NB's "Super Chiller"

[Ize]

Anyone use use one of Northern Brewer's "Super Chillers"?

According to NB; "The super chiller features water turbulation technology installed inside the copper tubing. This turbulent flow puts more cold water in thermal contact with the copper walls, making these the most fastest immersion chillers on the market today."

In the end, the question is, is it worth the extra 10 bucks compared to their regular chiller?

Ize

 

[Bobby_M]

I doubt there's more than a 2-3 minute advantage. Getting hot wort to contact the coil constantly is more of a factor than getting cold water to the edges of the coil is a given. It's a small enough column that I really doubt the "center" is really colder than the outer column. Bottom line, my 3/8" OD x 40' standard coil is extremely fast (under 10 minutes).

 

[Gregg Meyer]

Wht is cooling speed important? I have a conventional chiller, imersion, copper and it takes 10-15 mins to cool to 80 depending on how high I have the water
flow set. Is the flavor that much different. Do the big boys Bud, Miller, and the like, chill to 80 in seconds?

 

[KopyKat]

Is the flavor that much different.

No doubt the flavor change, if any, would be so slight that not even Michael Jackson could tell the difference.

The real upside in my opinion is the 3 minutes saved. I brewed 15 times in 2006 and that would be 45 minutes saved. At 59 years old every minute counts!

 

[Bobby_M]

It would be pretty tough to test. You'd have to be absolutely certain that both kettles are being whirlpooled at the same rate because it's such a crucial factor. Faster cooling can be done by:

Whirlpooling
Colder water
Faster water flow

 

[Ize]

All excellent points. Faster is better tho, so i'll probably spend the extra 10 bucks...


Ize

 

[runhard]

I was told by an experienced brewer that DMS is more likely to form the longer the temperature remains above 140°F or 60°C. Has anyone else heard similar. I'll do some reading to see if that is true or not. I know that empirically while not directly testing I get less chill haze when I cool the wort from boiling to pitching temperatures in 10 minutes or less. While not a good experiment it does seem to allow me to have near crystal clear beers.

 

[user 4295]

I don't know about the super IC's, but I can tell you that in my field (industrial refrigeration) when a customer wants to have the most efficient chiller (big machine that makes 40˚F chillwater for use in cooling a whole building) they purchase the "enhanced tube" option for the shell and tubes heat exchangers.

The copper tubes (several hundred to thousands) in the condenser and evaporator shells (up to 30' long) have rifling in them, not unlike a gun barrel. The rifling not only increases the surface area of the tube, but creates turbulence in the water which increases the heat transfer. So the science behind what NB is claiming about their superchillers is sound.

John

 

[Yooper]

I was thinking about getting the superchiller last night for one reason only- it says it uses 40% less water. I think in one year your water savings would pay for the chiller, depending on how often you brew. I hate wasting ANYTHING, and seeing all that nice water go down the drain is hard for me.

Lorena

 

[Bobby_M]

You are catching that hot/warm output water in a container to use in post-brew cleanup aren't you?

 

[HeaterAllen]

I was told by an experienced brewer that DMS is more likely to form the longer the temperature remains above 140°F or 60°C.

This is true, particularly where you have a slower fermentation, as in lagers. The more violent fermentation with ales will clean out most of the DMS. I had a real problem with the lighter lagers I was brewing until I figured this out. Now I go through all sorts of steps to cool the wort as fast as possible.

I'm stepping up to 20 to 25 gallons batches (this is the beginnings of going commercial), and I'm buying a plate chiller so that I can quickly chill the wort. Actually, I'll run it through the counterflow chiller first and then through the plate chiller.

 

[NNE_Brewery]

I'm stepping up to 20 to 25 gallons batches (this is the beginnings of going commercial), and I'm buying a plate chiller so that I can quickly chill the wort. Actually, I'll run it through the counterflow chiller first and then through the plate chiller.

HeaterAllen - I recently went from a good counterflow chiller to a Therminator - it's no contest. I can now chill 22 gal. from boiling down to 65F in less than 20 min. I haven't tried both together, but I don't think using the counterflow in front of the Therminator would speed things up much. Regards, Paul

 

[HeaterAllen]

Paul,
You're probably right. I'll try it with and without to see if it helps at all.

Rick Allen

 

[alemonkey]

I hate wasting ANYTHING, and seeing all that nice water go down the drain is hard for me.

Lorena

I water my lawn with the discharge, but some people would say that's a waste, too

 

[EdWort]

I hate wasting ANYTHING, and seeing all that nice water go down the drain is hard for me. Lorena

I use well water and the discharge goes into a dry creek. The birds love it till it returns back to the ground. I look at it as a round trip for it. The birds and I get a benefit on its trip.

 

[Yooper]

You are catching that hot/warm output water in a container to use in post-brew cleanup aren't you?

I only need a little for cleanup, really. And I brew indoors, so the rest would go down the sink. I still don't have my own wort chiller, but I borrow my friend's. Once the 10 gallon igloo is 1/2 full, I really don't need any more water. I guess I could put a couple of gallons in my bottling bucket for rinse water. But that means hauling the bottling bucket up from the basement, just to have a container to put the water in. I don't know- but it seems like the super chiller would be good, just for that reason.

Lorena

 

[knipknup]

Don't worry, it will go down the drain and get recycled by the city then back to your house... Of course, they are happy to send you another bill at the end of the month - just a wee bit higher...

 

[Pumbaa]

Lorena I take it you dont live close to either one of the lakes?

One nice thing about living in Milwaukee (or anywhere on the Great Lakes) any water I "waste" ends up right back where I got it from all ready and just waiting for me to waste it again.

Drink, pee, and flush all day long . . . it's not wasting, it's recycling

OK back on topic . . .
I deal with water turbulance all the time at work and the principle sounds logical . . . but my tap water is 55f in August so I dont think I would spend the extra cash

 

[John Beere]

Jamil Zainasheff (aka Mr. Malty) wrote an article about combining an immersion chiller and a recirculating pump to whirlpool the wort in the latest issue of Zymurgy. He goes on to scienticically explain how much better it cools when the wort is constantly whirlpooling and is now uses this method exclusively.

The logic is sound but I don't understand why you couldn't just give the wort a good swirl every 30 seconds or so...

 

[knipknup]

I'm not convinced that 5 minutes faster cooling will make any difference at all. I use a standard 50' immersion wort chiller and stir about every 2 minutes. My wort hits 75F in about 15-20 minutes. The 5 minute variation here probably has to do with what temp my house and my tap water are. To spend another $50 or more to gain 2 minutes isn't going to add anything.
Maybe you will get a warm fuzzy that you are cooling at the maximum rate and that is worth $50 or more to you - go for it.
However, enjoy cleaning that extra stuff and don't forget you added one more potential source of contaminants.
The only reason I see to do this experiment is the nerdy scientific interest in exactly how different the cooling rates are. Beer is good, drink up!

 

[the_bird]

Jamil Zainasheff (aka Mr. Malty) wrote an article about combining an immersion chiller and a recirculating pump to whirlpool the wort in the latest issue of Zymurgy. He goes on to scienticically explain how much better it cools when the wort is constantly whirlpooling and is now uses this method exclusively.

The logic is sound but I don't understand why you couldn't just give the wort a good swirl every 30 seconds or so...

That was a good issue

I was going to post something about Jamil's design. It's interesting, but then again, I was able to cool my last wort down to under 75 in just about ten minutes using my uber-ghetto chiller. I did, however, stir pretty constantly (unfortunately without thinking too much about HSA, but I was pretty careful regardless).

 

[John Beere]

Has he got anything new in the article that's not covered by his web page here: Mr Malty Whirlpool Chiller?

That looks like pretty much the same article... definitely the same photos.

 

[John Beere]

That was a good issue

Yeah it was - except some guy named "Gabe" seeming stole my whole walk-in cooler idea and wrote an article about it... heh

 

[the_bird]

Yeah it was - except some guy named "Gabe" seeming stole my whole walk-in cooler idea and wrote an article about it... heh

He stole your logo, too! The bastid!

At least he gave props to HomeBrewTalk...