My beer has changed while in keg - weird!

[kharper6]

So I brewed a saison about 4 weeks ago. Siphoned it into a keg, purged all of the oxygen out, made sure my keg had zero leaks, then put it in the fridge at 45 degrees under 25 psi for about 2.5-3 days. Did all of the standard carbonating/kegging stuff etc.

The first 1.5 gallons of the keg or so were perfect. All of the saison flavor was there, it was great. cloudy, perfect beer. Now that I'm down to about 2 gallons left, the beer has changed dramatically.

It is almost crystal clear and has lost a lot of the saison flavor. Now it just tastes like a very high ABV pilsner (pilsner malt was on the bill). I'm really confused by this. I didn't use any refining agents. There are no leaks in my keg. I purged the keg plenty.

Anyone have any ideas?

 

[dickproenneke]

Keezers have a tendency to be colder at the bottom than at the top. Very cold beer will have less flavor than a beer served at 45F. Do you use a fan in your keezer to maintain a more consistent temperature? It's a cheap fix.

 

[LLBeanJ]

Sounds like your yeast settled out, which is pretty typical. Think of it as a giant bottle with a nice cake of yeast packed on the bottom. If you want the yeast back in suspension, pull the keg out and agitate it a bit to rouse the yeast.

 

[brewguyver]

Saison flavor can change over time, and it sounds like you're seeing effects of a pseudo cold crash. If you don't need to drink/serve it immediately, try shaking the keg up a little bit to get the stuff on the bottom (if any) back in suspension.

 

[brewguyver]

Also, this happens to me all the time.


On the bright side, it doesn't sound like you've got an infection going.

 

[kharper6]

I'm more than obsessive with my sanitation to the point where that is the last thing I'd think of. I'll pop it open and check.

I have a fan installed in my mini fridge (I serve from a picnic stout) and the temperature probe is near the bottom 1/4 of the keg surrounded by insulation so it isn't effected by ambient temps.

I'll agitate the beer a little bit.

This is a great example how how much yeast effects the flavor! I'll let you guys know what happens.


Is this something I should expect to do with kegging? Every week or so pull my keg out and agitate it? I really don't mind I'd just like to know if I have to do this with all of my beers in the future as I basically get entire kegs to myself (I work too much for a social life right now lol)

 

[bknifefight]

Keezers have a tendency to be colder at the bottom than at the top. Very cold beer will have less flavor than a beer served at 45F. Do you use a fan in your keezer to maintain a more consistent temperature? It's a cheap fix.

All kegs pull beer from the bottom, so he would have been getting the coldest beer in the keg all the time.

It's an issue of yeast settling out is all.

 

[dickproenneke]

Is this something I should expect to do with kegging? Every week or so pull my keg out and agitate it?

Depends on the style. Saison should be hazy, pilsner not so much

 

[dickproenneke]

All kegs pull beer from the bottom, so he would have been getting the coldest beer in the keg all the time.

It's an issue of yeast settling out is all.

Thanks for pointing that out

 

[Stauffbier]

My saisons, both bottled and kegged, lose their saison character after time. I tend to like them better that way, so I guess I don't consider it a problem.

 

[kharper6]

My saisons, both bottled and kegged, lose their saison character after time. I tend to like them better that way, so I guess I don't consider it a problem.

Yeah but mine lost just about everything good about it in only a week. :cross:

 

[brewguyver]

All kegs pull beer from the bottom, so he would have been getting the coldest beer in the keg all the time.

It's an issue of yeast settling out is all.

I'm wondering if it settled and most of the yeast got pulled. To OP - how's the troubleshooting going?

 

[kharper6]

I'm wondering if it settled and most of the yeast got pulled. To OP - how's the troubleshooting going?

That is what I'm afraid of. I saved the yeast, a lot of it, it's in a mason jar in the fridge as per the yeast washing instructions i found here.

I opened it, inspected it, no infection. agitated it. Will try some later after I get my day finished, can't drink right now, finals to take and gym to hit!

 

[Ster]

The clearest beer I ever brewed was a cloudy wheat beer that became crystal clear in the keg.

In my opinion the taste wasn't affected, and others were impressed by the looks.

 

[kharper6]

Could I get away with spooning some yeast back into my beer before agitation to restore that flavor/haze?

I have plenty and I pulled it directly off of the yeast cake of this beer in primary

 

[opiate82]

I would shake the keg up first to see if you can get the yeast that is settled out in the bottom of the keg back into suspension.

 

[brewguyver]

The clearest beer I ever brewed was a cloudy wheat beer that became crystal clear in the keg.

In my opinion the taste wasn't affected, and others were impressed by the looks.

After about a year in bottles (if they make it that long), almost all of my lighter beers (hefes included) settle out. But that's a big difference from 4 weeks post kegging.

I had a few beers change flavor characteristics quickly, but many times it turns out to be what I ate or drank beforehand.

Could I get away with spooning some yeast back into my beer before agitation to restore that flavor/haze?

I have plenty and I pulled it directly off of the yeast cake of this beer in primary

I read a thread a while back about yeast dispensers at German beer halls. You could always grow up some of that yeast and add it in (seems a waste to do that with the stuff you just washed). If you don't care, try it in a pint. That will help you figure out the problem.

 

[kharper6]

LOL so I went to check on the beer and agitate it, keg is almost empty. I guess that would explain my lack of yeast, I agitated what was left. Guess I Went through this keg faster than I thought, I have been giving out drafts to guests a lot lately.

 

[Johnnyhitch1]

As a keg emptys the lighter (colder) air will cause the beer to chill further.

Colder beer disguises flavors, try warming it up (leave beer on counter for 5-10 min before drinking) and see if that helps.

 

[kharper6]

As a keg emptys the lighter (colder) air will cause the beer to chill further.

Colder beer disguises flavors, try warming it up (leave beer on counter for 5-10 min before drinking) and see if that helps.

I took temp of the beer, it is 46 after I pour it.

It is crystal clear though, I think the consensus is right. The yeast dropped out of suspension and I poured it all out with the first few gallons, by the time I got to the last gallon it was just clear and lacking in the flavor.


Is there a way to keep yeast in suspension in cold condition besides agitating the keg every few days?

 

[dickproenneke]

Is there a way to keep yeast in suspension in cold condition besides agitating the keg every few days?

I think it's just the nature of kegged beer. Agitating is probably your best option to keep yeasties in suspension. Otherwise you could always bottle your Belgians, saisons and hefes to guarantee there's always some yeast left to enjoy

 

[IL1kebeer]

Keezers have a tendency to be colder at the bottom than at the top. Very cold beer will have less flavor than a beer served at 45F. Do you use a fan in your keezer to maintain a more consistent temperature? It's a cheap fix.

Additionally, when the beer gets colder it will be more carbonated if kept at the same temperature. That will make a noticeable difference in the taste.

 

[dlester]

What has not been addressed with Kegging, Keezers etc., is that beer settles into layers. That's right, heavier ingredients fall towards the bottom, light remain at the top. It changes the beer's flavor and clarifies over time. You have to pick up the keg weekly and shake it. I you don't like the cloudiness, clarify the beer prior to kegging.

Good luck,

 

[kharper6]

What has not been addressed with Kegging, Keezers etc., is that beer settles into layers. That's right, heavier ingredients fall towards the bottom, light remain at the top. It changes the beer's flavor and clarifies over time. You have to pick up the keg weekly and shake it. I you don't like the cloudiness, clarify the beer prior to kegging.

Good luck,

I think it really comes down to the beer. As a science student I am more than aware of this, but I didn't really take into account yeast flocculation over a weeks time with carbonation and temperature. Agitation will be the name of the game then.

The cloudiness depends on the beer for me. A saison should be cloudy IMO. An IPA on the other hand, will have such a strong hop and malt backbone that yeast (from my experience my cali ale yeast is fairly flavorless) can be removed via gelatin for a clear beer.

The last few beers have been a heck of a learning experience for me personally, kegging is great, i'm glad I made the shift. Now if I could just get my hands on a few more kegs....

 

[kharper6]

Just poured myself a glass after agitation. It's so murky I can barely distinguish the head from the beer! Tastes amazing!

Wish I had done this before so it would've been a bit more evenly distributed.

 

[brewguyver]

Just poured myself a glass after agitation. It's so murky I can barely distinguish the head from the beer! Tastes amazing!

Wish I had done this before so it would've been a bit more evenly distributed.

So - problem solved?

I brought a keg of SWMBO slayer to a party over the summer - the car ride turned it into mud. Tasted great, though slightly chewy.

 

[dlester]

You should consider racking to a new keg instead of shaking or taking to a party the first time. Although it fixes the settling, it shakes up the old yeast and possibly trub from the kettle. There are also some great threads on cheaply clarifying your beer prior to racking,

 

[Johnnyhitch1]

I took temp of the beer, it is 46 after I pour it.

It is crystal clear though, I think the consensus is right. The yeast dropped out of suspension and I poured it all out with the first few gallons, by the time I got to the last gallon it was just clear and lacking in the flavor.


Is there a way to keep yeast in suspension in cold condition besides agitating the keg every few days?

Use a less flocculent strain.