when I first started using a glycol chiller and crashed in an hour. I now go slowly about 5 degrees every 6 hours or there about.

You may want to try filtering, and if done correctly is effective producing crystal clear beer. I made my own filter using a clear plastic water filter housing, a polyspun filter, some barbs, QD's and hoses. Pretty easy and you can filter either your carbed beer or still beer prior to carbing by pushing with CO2 with the filter inline between kegs.

I like to strain my wort going into fermenter. Try using a 5G paint strainer bag from Home Depot. Run your wort into the fermenter and let the bag filter out your trub and break material. Bag can be rinsed and reused.

 

[Morrey]

gallotannins in mash (think Brewtan B)

Do you have a source for BtB in the US?

 

[Big Monk]

Do you have a source for BtB in the US?

I believe Brewcraft has made it available for order for homebrew shops.

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

Seems you are doing everything right based on your current equipment. You mention cold crashing which is the right time to add gelatin after the temps are down. When you crash make sure you step it down slowly as too fast can set protein haze. I made this mistake when I first started using a glycol chiller and crashed in an hour. I now go slowly about 5 degrees every 6 hours or there about.

You may want to try filtering, and if done correctly is effective producing crystal clear beer. I made my own filter using a clear plastic water filter housing, a polyspun filter, some barbs, QD's and hoses. Pretty easy and you can filter either your carbed beer or still beer prior to carbing by pushing with CO2 with the filter inline between kegs.

I like to strain my wort going into fermenter. Try using a 5G paint strainer bag from Home Depot. Run your wort into the fermenter and let the bag filter out your trub and break material. Bag can be rinsed and reused.

I may try the straining method. I have a BIAB bag. I don't know why I didn't think to use it. Can I sanitize it then line the fermentation bucket with it, transfer the wort, then lift the bag out?

 

[Morrey]

I may try the straining method. I have a BIAB bag. I don't know why I didn't think to use it. Can I sanitize it then line the fermentation bucket with it, transfer the wort, then lift the bag out?

Absolutely as the mesh size of that BIAB bag will be perfect to strain going into fermenter. This should give you a head start towards clear beer as a finished product.

 

[guldalian]

Could also try a decoction or step mash with a short protein rest.

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

I may have to try a decccoction. I'd like to do a step mash, but my current setup is in a cooler, so once I dough in my temp is where it's going to be. I am going to try filtering with the bag going into the fermenter first and see where that gets me. Here is the clearest beer I've produced to date. It's an altbier, and as you can see it's clear enough to see my fingers through but still has a slight haze. I drank a Weihenstephaner Festbier last night and it's like looking through a window. I would live to produce one with that kind of clarity.

 

[mashinary]

Have you tried Clarity Ferm? It reduces chill haze and that looks like it could be chill haze. For what it's worth I don't use gelatin, just whirfloc and clarity ferm and I get crystal clear beer.

 

[guldalian]

I may have to try a decccoction. I'd like to do a step mash, but my current setup is in a cooler, so once I dough in my temp is where it's going to be. I am going to try filtering with the bag going into the fermenter first and see where that gets me. Here is the clearest beer I've produced to date. It's an altbier, and as you can see it's clear enough to see my fingers through but still has a slight haze. I drank a Weihenstephaner Festbier last night and it's like looking through a window. I would live to produce one with that kind of clarity.

I just did a step mash in my cooler mash tun. Just gotta start a bit thick and use boiling water infusions to heat it to the next step.

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

So apparently I was too quick to judge the clarity of my beer. After about the 5th pour, it is really, really clear. I mean read newsprint through it clear. I guess the first few pours were clearing out the junk that the gelatin dropped out of it. Thanks for all of your help and ideas. I am still going to incorporate some of them into my process. I think I’ll still try to filter the wort, because I’m just not a fan of all that trub being in the fermenter. I also still want to incorporate step mashes into my brew day, too. I think these thing will contribute to making my beer even better.