Looking to brew my first IPA using malt extract. Tips on good extracts and priming tips?

[ATLBeer]

I'd listen to Miraculix above. I've evolved my recipes to where I like it, but haven't started from scratch like where you are. I also brew all grain IPAs, so wasn't looking at your malt volume.

As another point of reference, the extract wheat I make for my wife has only 60 g of hops in it, so I guess I'm all over the board.

 

[Matheos]

Hmm okay. I just now read about the BU:GU ratios (IBU to Gravity Unit). They say here that for example an Imperial IPA could have a ratio of 1 or more while a maltier style doppelbock could be 0.5 or less. As my OG in the recipe is now 1.048, that would mean that I could have a IBU of 48 for a ratio of 1? But probably I am making it too easy because that would mean I would want a bitterness higher than my 48 from the gravity points? Or is it the other way around

 

[Miraculix]

oh okay. Got it. What does onus mean? sorry.. stepping grains?

Ibus, was ab typo.

 

[Miraculix]

Hmm okay. I just now read about the BU:GU ratios (IBU to Gravity Unit). They say here that for example an Imperial IPA could have a ratio of 1 or more while a maltier style doppelbock could be 0.5 or less. As my OG in the recipe is now 1.048, that would mean that I could have a IBU of 48 for a ratio of 1? But probably I am making it too easy because that would mean I would want a bitterness higher than my 48 from the gravity points? Or is it the other way around

Yes, too easy. It's all about personal taste here. What's your favourite beer? Do you like super bitter beer? Like stone IPA?

 

[Matheos]

Yes, too easy. It's all about personal taste here. What's your favourite beer? Do you like super bitter beer? Like stone IPA?

Think I have ever had a stone IPA ones, so I can't really remember. I love me a Punk IPA from brewdog. So maybe that bitterness could be a target? That one uses a million different hops though so it is a bit out of my skillset for a first batch, but in terms of IBU maybe?

Adjusted the recipe slightly and rounded up the hops numbers. gives a bit higher bitterness (26,9 with the same OG). Read up that it is a dying trend that IPAs need to be super bitter. Not sure what to believe though.

 

[Miraculix]

Think I have ever had a stone IPA ones, so I can't really remember. I love me a Punk IPA from brewdog. So maybe that bitterness could be a target? That one uses a million different hops though so it is a bit out of my skillset for a first batch, but in terms of IBU maybe?

Adjusted the recipe slightly and rounded up the hops numbers. gives a bit higher bitterness (26,9 with the same OG). Read up that it is a dying trend that IPAs need to be super bitter. Not sure what to believe though.

Go super easy on this. Just one hop, as mentioned above, this will teach you how this hop tastes. Next time, use another hop. I would go with either Chinook, or Simcoe. These are classics. So is cascade and centennial. Pick one, I would pick one of the first two, because they are my favourite American hops and they will also give you a punk IPA type of direction.

Only do two additions, bittering and dry. This is classic and gives you everything you need. The botteling process I have outlined above is crucial, otherwise you will lose the flavour to oxygen.

And fill the sugar into the bottles before the beer gets in!

I think punk IPA has 35-40 ibus max, so I would aim for 35 with your current og.

Edit: googled it, punk has 35 ibus!

 

[Matheos]

Go super easy on this. Just one hop, as mentioned above, this will teach you how this hop tastes. Next time, use another hop. I would go with either Chinook, or Simcoe. These are classics. So is cascade and centennial. Pick one, I would pick one of the first two, because they are my favourite American hops and they will also give you a punk IPA type of direction.

Only do two additions, bittering and dry. This is classic and gives you everything you need. The botteling process I have outlined above is crucial, otherwise you will lose the flavour to oxygen.

And fill the sugar into the bottles before the beer gets in!

I think punk IPA has 35-40 ibus max, so I would aim for 35 with your current og.

More and more great info! I will decrease my "hoppings". Thanks! What ratios would be adviseable for bittering vs dry? Also at what time is ideal for bittering? Think I will take your advice and opt for Chinook instead of cascade!

EDIT: I played around and noted that 65g Chinook at 15min will give me 35 IBU Sounds good? Then for the dry hop I have no clue for the amount, but I think I want a lot... +100g dry hop Chinook at 7 days?

Regarding the bottling process, I think I had some question earlier left unanswered. Did you mean that I fill them pretty well, then pull the stick out and the volume of the stick is appropriate left over in the bottle for air? And then I squeeze the bottle, making it dented, so that the beer is all the way up til the rim, and then screw on the lid?

And fill the sugar into the bottles before the beer gets in!

Thanks for this! I have been trying to figure this out so many times. I thought this would be the best way, but I was also scared that by filling the sugar first, I could introduce extra oxygen?

 

[jrgtr42]

For that brew, one packet of dried yeast will work fine. Best bet would be to rehydrate it in 50 or 100 |ml warm water before pitching.
As others have said, don't get too hung up on proper, and exact right now - you're in the learning phase. |What we're looking at now is to get your procedures down so later you'll be able to concentrate on specific areas to improve.
As someone said, do a bit of reading - Papazian's Complete Joy of Homebrewing and Palmer's How to Brew are both indispensible in my opinoin to any brewer. Palmer is more in the scientific and numbers area, and |Papazian is more of a 'feel' guy. Neither approach is right or wrong. |How to Brew is availble online for free - however it's the first edition, and he's changed his mind about quite a few things since then.
For a 19l (5gallon) batch, |I would recommend (personally...) to do a boil, for as much as you comfortably can. Personally, I found that much less than half the batch boiled didn't give me as good a result, so something like a 12l pot should be comfortable. Top off with cold water in the fermenter will bring to to about pitching temp.
You can certainly experiment with whatever you have at the moment, and upgrade from there as needed.
IMO the most important things is to make sure your extract is fresh as possible, and keep tabs on the fermentation temps. Other than that, sanitize, sanitize, sanitize. If things aren't clean, you will never make good beer.

 

[Miraculix]

More and more great info! I will decrease my "hoppings". Thanks! What ratios would be adviseable for bittering vs dry? Also at what time is ideal for bittering? Think I will take your advice and opt for Chinook instead of cascade!

EDIT: I played around and noted that 65g Chinook at 15min will give me 35 IBU Sounds good? Then for the dry hop I have no clue for the amount, but I think I want a lot... +100g dry hop Chinook at 7 days?

Regarding the bottling process, I think I had some question earlier left unanswered. Did you mean that I fill them pretty well, then pull the stick out and the volume of the stick is appropriate left over in the bottle for air? And then I squeeze the bottle, making it dented, so that the beer is all the way up til the rim, and then screw on the lid?


Thanks for this! I have been trying to figure this out so many times. I thought this would be the best way, but I was also scared that by filling the sugar first, I could introduce extra oxygen?

Yes, this is how I meant the filing process with the squeezing! The goal is to have zero air in the bottle when doing the plastic bottle squeezing.

15 minutes will give you also some hop flavour and you won't extract all the ibus that you theoretically could. I would boil for 45 minutes and recalculate for this. Dry hopping rate would be 3gram per litre in the fermenter for me.

You can also use cascade! That's another hop that I personal really like and I think everybody should at least brew one cascade only beer to get to know it. I just like Chinook and Simcoe a tiny bit more.

 

[Miraculix]

And remember, doesn't matter what people say, extract from an unopened pack/bottle does not need to get boiled. It is actually detrimental for the flavour of it to boil it. It has been boiled already.

 

[Matheos]

For that brew, one packet of dried yeast will work fine. Best bet would be to rehydrate it in 50 or 100 |ml warm water before pitching.
As others have said, don't get too hung up on proper, and exact right now - you're in the learning phase. |What we're looking at now is to get your procedures down so later you'll be able to concentrate on specific areas to improve.
As someone said, do a bit of reading - Papazian's Complete Joy of Homebrewing and Palmer's How to Brew are both indispensible in my opinoin to any brewer. Palmer is more in the scientific and numbers area, and |Papazian is more of a 'feel' guy. Neither approach is right or wrong. |How to Brew is availble online for free - however it's the first edition, and he's changed his mind about quite a few things since then.
For a 19l (5gallon) batch, |I would recommend (personally...) to do a boil, for as much as you comfortably can. Personally, I found that much less than half the batch boiled didn't give me as good a result, so something like a 12l pot should be comfortable. Top off with cold water in the fermenter will bring to to about pitching temp.
You can certainly experiment with whatever you have at the moment, and upgrade from there as needed.
IMO the most important things is to make sure your extract is fresh as possible, and keep tabs on the fermentation temps. Other than that, sanitize, sanitize, sanitize. If things aren't clean, you will never make good beer.

Hi jrg! Thanks for your input. Will look into the litterature. And yea, I understand it's about getting a feel and experience down at first, but at the same time I want my first to be as good as possible The recipe and "knowledge" is getting there. Why do you recommend mixing the yeast in water before pitching? Seems like another water temp I have to take into account imo

I am currently looking at a 10L pot. Much bigger is even a bit hard to get by around here tbh. That would perhaps give me 8-9L from the pot which I could top off. Could that be OK?

Since I am using Dry Malt extract I am not too concerned about the freshness of the extract, though of course I don't want out of date

 

[Miraculix]

You can rehydrate the yeast, but fermentis actually advises against it.

From personal experiments, I can say that I have not found any difference in the result when rehydrated or just sprinkled on top of the cooled wort.

I would advice, for simplicities sake, against it.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I will look into those threads!

For 1-Gallon Brewers UNITE!, start in the year 2018 and work forward.

 

[Matheos]

Yes, this is how I meant the filing process with the squeezing! The goal is to have zero air in the bottle when doing the plastic bottle squeezing.

15 minutes will give you also some hop flavour and you won't extract all the ibus that you theoretically could. I would boil for 45 minutes and recalculate for this. Dry hopping rate would be 3gram per litre in the fermenter for me.

You can also use cascade! That's another hop that I personal really like and I think everybody should at least brew one cascade only beer to get to know it. I just like Chinook and Simcoe a tiny bit more.

OK thanks for confirming!

You now mean total boil time would be 45? And then I see when the hops should be added and amount for my target IBU?

Dry hops maybe 60g then for a 19L batch (fermenter)?

I am so all over the place with all hops. I wanna try all but I have decided one hop now and going with chinook Maybe next one hop brew is cascade

And remember, doesn't matter what people say, extract from an unopened pack/bottle does not need to get boiled. It is actually detrimental for the flavour of it to boil it. It has been boiled already.

Hmm. This knowledge would surely make the process easier for me, especially if I can't do a full boil. As the DME solves easier in colder water, I suppose it would make sense to only add the stepping grains and the initial hops to the boil, mix the DME separetely in the fermenter in room temperature water and then put them together and top off?

 

[Matheos]

For 1-Gallon Brewers UNITE!, start in the year 2018 and work forward.

Yes! Saw that thread already. Looks interesting Though I thought that was aimed for people making smaller batches? I kind of want the best of both world for this first "real" brew, hopefully made possible using partial boil

 

[Miraculix]

OK thanks for confirming!

You now mean total boil time would be 45? And then I see when the hops should be added and amount for my target IBU?

Dry hops maybe 60g then for a 19L batch (fermenter)?

I am so all over the place with all hops. I wanna try all but I have decided one hop now and going with chinook Maybe next one hop brew is cascade



Hmm. This knowledge would surely make the process easier for me, especially if I can't do a full boil. As the DME solves easier in colder water, I suppose it would make sense to only add the stepping grains and the initial hops to the boil, mix the DME separetely in the fermenter in room temperature water and then put them together and top off?

Skip the steaping grains. They will lower the fermentability of the extract, which is already fairly low. Keep it simple, one hop, one extract, focus on the process. I outlined it for you above before.

 

[Matheos]

Skip the steaping grains. They will lower the fermentability of the extract, which is already fairly low. Keep it simple, one hop, one extract, focus on the process. I outlined it for you above before.

Yea true. That simplifies it even further.



Boil 9L water 45min
15' 65g Chinook 13AA Pellets to the boil

Mix 2.5KG DME LIGHT in fermenter with room temp water.

Pour worth into fermenter and top off with cold water.

Pitch yeast at 21C (hole package dry)

Dry hop 60g Chinook pellets after 7 days (or however long to reach FG) for 2 days

Bottle prime sugar first then beer. squeeze out all air and lid on. Leave for 2 weeks in 21C dark area.


Sounds like a plan?

These would approximately be the numbers

EDIT: Forgot some steps lol

 

[Miraculix]

Yea true. That simplifies it even further.

2.5KG DME LIGHT

Boil 9L water 45min
15' 65g Chinook 13AA Pellets to the boil

Pitch yeast at 21C (hole package dry)

Dry hop 60g Chinook pellets after 7 days (or however long to reach FG) for 2 days

Bottle prime sugar first then beer. squeeze out all air and lid on. Leave for 2 weeks in 21C dark area.


Sounds like a plan?

These would approximately be the numbers View attachment 719079

Sounds like a good plan! You actually don't need to boil that big portion of water. 4-5 litres is already plenty, if you don't boil the DME but only the hops.

This will also make it easier to reach pitching temperature quicker. If you refrigerate some of the topping up water, you might be able to pitch directly the yeast after everything is mixed.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Though I thought that was aimed for people making smaller batches?

Back in #35, ' One Gallon Brewers threads' was mentioned. I thought a direct link with a starting point would be helpful.

 

[Miraculix]

And regarding the amount of dry hopping, if you buy a 100g pack, just use the amount for bittering that you need and use the rest for dry hopping. These small amounts of leftover hops stack up in the refrigerator over time... Believe me

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

With E2U™ active dry yeasts, you can pitch directly or rehydrate; depending on your equipment, habits and feelings. We offer you the opportunity to make your life easier, and eventually contribute to sustainability by saving water and energy. Any process you choose, we will be happy to ensure you the highest standards of quality, productivity and security.

Yeasts and yeast products for brewing and beer fermentation (at the bottom of the page)

 

[Matheos]

Sounds like a good plan! You actually don't need to boil that big portion of water. 4-5 litres is already plenty, if you don't boil the DME but only the hops.

This will also make it easier to reach pitching temperature quicker. If you refrigerate some of the topping up water, you might be able to pitch directly the yeast after everything is mixed.

Oh cool! Thanks for the tips again. Maybe I can get away with an even smaller pot in that case. Not sure though, might just buy a bigger pot but still boil less. Could be good to have a big one for the future.

Back in #35, ' One Gallon Brewers threads' was mentioned. I thought a direct link with a starting point would be helpful.

Yes absolutely. Sorry I did not mean to sound unappreciating or anything I have not yet had time to scroll forward to 2018 so I probably spoke to soon

And regarding the amount of dry hopping, if you buy a 100g pack, just use the amount for bittering that you need and use the rest for dry hopping. These small amounts of leftover hops stack up in the refrigerator over time... Believe me

Ok That would in my case then only leave 35g for dry hopping, is that enough? I literally have no idea It is either that with 100g or I get 250g and go a bit crazier but will then be left with left overs.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

scroll forward to 2018

No worries.

I haven't been able to keep up with the "chat" that you and Miraculix have had.

So just one observation on dry / liquid extract - some characteristics (like fermentability and flavor) will vary by brand.

There are really old Zymurgy articles that talk about the poor fermentibility of malt extract - none of which is valid for the brands of DME that I use in the 2020s. So I try to not make general claims about "extract", and I try to only describe what I observe for the specific brands (and styles) that I use.

 

[Miraculix]

Oh cool! Thanks for the tips again. Maybe I can get away with an even smaller pot in that case. Not sure though, might just buy a bigger pot but still boil less. Could be good to have a big one for the future.



Yes absolutely. Sorry I did not mean to sound unappreciating or anything I have not yet had time to scroll forward to 2018 so I probably spoke to soon


Ok That would in my case then only leave 35g for dry hopping, is that enough? I literally have no idea It is either that with 100g or I get 250g and go a bit crazier but will then be left with left overs.

Oh, no, that's a bit little. Then just buy two packs. I thought you would need less for bittering, if you type I 45 minutes boil, 1.0 og and fg and the final volume you are going in.

 

[Miraculix]

Here you go, these are the numbers you should hack in for a 20 liter brew, 45 minutes hop boil and boiling in 5 leitre plain water. Final Volume in this case is 20 l. This leaves you with about 22g of bittering hops. Rest can go into the dry hop!

Edit: You have to change the alpha content according to your hops!

 

[Matheos]

No worries.

I haven't been able to keep up with the "chat" that you and Miraculix have had.

So just one observation on dry / liquid extract - some characteristics (like fermentability and flavor) will vary by brand.

There are really old Zymurgy articles that talk about the poor fermentibility of malt extract - none of which is valid for the brands of DME that I use in the 2020s. So I try to not make general claims about "extract", and I try to only describe what I observe for the specific brands (and styles) that I use.

Got it And no problem, I have a bit hard time to keep up too haha.

Oh, no, that's a bit little. Then just buy two packs. I thought you would need less for bittering, if you type I 45 minutes boil, 1.0 og and fg and the final volume you are going in.

Hmm yeah that is what I was thinking. Actually 250g would be "cheaper" in that case, but how well does hops store?

Here you go, these are the numbers you should hack in for a 20 liter brew, 45 minutes hop boil and boiling in 5 leitre plain water. Final Volume in this case is 20 l. This leaves you with about 22g of bittering hops. Rest can go into the dry hop!

Edit: You have to change the alpha content according to your hops!

View attachment 719088

Hmm yes. I was just in the Sauna (oh yeas I am that Finnish lol), and started thinking about my hop time at 15min of a 45min boil. If I don't mix the DME in the boil, then what is the point of boiling the first 30min of just water haha. So does this screenshot mean that I hop at 45 (when I reach a boil) and then simply boil the hops for 45min . Since I only do one hop with no steeping grains, this is what I take away from this? The AA would be 13 in my case so I will need to check the amount myself later.

Also, whether I take 200g or 250g hops, how much of the remaining hops should I use for dry hopping? with 200g I am left with like 170 or more lol. Even more obviously with 250. So probably both remainders are too much, hence my question

 

[smata67]

Thanks for mentioning that buddy. I don't think that has been mentioned. Would it also be OK to simply mix the DME before turning the stove on? Maybe I would have to stir until I get it to a boil in that case, but would that technically be OK or are there any drawbacks to that approach?

@BrewnWKopperKat Thanks for the link Gotta check it out if its got Muppet show music No but really, thanks. Will be helpful

Yes, there are issues associated with the timing of adding dme to the boil. The bitterness extraction from your hops can be significantly affected. Most efficient extraction happens when you add the dme or lme late. You can model your resulting final ibu given different lengths of time with the extract in the boil using software such as beer smith. Or just follow the recipe and you should end up with the stated ibu. Also, early extract additions boil for longer and end up darkening the beer. It also affects flavor, somewhat more "caramel-ly," due to Maillard reactions.

 

[Miraculix]

Got it And no problem, I have a bit hard time to keep up too haha.

Hmm yeah that is what I was thinking. Actually 250g would be "cheaper" in that case, but how well does hops store?


Hmm yes. I was just in the Sauna (oh yeas I am that Finnish lol), and started thinking about my hop time at 15min of a 45min boil. If I don't mix the DME in the boil, then what is the point of boiling the first 30min of just water haha. So does this screenshot mean that I hop at 45 (when I reach a boil) and then simply boil the hops for 45min . Since I only do one hop with no steeping grains, this is what I take away from this? The AA would be 13 in my case so I will need to check the amount myself later.

Also, whether I take 200g or 250g hops, how much of the remaining hops should I use for dry hopping? with 200g I am left with like 170 or more lol. Even more obviously with 250. So probably both remainders are too much, hence my question

You would need about 15-16 g of 13% alpha hops boiled for 45 minutes to reach an ibu level of about 35 in a 20 l in the fermenter brew.

And yes, 45 minutes means 45 minutes hop water boil, including the hops. The longer the boil, the more you ssqueeze the ibus out. Much longer than 45 minutes does not bring you any benefit though... you could also play around with the calculator and only boil for 30 minutes, for example.

The longer the boil, the less the hops contribute flavour. The shorter, the more flavur comes through from the boil. I like to get my flavour from mainly the dry hopping as the flavour is "fresher". The boiled hops flavour is a bit muddled, and not so direct.

You can make an experiment one day, brew two identical beers. One just like this one in this thread here and one without the dry hop, but only one 15 or 10 minute hop addition to get the ibus and the flavour.

Then compare the taste and see which one gives you the nicer hop character.

But that's for later!

 

[Matheos]

Thanks for the links! I will have a look. But are there any of my suggestions that you would recommend?

Yes, there are issues associated with the timing of adding dme to the boil. The bitterness extraction from your hops can be significantly affected. Most efficient extraction happens when you add the dme or lme late. You can model your resulting final ibu given different lengths of time with the extract in the boil using software such as beer smith. Or just follow the recipe and you should end up with the stated ibu. Also, early extract additions boil for longer and end up darkening the beer. It also affects flavor, somewhat more "caramel-ly," due to Maillard reactions.

Good to know For this time, I think I will not boil the DME at all, just the hops.

You would need about 15-16 g of 13% alpha hops boiled for 45 minutes to reach an ibu level of about 35 in a 20 l in the fermenter brew.

And yes, 45 minutes means 45 minutes hop water boil, including the hops. The longer the boil, the more you ssqueeze the ibus out. Much longer than 45 minutes does not bring you any benefit though... you could also play around with the calculator and only boil for 30 minutes, for example.

The longer the boil, the less the hops contribute flavour. The shorter, the more flavur comes through from the boil. I like to get my flavour from mainly the dry hopping as the flavour is "fresher". The boiled hops flavour is a bit muddled, and not so direct.

You can make an experiment one day, brew two identical beers. One just like this one in this thread here and one without the dry hop, but only one 15 or 10 minute hop addition to get the ibus and the flavour.

Then compare the taste and see which one gives you the nicer hop character.

But that's for later!

Yes (y) I am so excited witj that little hops needed for the boil, maybe the remainder of 100g is enough for the dry hopping? I am starting to now have a great idea of how to do everything for this brew

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I think I will not boil the DME at all, just the hops.

Brewing better beer with Malt Extract may be of interest.

What it adds to the current discussion is this: " Your hop extraction will increase by about ___%, so reduce your boiling hops accordingly. "

So if you have an existing recipe, no need to type it in to recipe software!

 

[Miraculix]

Brewing better beer with Malt Extract may be of interest.

What it adds to the current discussion is this: " Your hop extraction will increase by about ___%, so reduce your boiling hops accordingly. "

So if you have an existing recipe, no need to type it in to recipe software!

I think we are already passed recipes and created our own which took into account the fact that the hops are boiled in plain water without any extract in it. But it certainly is good to know why there is this increase and what the factors are.

Good to know For this time, I think I will not boil the DME at all, just the hops.

Yes (y) I am so excited witj that little hops needed for the boil, maybe the remainder of 100g is enough for the dry hopping? I am starting to now have a great idea of how to do everything for this brew

Yes, as I was guessing before, 100g should be plenty of hops for this recipe.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I think we are already passed recipes and created our own which took into account the fact that the hops are boiled in plain water without any extract in it. But it certainly is good to know why there is this increase and what the factors are.

Like I said earlier, I haven't been able to keep up with the "live chat" that the two of you have been doing.

And some of what I include here is intended for future readers as well as other current readers.

 

[Matheos]

Brewing better beer with Malt Extract may be of interest.

What it adds to the current discussion is this: " Your hop extraction will increase by about ___%, so reduce your boiling hops accordingly. "

So if you have an existing recipe, no need to type it in to recipe software!

Sounds interesting indeed! Thanks for leaving it herr, both for me to read later and useful for others most likely.

I think we are already passed recipes and created our own which took into account the fact that the hops are boiled in plain water without any extract in it. But it certainly is good to know why there is this increase and what the factors are.



Yes, as I was guessing before, 100g should be plenty of hops for this recipe.

Yes Getting a very good picture of my recipe and everything now. Thanks for continuing to clearify all my silly follow up questions

One small semi relevant thing I was still thinking abt was in regards to your screenshot. The "post boil size" I always thought meant how much you are left with in the pot after evaporation but prior to topping it off in the fermenter. This because the recipe maker has different fields for pre- and post boil size and size of batch in fermenter (3 fields). But I might have interpreted something incorrectly.

edit: With recipe settings
pre boil: 5
Post boil: 4
Fermenter size: 19L

I would need very much chinook at 45. Am I missing something or entering something wrong? The post boil size does not seem to affect the result but the preboil does. with 9L preboil I needed 34g chinook at 45 min for 35 IBU. Getting all confused haha.

 

[Miraculix]

Sounds interesting indeed! Thanks for leaving it herr, both for me to read later and useful for others most likely.

Yes Getting a very good picture of my recipe and everything now. Thanks for continuing to clearify all my silly follow up questions

One small semi relevant thing I was still thinking abt was in regards to your screenshot. The "post boil size" I always thought meant how much you are left with in the pot after evaporation but prior to topping it off in the fermenter. This because the recipe maker has different fields for pre- and post boil size and size of batch in fermenter (3 fields). But I might have interpreted something incorrectly.

edit: With recipe settings
pre boil: 5
Post boil: 4
Fermenter size: 19L

I would need very much chinook at 45. Am I missing something or entering something wrong? The post boil size does not seem to affect the result but the preboil does. with 9L preboil I needed 34g chinook at 45 min for 35 IBU. Getting all confused haha.

This is not correct.

Post boil is the final volume that you got in the fermenter.

The calculator needs these two numbers to be able to calculate the dilution, if you got 20ibus in ten liters, and top up with another ten, after the boil, them you will have 10 ibus in the fermenter.

This is taken into account automatically, if you use the correct numbers, like in the screenshot.

... Ok, if you end up with 19 litres in the fermenter, you'll obviously have to change the 20 to 19.

 

[Matheos]

This is not correct.

Post boil is the final volume that you got in the fermenter.

The calculator needs these two numbers to be able to calculate the dilution, if you got 20ibus in ten liters, and top up with another ten, after the boil, them you will have 10 ibus in the fermenter.

This is taken into account automatically, if you use the correct numbers, like in the screenshot.

... Ok, if you end up with 19 litres in the fermenter, you'll obviously have to change the 20 to 19.

Yes of course. But in the recipe creator there are 3 fields, hence my confusion. And it does not calculate the ibus to be the same as the IBU calculator does. Does the DME have an impact on the ibus?
In the recipe I should maybe then have
Size in fermenter: 19L (or 20 if I wish)
pre boil: 5L
Post boil: also 19L?

With these numbers I have to bump the hopping at 45min so much (looking at the recipe tool). I am confused to why that is. The pre boil size number is the one that impacts it the most. Maybe I should have it set pretty high in the recipe settings? Maybe it is not tailored for partial boil? Tried reading the instructions but still not sure

 

[Miraculix]

Yes of course. But in the recipe creator there are 3 fields, hence my confusion. And it does not calculate the ibus to be the same as the IBU calculator does. Does the DME have an impact on the ibus?
In the recipe I should maybe then have
Size in fermenter: 19L (or 20 if I wish)
pre boil: 5L
Post boil: also 19L?

With these numbers I have to bump the hopping at 45min so much (looking at the recipe tool). I am confused to why that is. The pre boil size number is the one that impacts it the most. Maybe I should have it set pretty high in the recipe settings? Maybe it is not tailored for partial boil? Tried reading the instructions but still not sure

Yes, the more extract is solved in the water, the less ibus you get out of the hops, well spotted.

This is one of the reasons why the hop tea is such s good idea, you really max out the possibilities of the hops.

What you often read is, that the more sugar in solution, the less isomerisation of alpha acids takes place (this is basically what is the bitterness, isomerised alpha acids). However, I read somewhere else that the sugar itself does not impact this process that much, but the proteins that are also solved in the liquid, coming from the malt as well as the sugar, are the actual limiting factor here.

But at the end, the more sugar is in there, the more malt has been used and the more proteins are also in solution so it's a fitting abbreviation to say that the higher the gravity, the lower the IBU utilisation from hops.

 

[Miraculix]

I don't think that you can actually tell the recipe tool that you are boiling the hops in pure water, so better stick to the ibu calculator for the hop part and make some notes about it in the recipe itself. The recipe tool thinks that you will boil the hops with all your extract in there as well.

 

[Matheos]

I don't think that you can actually tell the recipe tool that you are boiling the hops in pure water, so better stick to the ibu calculator for the hop part and make some notes about it in the recipe itself. The recipe tool thinks that you will boil the hops with all your extract in there as well.

Yes this is what I am thinking now. And with regards to your previous response this makes sense. Though there is a checkbox "late addition" for the DME. When I check this and select "fermenter", from dropdown, eveything goes to 0 Looks like the tool thinks I get 0 IBU if I just do hop tea and add DME in fermenter... No clue why..
I am getting too hung up on the recipe tool's numbers, I know,but it would be so nice if I understood all the fields and it made sense Inthe end it does not matter as long as I know the ratio of the hops, which I will get from the IBU calculator.

 

[Miraculix]

Yes this is what I am thinking now. And with regards to your previous response this makes sense. Though there is a checkbox "late addition" for the DME. When I check this and select "fermenter", from dropdown, eveything goes to 0 Looks like the tool thinks I get 0 IBU if I just do hop tea and add DME in fermenter... No clue why..
I am getting too hung up on the recipe tool's numbers, I know,but it would be so nice if I understood all the fields and it made sense Inthe end it does not matter as long as I know the ratio of the hops, which I will get from the IBU calculator.

Weird... I use it all the time and it gets me good results, but I'm doing all grain batches, that makes it easier to hack in.

Although I'm tempted to do one extract batch, just for the sake of simplicity. I think I got one very old bag of extract flying around, I think I'll do it

 

[Matheos]

Weird... I use it all the time and it gets me good results, but I'm doing all grain batches, that makes it easier to hack in.

Although I'm tempted to do one extract batch, just for the sake of simplicity. I think I got one very old bag of extract flying around, I think I'll do it

Do it man! And tell me how it went i will try playing a bit more with the tool later today to try to figure it out if I can put it all in correctly Will report back if I manage to get it. Maybe you work it out if u make a recipe for your extract batch in the tool