Kegland Rapt Pill floating hydrometer temperature monitor

[hotbeer]

Does anyone have issues with their Pill not sending any data at all? It works perfectly in direct wifi mode. -39dbm, can upload telemetry manually to the cloud works great. Once the device enters the refresh every X (in my case 20 minutes) mode, I never hear from it again.

The above issue is intermittent, in that I have gotten it to work previously, though it seems the only way to get it to work is to keep on connecting the USB cable and if it can send the first interval once it's outside direct mode it won't skip a beat.

You do realize that when not directly connected to it that it is best to go through their cloud app via a web browser.

RAPT Cloud

You'll need some info that you should have gotten while connected to the portal.

With -39 dbm you should be getting excellent signal and data. As a test, I got decent data even when at -80 dbm though some reports were missing.

Oh yeah... if you are just testing it and have it lying horizontal, it might be that it has just gone to sleep thinking it's not being used. Stand it up or put it at a angle.

 

[edd101]

You do realize that when not directly connected to it that it is best to go through their cloud app via a web browser.

RAPT Cloud

You'll need some info that you should have gotten while connected to the portal.

Right (as far as I can tell) there are two modes
1) active high battery use mode that is triggered upon plugging into USB C. Sends fairly constant updates to the cloud, and also allows your device to connect directly for calibration and diagnostics.
2) After ~15 min the device deactivates its RAPT wifi access point, and only sends updates to the rapt cloud on the configurable interval ( I have it set to 15 min).

#1 works perfectly . A very high percentage of the time but not always, once #1 times out and the device moves to #2 mode the cloud ceases to receive any updates until I reactivate #1.

 

[hotbeer]

@edd101

I have a bad habit of going back an adding stuff to my replies. I don't know if you saw this that I added before I realized you'd replied to me.

Oh yeah... if you are just testing it and have it lying horizontal, it might be that it has just gone to sleep thinking it's not being used. Stand it up or put it at a angle.

 

[edd101]

@edd101

I have a bad habit of going back an adding stuff to my replies. I don't know if you saw this that I added before I realized you'd replied to me.

Yeah literally I will put in the wort, close it up. It will report gravity fairly constant for 10-15 minutes. And then go radio silent.

 

[hotbeer]

Yeah literally I will put in the wort, close it up. It will report gravity fairly constant for 10-15 minutes. And then go radio silent.

Well if you have it set to report every 15 minutes, then you'll have to wait 15 minutes plus whatever variable time their cloud app takes before you get the next report. If it transmitted continuously the battery wouldn't last very long.

And if all things temp and SG are the same then the only thing you have to go by is note below that say how long ago the data is for.

You could start a profile and then all the data points will be saved and shown on a graph.

 

[edd101]

Yeah the issue is after it exits mode 1 it will never update again. Not even after a day. 15 minutes would be fine

 

[hotbeer]

The "mode 1" thing has me a little baffled. Maybe I need to dig out my manual for it.

Or are you trying to use the API's and writing your own program to monitor it?

 

[edd101]

Oh it's nothing in their documentation I was just calling it that.

1) active high battery use mode that is triggered upon plugging into USB C. Sends fairly constant updates to the cloud, and also allows your device to connect directly for calibration and diagnostics.
2) After ~15 min the device deactivates its RAPT wifi access point, and only sends updates to the rapt cloud on the configurable interval ( I have it set to 15 min).

 

[SanPancho]

By the way, "Electrolyte IPA" sounds like a good beer name.

you heard it here first- electrolyte IPA™

 

[hotbeer]

@edd101

If you haven't already, you should go to Kegland's site and email their customer support. The couple questions I sent them they responded to and answered. Though it might take a few days.

I only have one Rapt Pill and it's worked for me. My questions to Kegland were more about just clearing up my slight misunderstanding about some things.

 

[BongoYodeler]

@edd101

Also, a couple basic questions...

Have you fully charged your Pill (24hrs.)?
How far away from your router is your fermenter?
What type of fermenter are you using? Plastic? Stainless Steel?

What happens if you try plugging in your Pill right next to your router? If you go to the routers web interface does it see your Pill? Set the Pill for 15 minute reporting, unplug it but leave it next to your router (but not sitting horizontally), does it transmit to the Rapt web portal? If after doing all that and it's still not reporting I would contact Kegland. They should be able to find your Pill, if it's registered on their portal, and/or walk you through some troubleshooting steps.

 

[edd101]

Yeah, it's fully charged, about 15 feet from the router through two drywalls. Plastic bucket in a chest freezer.

What threw me off is it works perfectly during the first 15 minutes. I think when it's in the transmit on X interval mode, not only does it (obviously) transmit less often, but the power of transmission must be much less.

If I move my fermenter outside the chest freezer and ~5 ft away from the router, it transmits every 30 minutes. (it's set up to send every 15 minutes meaning 50% of the transmits fail).

I was able to get a successful transmission every 6-12 hours by raising my fermenter a few inches in the chest freezer as well as opening all the doors in my house. (meaning 95% of transmissions fail).

There's a survivorship bias , but the last transmission to go through is is 47 DBM which per the manual is an excellent signal.

Crazy how finicky it is.

 

[TomSellers]

We use an 18650 cell in all our specialized SAR lights (we've actually now moved to 21700 cells of the same chemistry but 5000 MAh). The drivers have a thermistor that opens the circuit at 65C to prevent overheating.

Li-Co (Lithium Cobalt) is the most common type of chemistry found in 18650 cells. Battery University gives the temperature threshold for thermal runaway for those cells at 150C (302F), and ChatGPT give it as a range of 150-200C. On the topic of at what temperature can start to damage Li-Ion-Cobalt, ChatGPT gives it at a modest 60C. All the RAPT Pills I have dealt with (limited to about 150 units in the past year) have been Li-Ion Cobalt cells. I have substituted Panasonic 18650B cells into the Pill with no adverse results (but you have to be sure to recalibrate if you do that).

At the moment the RAPT Pills we have been receiving at our Canadian operation are the INR18650/33V made by Eve Battery in China, which is a large and well respected battery manufacturer (they supply BMW for example). It is rated at a capacity of 3200 MAh. Their data sheet on the bottom of page 5 outlines their test method for heat which is to heat the cell to 130C for 30 minutes. It says that no thermal runaway occurred using those test parameters. They differ somewhat from the operating maximum temp 75C rating noted above in the Kegland post for these cells on the bottom of page 1 where they give a seemingly conservative max operating temp of 60C.

There are a lot of reviews and tests of this cell on the interweb from enthusiasts using hobbyist equipment which generally indicate they saw capacities of between 3000-3100 MAh from these cells.

From the standpoint of home brewing, thermal runaway should not be a concern. So, in summary, it would seem that it would be safe to consider placing the RAPT Pill into your wort anytime after it reaches 60C. Personally I'd be comfortable at the 75C noted by Kegland because it will not be staying that that temp for very long in any case.

 

[hotbeer]

Crazy how finicky it is.

Which is why you should contact Kegland. I tested mine in a stainless steel pot with lid and left it at various distances and rooms away from the wifi AP in my home for about 12 hour periods each. I got most every data point until my signal loss was in in the -80 dB range.

The screen from the captive portal that they create when you set up the pill with is not the cloud app that you use to access the data sent. It will time out.

So either your Pill has an issue, or you just have some misunderstanding of what does what and how to use it. Either way, Kegland's support staff probably can help you better.

 

[KegLand]

Right (as far as I can tell) there are two modes
1) active high battery use mode that is triggered upon plugging into USB C. Sends fairly constant updates to the cloud, and also allows your device to connect directly for calibration and diagnostics.
2) After ~15 min the device deactivates its RAPT wifi access point, and only sends updates to the rapt cloud on the configurable interval ( I have it set to 15 min).

#1 works perfectly . A very high percentage of the time but not always, once #1 times out and the device moves to #2 mode the cloud ceases to receive any updates until I reactivate #1.

If you are only getting the pill work when the USB type C cable is plugged in then I would suggest that something is wrong with the way the pill is connected to the battery. Either:

1. The plastic tabs at both ends that we install during transit have not been removed.
2. The battery could be the wrong way around
3. The battery terminals are not pushing hard against the battery itself. Please see 7 min into this video here showing how to bend the battery terminals towards the battery:

This is not an issue for the new units but if the Pill was one of the first ones made it may have this issue as some of the older battery cradles were not as good.

 

[KegLand]

We use an 18650 cell in all our specialized SAR lights (we've actually now moved to 21700 cells of the same chemistry but 5000 MAh). The drivers have a thermistor that opens the circuit at 65C to prevent overheating.

Li-Co (Lithium Cobalt) is the most common type of chemistry found in 18650 cells. Battery University gives the temperature threshold for thermal runaway for those cells at 150C (302F), and ChatGPT give it as a range of 150-200C. On the topic of at what temperature can start to damage Li-Ion-Cobalt, ChatGPT gives it at a modest 60C. All the RAPT Pills I have dealt with (limited to about 150 units in the past year) have been Li-Ion Cobalt cells. I have substituted Panasonic 18650B cells into the Pill with no adverse results (but you have to be sure to recalibrate if you do that).

At the moment the RAPT Pills we have been receiving at our Canadian operation are the INR18650/33V made by Eve Battery in China, which is a large and well respected battery manufacturer (they supply BMW for example). It is rated at a capacity of 3200 MAh. Their data sheet on the bottom of page 5 outlines their test method for heat which is to heat the cell to 130C for 30 minutes. It says that no thermal runaway occurred using those test parameters. They differ somewhat from the operating maximum temp 75C rating noted above in the Kegland post for these cells on the bottom of page 1 where they give a seemingly conservative max operating temp of 60C.

There are a lot of reviews and tests of this cell on the interweb from enthusiasts using hobbyist equipment which generally indicate they saw capacities of between 3000-3100 MAh from these cells.

From the standpoint of home brewing, thermal runaway should not be a concern. So, in summary, it would seem that it would be safe to consider placing the RAPT Pill into your wort anytime after it reaches 60C. Personally I'd be comfortable at the 75C noted by Kegland because it will not be staying that that temp for very long in any case.

View attachment 816592

Thanks for that. Yes the EVE brand of 18650 is the only one that we sell with the Pill. If it has a different battery it's because some of our distributors use their own suppliers for batteries locally but all Pill sold with batteries from KegLand use this brand. Yes we are probably being a bit conservative saying not to use the pill in liquid above 60C but generally speaking there is no reason to put it into your wort any hotter than this and we have not done testing above 60C at this stage.

 

[TomSellers]

Thanks for the interesting feedback Kegland. One other thought came to mind. with respect to the battery. I believe that the iSpindle and Float use the TP4056 chip for giving a linear CV charge to the battery. I don't see that chip on the Pill PCB. The TP4056 chip is programmable and can charge at a rate up to 1000 MAh. Given the Pill can take overnight to charge, I often charge my 18650 battery in an external charger, then return it to the Pill and connect to USB C to calibrate. It would seem that the Pill charges at a lower current (which of course is easier on the battery). I've often wondered what the actual charging current is for the Pill, and what the minimum voltage is for calibration?

I'm aware of the one Canadian distributor that ships with the Eve battery that Kegland supplies. There is also a Canadian Reseller that appears to buy direct from Kegland. I'm not sure if they also ship with the Eve Battery or provide their own, but I noticed they sell additional batteries that are rated for 3200MAh, so I assume it is also the Eve battery cell. I can see how it might be an advantage for overseas distributors to supply their own batteries for domestic sales of battery containing electronics that they import from overseas, as it often simplifies (and lowers the cost) of international shipping if products do not contain Li-Ion batteries.

 

[KegLand]

Thanks for the interesting feedback Kegland. One other thought came to mind. with respect to the battery. I believe that the iSpindle and Float use the TP4056 chip for giving a linear CV charge to the battery. I don't see that chip on the Pill PCB. The TP4056 chip is programmable and can charge at a rate up to 1000 MAh. Given the Pill can take overnight to charge, I often charge my 18650 battery in an external charger, then return it to the Pill and connect to USB C to calibrate. It would seem that the Pill charges at a lower current (which of course is easier on the battery). I've often wondered what the actual charging current is for the Pill, and what the minimum voltage is for calibration?

I'm aware of the one Canadian distributor that ships with the Eve battery that Kegland supplies. There is also a Canadian Reseller that appears to buy direct from Kegland. I'm not sure if they also ship with the Eve Battery or provide their own, but I noticed they sell additional batteries that are rated for 3200MAh, so I assume it is also the Eve battery cell. I can see how it might be an advantage for overseas distributors to supply their own batteries for domestic sales of battery containing electronics that they import from overseas, as it often simplifies (and lowers the cost) of international shipping if products do not contain Li-Ion batteries.

Helllo Tom. Yes the Pill has slow charging. We do not really like fast charging as it's not as good for the battery as you have mentioned but it also generates more heat and many customers find the heat generated from charging can put off the starting temperature. Our charge module is limited to 200mA.

Our recommendation is to leave on the charger for 24hrs on the first charge so we can calibrate the full charge voltage. When the voltage stays at the same voltage for several hours the pill recognizes that full charge has been reached and records this number as "fully charged". If you do not leave the pill on the charger long enough to determine this then you will see 0% battery in the portal.

I know charging on an external charger is faster but in my opinion the wireless charging module is really the best option as it prevents the need for opening the housing. The more you open and close the housing the more chance you will have wearing out the o-rings. In addition to this if you do not screw the housing together in perfectly the same position you need to re-calibrate each time. So to save recalibration I think the wireless charging coil is a worthwhile upgrade.

 

[TomSellers]

Interesting to know, thanks for that.

I run 2 RAPT Pill units and it seems I have misplaced the original battery from one of them so I use a Panasonic 18650B. Last week I charged it fully in the Pill and then measured it. Resting voltage was 4.18V. Out of curiosity, I then placed it in the external charger the charge indicator went from red to green immediately. So fortunately for me they both seem to match at the moment, and I have not had any problems.

Until now I did not know that the wireless coil was an option. As my spouse already has a wireless dock, is it possible to buy the weights, coil and cable as a kit without the dock?

 

[KegLand]

Interesting to know, thanks for that.

I run 2 RAPT Pill units and it seems I have misplaced the original battery from one of them so I use a Panasonic 18650B. Last week I charged it fully in the Pill and then measured it. Resting voltage was 4.18V. Out of curiosity, I then placed it in the external charger the charge indicator went from red to green immediately. So fortunately for me they both seem to match at the moment, and I have not had any problems.

Until now I did not know that the wireless coil was an option. As my spouse already has a wireless dock, is it possible to buy the weights, coil and cable as a kit without the dock?

We are in the process of also getting the wireless coil in stock. We will start to distribute these in about 8 weeks from now. At the moment who only have the whole kit. I should also say that some chargers do not work unless they use the QI standard so you should probably check this too.

 

[TomSellers]

That's great to know, thanks.

I actually was looking at those sticker style QI receivers with USB-C on ALi Express and Amazon that are a few dollars and entertained the idea of experimenting with one by contouring it inside the tube and plugging it into the PCB. Upon reflection, I realized even my time, although not valuable to She Who Must Be Obeyed, is worth more than that to me. So I gave up on the idea. Although I'm not that bright, it did occur to me that having, 1) a curved receiver coil that would be longitudinal along the length of the tube and thus: 2) at a minimum would also require the Pill to be charged on its side, would probably doom such an effort to failure. And then there is the question of the weight adjustment.

I did see you need to change the weights on each end of the battery cradle when you make this Mod to convert to wireless charging. Would not calibration adjust for the weight change if the weights were not changed?

 

[KegLand]

That's great to know, thanks.

I actually was looking at those sticker style QI receivers with USB-C on ALi Express and Amazon that are a few dollars and entertained the idea of experimenting with one by contouring it inside the tube and plugging it into the PCB. Upon reflection, I realized even my time, although not valuable to She Who Must Be Obeyed, is worth more than that to me. So I gave up on the idea. Although I'm not that bright, it did occur to me that having, 1) a curved receiver coil that would be longitudinal along the length of the tube and thus: 2) at a minimum would also require the Pill to be charged on its side, would probably doom such an effort to failure. And then there is the question of the weight adjustment.

I did see you need to change the weights on each end of the battery cradle when you make this Mod to convert to wireless charging. Would not calibration adjust for the weight change if the weights were not changed?

Hello Tom. To simplify this answer I would like you to imaging the pill taking angle measurements between about 10degree and 80 degree. This 70 degree range of movement is where you can measure the gravity accurately. As you can imagine for small change in gravity we want a large change in angle but not so large that it reads poorly at the extreme edges of the ideal gravity range. We spent a lot of time optimising this range of movement so we get the greatest range of movement between 0.990 and 1.120 and thus it improves accuracy and resolution within this range.

As you can imagine if you add your own charging coil and do not change the weights you will probably find you get less accurate results either at the top or bottom of this 0.990 or 1.120 range.

 

[TomSellers]

Indeed, that is a great analogy that is easy to understand. Thanks again for taking the time to confirm what SWHMBO always reminds me of, that I should take more time to wash dishes and less for seat of the pants science experiments.

 

[TandemTails]

I just wanted to lend my experience so far trying to get the Rapt Pill working. I have a small "dorm" style refrigerator as my fermentation chamber and I ferment in a corny keg. My wireless router is about 15 feet from the Rapt in the same room.

I charged the pill, went through the registration and calibration and then was really excited to actually use it to monitor fermentation on my latest brew. I have the pill set to send data at the default 1 hour interval.

I sanitized the pill and placed it in my keg, then put the keg in the ferm chamber. I waited 5 hours and didn't get a single telemetry reading. Wondering what was up, I took the pill out of the keg, plugged it in and forced send some telemetry data which did show up.

I then moved a wifi extender from another part of the house directly on top of the fermentation chamber, so it's about 12" from the pill but it's been two hours without a single telemetry reading.

I guess the combination of the fermentation chamber and the keg simply block too much signal, even with a repeater essentially directly on top of it, to work.

I'm really sad, as I was looking forward to watching my brew progress through Brewfather.

As a random question: does the telemetry data get stored and sent later? For example, will it store a week's worth of telemetry readings and then send them all when signal is received? I would hope that might be the case, but I'm not optimistic that's what's happening.

 

[MikeCo]

Your router and extender are close enough so it should work based on my experience. I would think at only 15 feet, it should work without an extender. Change the transmission interval to 15 minutes to speed up the troubleshooting process. Then try putting the pill in a container of water outside the chamber to see if it's transmitting. If it is, look at the singal strength to see if it's very strong. I get a good signal in my mini-fridge inside a stainless fermenter with an extender 3 feet from the chamber. Also, make sure the pill is configured to use the wifi network name of the extender and not the base router.

 

[KegLand]

I just wanted to lend my experience so far trying to get the Rapt Pill working. I have a small "dorm" style refrigerator as my fermentation chamber and I ferment in a corny keg. My wireless router is about 15 feet from the Rapt in the same room.

I charged the pill, went through the registration and calibration and then was really excited to actually use it to monitor fermentation on my latest brew. I have the pill set to send data at the default 1 hour interval.

I sanitized the pill and placed it in my keg, then put the keg in the ferm chamber. I waited 5 hours and didn't get a single telemetry reading. Wondering what was up, I took the pill out of the keg, plugged it in and forced send some telemetry data which did show up.

I then moved a wifi extender from another part of the house directly on top of the fermentation chamber, so it's about 12" from the pill but it's been two hours without a single telemetry reading.

I guess the combination of the fermentation chamber and the keg simply block too much signal, even with a repeater essentially directly on top of it, to work.

I'm really sad, as I was looking forward to watching my brew progress through Brewfather.

As a random question: does the telemetry data get stored and sent later? For example, will it store a week's worth of telemetry readings and then send them all when signal is received? I would hope that might be the case, but I'm not optimistic that's what's happening.

Can you please send us screen shots of all the settings you have. You should be able to see this in when you are in the AP mode.

IE, what is your telemetry frequency etc. Also are you using a mesh network? Are you on the latest firmware? If you can provide us with more information we can better problemshoot your issues. If you send us the last 6 digits of your MAC address or email we can also look at the logs on the system and this might help shed some light on the issue.

I should say that we have a new firmware that will be released in a couple months that uses some new networking libraries and this will also fix some incompatibilities with certain routers and the pill so this may also solve your issue but you have to make sure you update the firmware when it's available. Generally speaking if you have a good WIFI signal at least where you charge the pill then it should automatically updated to the latest firmware when it is plugged in for charging.


If you have a stainless fermenter some other tips you might want to consider:
1. At least one plastic port. We are in the process of making a new 4" TC lid for stainless fermenters and the plastic allows for much more wifi transmission. Stainless fermenters are almost a prefect faraday cage unfortunately. When switching over from stainless 4" TC lid to a plastic lid we typically see an increase in wifi strength of about 8-10dB and because of the logarithmic scale this is a huge increase. If you look at your data in the portal we really want to see better than 65db signal strength otherwise your performance will be poor.
2. USE BLUETOOTH. If you have another RAPT device such as a RAPT temp controller or RAPT chamber these devices can pickup on low energy bluetooth transmissions and then relay the information to the internet. In my opinion this is by far the most reliable way to use the pill as a lot more stuff can go wrong with WIFI. Bluetooth allows for faster single direction communication so the pill can quickly turn on, blast out some packets and go to sleep. Sometimes poor quality routers do not establish the connection fast enough and the pill goes to sleep or some other issue is caused by poor signal strength and these issues are not as prominent with bluetooth. Also bluetooth has higher success rate of getting through stainless fermenters than wifi in our experience too.

 

[Graham H]

There’s a possibility that your wifi router is more effective laterally than vertically. You may have inadvertently placed it such that the Pill is in a weaker area, from an antenna perspective. It might be enough of a difference that it can’t overcome the double-walled insulation of fermentation vessel and chamber.

 

[TandemTails]

To update on my previous post from last night, I didn't receive a single reading with the access point on top of the ferm chamber, so I put it inside the ferm chamber this morning (about 3" from the Pill) and have received three updates. I had changed the interval to 15 minutes last night in hopes that It would be easier to debug. Those three updates took place over the course of 2 hours (there should have been 8 updates in that time).

I don't have any other rapt devices, so the bluetooth option is a no-go for me right now. I'll get the screenshots of the settings after this fermentation is completed and I've removed the pill. I did make sure I'm at the latest firmware version prior to using it (I want to say it was 20230403 something... so a March or April update depending on the yyyy/mm/dd vs yyyy/dd/mm format being used).

I may just end up buying another used access point for use specifically in my ferm chamber, as the one I'm using now is needed to give wifi to the rest of my house, lol.

 

[BongoYodeler]

To update on my previous post from last night, I didn't receive a single reading with the access point on top of the ferm chamber, so I put it inside the ferm chamber this morning (about 3" from the Pill) and have received three updates. I had changed the interval to 15 minutes last night in hopes that It would be easier to debug. Those three updates took place over the course of 2 hours (there should have been 8 updates in that time).

I don't have any other rapt devices, so the bluetooth option is a no-go for me right now. I'll get the screenshots of the settings after this fermentation is completed and I've removed the pill. I did make sure I'm at the latest firmware version prior to using it (I want to say it was 20230403 something... so a March or April update depending on the yyyy/mm/dd vs yyyy/dd/mm format being used).

I may just end up buying another used access point for use specifically in my ferm chamber, as the one I'm using now is needed to give wifi to the rest of my house, lol.

I occasionally ferment in a keg and used to have trouble getting regular readings despite the keg being mere inches away from my Netgear router. Two things seemed to help that a bit: changing the router's antenna positions, and changing the router's channel. After these changes I went from getting ~25% of the readings to ~50%. A few months ago, for an unrelated reason, I bought a new Asus router and with that I'm now seeing successful data back to the portal about 75% or more when fermenting inside a corny keg. I currently have a beer fermenting inside a plastic Speidel fermenter, inches from the router, and see maybe one or two misses over a 24 hour period for what it's worth.

 

[DuncB]

If the rapt system tells you signal strength for WiFi that's useful to know. Ispindel displays this figure as well as angle, temp, battery and gravity.
A figure of -80dB or more is not good.

 

[hotbeer]

If the rapt system tells you signal strength for WiFi that's useful to know. Ispindel displays this figure as well as angle, temp, battery and gravity.
A figure of -80dB or more is not good.

It does show the signal strength. Both in the cloud portal and in the captive portal that is used for setup to get it configured with ones wifi.

Knowing that might at least affirm that it is able to connect to the wifi from inside the chamber or not. And if the signal strength is decent, then likely it's some other issue in the setup or usage. And not just that it can't get a wifi signal.

But if the OP can't crawl up in the chamber with it, that might be a hard thing to get. I'd think the OP could try to open the captive portal while it's in the chamber. But my older raptPill has to have the charging cable connected. The newer might have a way around that.

I did some testing with my raptPill and after getting it several rooms away and a signal loss of just a little more than -80 dB, it started to miss an a few reports out of the time period it was left at that high signal loss condition. I was impressed though that more often than not, it was able to still make a connection and report the data for that period of time it was in that room with high signal loss.

 

[Beekeeper]

A figure of -80dB or more is not good.

More than -80dB signal level would be better.
Of course you want a stronger signal, which would be indicated by a smaller, though negative numeric value.
Just a technical critique.

 

[hotbeer]

More than -80dB signal level would be better.
Of course you want a stronger signal, which would be indicated by a smaller, though negative numeric value.
Just a technical critique.

I knew someone would mention that. But the reference can be taken that "more" was replying to a greater loss of signal. Not the numeric quantity of dB.

 

[TandemTails]

Rapt Pill feature request @KegLand -- I'm not sure the storage capacity onboard the pill, but it would be great if a future firmware update would allow for storage of telemetry data that didn't send due to shoddy connectivity and then send it during a subsequent burst.

It would really make the pill more usable in low connectivity environments if you could still get the data, even if it's slightly delayed.

 

[TandemTails]

One more followup just to round out my issues. I became obsessively determined to get the Rapt Pill to work with my setup and believe I finally did. To give as many details as I can in case anyone else finds themselves in a similar situation, here's my setup.

Base setup
Wifi: Nest Wifi (Gen 2). Main router is about 15 feet from the fermentation chamber
Fermentation chamber: Old mini fridge with metal walls
Fermentation vessel: 5 gallon corny keg

What I tried:
* FAILED - Taking a wifi access point from my kitchen and putting it on top of my fermentation chamber
* FAILED - Taking that same wifi access point and putting it in the fermentation chamber with the door closed
* KINDA WORKED - Taking that same wifi access point and putting it in the fermentation chamber with the door open. (obviously not ideal since it defeats the purpose of the ferm chamber). I was still only getting about 10% of the results this way

What worked:
After some extensive reading, I found out a couple things...
1. my generation of Nest wifi is backwards compatible with the first generation Google Mesh wifi
2. the wifi routers are more powerful than the access points (4 bands vs 2 bands)
3. you can use a wifi router as an access point

I found someone selling a first gen Google mesh wifi router on craigslist for extremely cheap so I bought that, did a factory reset and added it to my network. I then put it in the ferm chamber with the door closed and it's been picking up every telemetry dump as expected. It's still set to 15 minute intervals and I'm getting every one.

I'm going to call my setup complete for now. Is it overkill? Probably. Does it work? Yes.



The serving keg is being purged via blowoff from the actual fermentation. I have a spunding valve on the serving keg as well. I placed the router access point on top of the fermentation keg.

 

[day_trippr]

Good for you for coming up with a cost effective solution

My experience with a plethora of routers, repeaters, WAPs, mesh, etc, is there can be a profound difference in wifi capability from one brand/model to the next. I have returned equipment that was substantially less capable than competing equipment of the same type...

Cheers!

 

[Zippy123]

Since this looks like the RAPT pill repository, here is my REVIEW and FEATURE REQUEST.

I've had my RAPT pill (with wireless charging coil) for about a month. After installing the charging coil and fully charging, I calibrated it then put it in a pail of water in my fermenting closet to make sure the wifi signal strength was suitable. Worked great for a few weeks then I noticed the SG started to change. I thought it very odd until I looked at the bucket and discovered enough water had evaporated that the pill was touching the bottom, thus sending a "false" reading. I considered the test a success.

I dropped the pill into a freshly pitched fermenter earlier this week and have been collecting data since. Shortly after dropping it into the fermenter, I discovered by accident there is an api integration available for brewersfriend.com. After reading the pertinent integration thread here, I managed to fumble my way to success with the integration.

To date I would say I am very satisfied with the function of the pill and the integration with BF. I consider the wireless charging coil necessary; I found it a hassle to open the pill to charge it or to connect to its internal web host for calibration and settings. I would recommend the RAPT pill to a friend, with the understanding that I would need to help the technically challenged with the BF integration. Thanks @KegLand for a great product and @BrewersFriend for a custom api to support the pill at BF.

With that said, I do have a few suggestions/requests:

@KegLand : Add support for API variables @velocity and @ABV. While @temperature and @Gravity are the only absolutely necessary data points, it is great seeing those data on the chart to get the full picture of the fermentation process. And I will echo the request made in the pertinent integration thread: "...if RAPT could be convinced to adds a predefined brewersfriend webhook configuration on their end, which would just require entering an API key to enable...".

@BrewersFriend : Add RAPT pill as a device to brewersfriend.com to simplify integration. Thanks to my stubborn streak, I managed to get it done using the custom integration. I suspect more BF users would integrate their RAPT pill if it were super easy. Also add support for @velocity and @ABV if KegLand adds those variables.

And because pictures are fun:

You'll notice the data on the far left looks too stable. At first I used "F" for the temp label in the JSON payload, but that resulted in the temp being displayed on BF as "C". So I changed the temp label to "C" and apparently it reports C to BF and BF converts it to F. After making that fix, the temp graph looked wrong because after the fix the temp graph was in the range 18-76. So I deleted the "bad" C data points and the graph is now scaled correctly.

 

[Zippy123]

I just discovered that @ velocity and @ ABV and @ Gravity are users and may receive an unintentional notification from this thread. Oops! Sorry in advance.

 

[KegLand]

Since this looks like the RAPT pill repository, here is my REVIEW and FEATURE REQUEST.

I've had my RAPT pill (with wireless charging coil) for about a month. After installing the charging coil and fully charging, I calibrated it then put it in a pail of water in my fermenting closet to make sure the wifi signal strength was suitable. Worked great for a few weeks then I noticed the SG started to change. I thought it very odd until I looked at the bucket and discovered enough water had evaporated that the pill was touching the bottom, thus sending a "false" reading. I considered the test a success.

I dropped the pill into a freshly pitched fermenter earlier this week and have been collecting data since. Shortly after dropping it into the fermenter, I discovered by accident there is an api integration available for brewersfriend.com. After reading the pertinent integration thread here, I managed to fumble my way to success with the integration.

To date I would say I am very satisfied with the function of the pill and the integration with BF. I consider the wireless charging coil necessary; I found it a hassle to open the pill to charge it or to connect to its internal web host for calibration and settings. I would recommend the RAPT pill to a friend, with the understanding that I would need to help the technically challenged with the BF integration. Thanks @KegLand for a great product and @BrewersFriend for a custom api to support the pill at BF.

With that said, I do have a few suggestions/requests:

@KegLand : Add support for API variables @velocity and @ABV. While @temperature and @Gravity are the only absolutely necessary data points, it is great seeing those data on the chart to get the full picture of the fermentation process. And I will echo the request made in the pertinent integration thread: "...if RAPT could be convinced to adds a predefined brewersfriend webhook configuration on their end, which would just require entering an API key to enable...".

@BrewersFriend : Add RAPT pill as a device to brewersfriend.com to simplify integration. Thanks to my stubborn streak, I managed to get it done using the custom integration. I suspect more BF users would integrate their RAPT pill if it were super easy. Also add support for @velocity and @ABV if KegLand adds those variables.

And because pictures are fun:
View attachment 840694

View attachment 840695
You'll notice the data on the far left looks too stable. At first I used "F" for the temp label in the JSON payload, but that resulted in the temp being displayed on BF as "C". So I changed the temp label to "C" and apparently it reports C to BF and BF converts it to F. After making that fix, the temp graph looked wrong because after the fix the temp graph was in the range 18-76. So I deleted the "bad" C data points and the graph is now scaled correctly.

Thanks for the feedback. We are working on more smooth integration process now with these other platforms. Up until now we have been changing the reported data a bit so it was a bit of a moving target but we are not likely going to make too many changes to the data that the pill spits out now so it's a good time for us to finish integration with BrewFather, Grainfather, Brewers Friend etc.

 

[balrog]

I just discovered that @ velocity and @ ABV and @ Gravity are users and may receive an unintentional notification from this thread. Oops! Sorry in advance.

And with that, a new spam vector is discovered!