Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
I was wondering if I could put my hard cider in mason jars? I haven't heard of this before so I don't know if it's ok.
Mason jars for my Cider?
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step
Well-Known Member
Seems like an interesting idea especially if you wanted to back sweeten however you sacrifice any ability to carbonate
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Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
Really I would think you could carb because they seal air tight.
step
Well-Known Member
I was thinking you would be "canning" and thus would be applying sufficient heat to kill any residual/suspended yeast
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Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
step said:
Why canning? I'm new to this whole cider business.
step
Well-Known Member
Sorry. it was just where my mind jumped when I read "mason jars." Again, I think this might be great for backsweeting, but come to think of it you might vaporize some alcohol by canning.
Come on cider experts chime in on this, I am just spouting bull**** here and would like to hear, rather, read some experienced responses.
Come on cider experts chime in on this, I am just spouting bull**** here and would like to hear, rather, read some experienced responses.
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Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
step said:
Lol. Like I said all this is new to me. Backsweetening is when you add sugars or things of that nature after fermentation to give it flavor?
BoomerCreek
Well-Known Member
What about just heating the jars up before the cider is poured in. If they were freshly taken out of the dishwasher or heated up some other way they may be hot enough to seal the jar up without killing the beasties. I don't know what would happen when the pressure changed from jar conditioning after though. Let us know what happens.
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Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
BoomerCreek said:
Worst case, I have a ton of cider to finish in a small amount of time. Lol.
step
Well-Known Member
Have you sampled what you have? Do you want it sweeter? Do you want carbonation? If you like it where its at then by all means mason jar it given some standard sanitation process
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Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
step said:
I haven't made it yet. Being made tomorrow.
commonsenseman
Well-Known Member
I have found in my experience jarring up pipe-tobacco, that mason jars seal airtight without heating them up to pop the lids down. Of course, in the case of tobacco, aging creates negative pressure & sucks the lids down after a few months. I'm guessing that they seal pretty well anyway though. Maybe give a few a try along with some regular bottles to see how it works out.
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Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
It would be sparkling not still I figure it would still work. Also I just want want 50 mason jars lol.
smyrnaquince
Well-Known Member
Mason jars depend on a partial vacuum to keep the lids pulled down tight. You would have an internal pressure above ambient. If you keep the rings on, the pressure of the ring may keep the seal in the presence of the internal pressure, but I'd consider this an experiment and not something to count on.
dinnerstick
Well-Known Member
my money's on it not working, for exactly the reason above; the rings aren't meant to hold the seal, the negative internal pressure (suction) is.
that said, i can't see anything terrible happening, other than the seals not holding positive pressure and eventually the cider morphing into salad dressing, but if the seals leak at least you know the jars won't explode!
i'd say definitely test one first, seal a jar with priming sugar and yeast and see what happens. if it holds at least some of the CO2, say 1.5 atm, then at least you know outside air isn't entering and thus even if you don't get good carbonation you won't make vinegar.
Personally I would not under any circumstances try to carbonate a cider in a mason jar. First, the lids are designed to hold under vacuum, not pressure. They actually release pressure during the canning process, to account for expansion of the food inside them. Second, in the unlikely event that you do manage to seal them against pressure, they are quite a different animal from a beer or wine bottle. The glass is quite thin and has a lot of surface area for the volume. There's a reason home canning instructions always say not to disturb the jars, and especially not to bump them, until they have completely cooled and the vacuum has been established. It is because until that happens they are under pressure from the hot food and extremely fragile.
That said, I don't see why you couldn't put still cider in them, as long as you are absolutely certain that fermentation is finished. You might sanitize the jars and lids, and gently warm the cider just enough to create a slight vacuum as it cools.
That said, I don't see why you couldn't put still cider in them, as long as you are absolutely certain that fermentation is finished. You might sanitize the jars and lids, and gently warm the cider just enough to create a slight vacuum as it cools.
commonsenseman
Well-Known Member
I guess I wasn't thinking sparkling cider, that probably would be dangerous. Still cider should be fine though.
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Scruffy1207
Well-Known Member
Hmmm ok I didn't have a full understanding of the mechanics of a mason jar. Fair enough, I'll just collect some bottles together for the batch. And get mason jars for a batch of still cider. Thanks for the info!
I have around 8 gallons of cider sitting in quart mason jars, they are all still ciders but the mason jars do work if it is still. I bottled them and then ran then through a dish washer cycle, to pasteurize them. They come out at around 145 degrees. some have been in there for about 6 months and are doing great.
That's practically the same as canning in a hot water bath, so that they should be ideal for something like that.
lextasy23
Well-Known Member
I make beer, and we can food also. Never combined, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't think of it. I did the opposite though... I used beer bottles to bottle this year's first bbq sauce batch. A bottle of that, and a small jar of rub makes a great summer gift.
The hot water bath is 212 not 145. Botulism is what you have to worry about with canned foods low in acid like meats, but anything acidic like citrus is fine in just boiling water. The pressure canner goes for 60-90 mins at 15psi, somewhere in the neighborhood of 250-260 degrees i believe. A dishwasher is NOT sufficient for sanitizing bottles or jars. (Though I'm curious about running a load with StarSan...)
But ya, they're designed to hold a vacuum not positive pressure. I'd agree that still cider would be fine. You could sweeten it with Xylitol (natural sugar alcohol), since it's not fermentable, but anything carbonated you're just going to have jar bombs.
The hot water bath is 212 not 145. Botulism is what you have to worry about with canned foods low in acid like meats, but anything acidic like citrus is fine in just boiling water. The pressure canner goes for 60-90 mins at 15psi, somewhere in the neighborhood of 250-260 degrees i believe. A dishwasher is NOT sufficient for sanitizing bottles or jars. (Though I'm curious about running a load with StarSan...)
But ya, they're designed to hold a vacuum not positive pressure. I'd agree that still cider would be fine. You could sweeten it with Xylitol (natural sugar alcohol), since it's not fermentable, but anything carbonated you're just going to have jar bombs.
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It's rather simple:
The band is made to hold the lid down until heat(vapor) is pushed out under the lid. That's why most canning books/etc tell you to only partially fill the pressure cooker
The band isn't used much at all after the jars goes into a vacuum (when chilled). In fact, I frequently remove the bands after the jars have cooled down partially. This prevents them from sticking to the glass jar when I boil jars of starter.
The lid+band CAN hold positive pressure, but that's not their intended purpose and they will leak out over time.
For still cider, it would probably work as the pressure is minimal if any at all.
M_C
The band is made to hold the lid down until heat(vapor) is pushed out under the lid. That's why most canning books/etc tell you to only partially fill the pressure cooker
The band isn't used much at all after the jars goes into a vacuum (when chilled). In fact, I frequently remove the bands after the jars have cooled down partially. This prevents them from sticking to the glass jar when I boil jars of starter.
The lid+band CAN hold positive pressure, but that's not their intended purpose and they will leak out over time.
For still cider, it would probably work as the pressure is minimal if any at all.
M_C
lextasy23 said:
I ran a jar of just water through first to get a temp reading when it came out , and it was 145 when it was finished with a cycle. The cycle on my washer runs for about 60 mins on the normal setting and 90 mins on the high temp scour setting.
I didn't mean to suggest that a dishwasher would be equivalent to a boiling water canner as far as protection from botulism or anything like that. Hope nobody took it that way. But I could see it working for sealing still cider into jars by heating them so as to cause a vacuum seal when they cooled. It could also serve to pasteurize and make sure fermentation was stopped. But of course it would never serve as a substitute for proper sanitation.
Rayshine.sims
New Member
How did it go? As someone who is thinking of using canning techniques to kill my yeast/keep my still mead/cider combo, I’d love to hear thoughts. I added a bit of hops (didn’t read up enough, so now i have to figure out how to stop any and all fermentation and rack at 10 days.) Ik im running a risk of jar bombs if i dont try and kill the yeast, and the double boil esk theory of canning was the best idea I’ve came up with, in pairing with my normal potassium sorbate method when i rack to keep yeast from multiplying. Much appreciated friends, look forward to hearing your tips and tricks!
They might not remember, as it was 13 years ago ; )
If you're pasturizing, and not going to carbonation, should be fine? I'd personally keep it cold or in a sealed plastic bin, but I'm nuts.
Rayshine.sims
New Member
Nope, not gonna make it sparkling and i dont think I’ll be backsweetening much, as i used 1 part diet cranberry juice, 1 part apple cider, and honey to supplement the lack of sugars in the diet cran. (made sure that it didnt have any chemicals that would lead to bad tastes or halts in fermentation). Once they cool off from the boiling water bath imma put them immediately in the fridge.
It seems that I’ll be racking in the next upcoming few days. I’ll come back here and let you know what it turns out like and give y’all updates on the possible catastrophes.
Welcome to HBT! I think that the method you're considering is way more than you need to kill off the yeast. I'd also be concerned that that much heat might negatively affect your mead by cooking it. Not sure about that but wouldn't risk if there's a way to avoid it.
You can put your lidded jars of backsweetened mead in your pot along one of water without a lid. Add water to the bottom of the lid, apply heat, bring the temperature up to 160°F (checking with your thermometer in the jar of water), remove jars from hot water and cool. This will pasteurize, killing the yeast without excess heat.
If you're not backsweeting and you let your ferment finish, you don't need to do this. Good luck!
You can put your lidded jars of backsweetened mead in your pot along one of water without a lid. Add water to the bottom of the lid, apply heat, bring the temperature up to 160°F (checking with your thermometer in the jar of water), remove jars from hot water and cool. This will pasteurize, killing the yeast without excess heat.
If you're not backsweeting and you let your ferment finish, you don't need to do this. Good luck!
Rayshine.sims
New Member
The reason im being so careful is the fact I’m not letting it ferment the full month i would had i not made that stupid hops mistake. I have to rack at half the time cause i dont want green, grassy lawn clipping aromatics and flavors in there (if it hasn’t already started). I’ve read that heat denatures the flavor of honey, so i was thinking of running the hot water bath for about 140°f for about 20 minutes, this should keep me from heating the honey too much and stay far away from that 170°f boiling point of alcohol!
Rayshine.sims
New Member
The sorbates are just incase this doesn’t fully work and some yeasts are left behind. About half the head of foam is still up, which is how I normally track how my fermentation is going, but here we are, and i need to get the liquid off the loose dry hops…
Ripperoni baloney, it still ought to taste good tho, just gonna be a bit weaker then average. I unfortunately dont have a hydrometer, so i cant check ABV, but i will let y’all know the results when i get to trying it. Another thought i had was fortification, but imo thats a bit cheaty and I’m mainly making this as a gift idea to the person who got me back into homebrewing! Imma probably drink a glass before i rack (after pasteurization) just to get a benchmark of how it was before aging, and then I’ll just update that as it goes!
