Is US-05 really this slow to get started?

[ryanj]

Out of all the beer I brewed over the last 3.5 years, I've only used dry yeast twice (and neither batch was very memorable). I had the ingredients to brew a blonde ale and a spare pack of US-05 (exp Feb 2021). I rehydrated the yeast properly and pitched it into ~72F wort at about 1:30pm yesterday. I have a tilt hydrometer, so I can follow the gravity as it drops in real time.

With liquid yeast, I'm used to seeing activity within 5-6 hours, but no later than about 12 hours.

I woke up this morning and the beer only dropped 1 point. The airlock had minimal activity.

It's now 25 hours after pitching and we're down a total of 4 points from OG and while the airlock activity has sped up, it's still a lot slower than I'm used to.

Is US-05 normal for being slow? I'm just used to a much stronger start with other liquid strains.

 

[CodeSection]

Could you have under pitched? Have many packets did you use and for what volume of wort?

 

[ryanj]

Could you have under pitched? Have many packets did you use and for what volume of wort?

IDK. I had an OG of 1.056, so that should be enough for 1 packet, right?

I could drop in another packet for good measure, but I'm more wondering if this is just the characteristics of working with dry yeast.

 

[CodeSection]

IDK. I had an OG of 1.056, so that should be enough for 1 packet, right?

I could drop in another packet for good measure, but I'm more wondering if this is just the characteristics of working with dry yeast.

What was your volume of wort into the fermenter?

EDIT: This link may help... https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/dry-yeast-pitching-rates.672248/

 

[ryanj]

5.25 gallons

This was a super simple batch. ...although, I did forget to add yeast nutrient..

 

[waldoar15]

Doesn't seem out of the ordinary for 05 to me.

 

[RM-MN]

When you use a liquid yeast a starter is often employed to build up the yeast population. These are often started 24 hours in advance of pitching. Your dry yeast is now building up its population so it isn't surprising that it takes longer to get going.

 

[kh54s10]

That doesn't seem to be too long for ANY yeast. A starter is already at optimum pitch rate (if calculated properly) and energized. Compare to other dry yeasts, not liquid in starters.

 

[jfolks]

Yes, it can be that slow!

 

[day_trippr]

Many agree

ime, it's not the most visually boisterous strain, but sans taking actual gravity measurements starting early on (like, 24 hours post-pitch) it's hard to say it's not actually working...

Cheers!

 

[waldoar15]

If you want to see it go crazy, save some of the slurry from this batch and pitch it on the next.

 

[Tobor_8thMan]

Not in my experience. If valid health, takes off quickly.

Additionally, if you want to see it go crazy brew with cane sugar (aka a cream ale).

 

[Ralphie0523]

RDWHAHB. US05 first pitch is always a bit of a bummer. If you harvest the yeast, I have gotten very active fermentation’s from it within 2-4 hours. For some reason, the first pitch always seems to take about 24-36 hours to take hold, but that is my anecdotal experience.

 

[Schlenkerla]

@ryanj

Oxygenation helps speed things. I understand dry yeast has oxygen reserves. So yes, 24-36 hours is not usual if dry but not significantly better rehydrated.

BTW - What's your temp on your beer?

Like you, I don't like the wait.

So I make a 500ml starter with dry yeast. Let it run a day or so on a stir plate. I've done it over the weekend too.

After chilling, I drop my warmed-up dissolved oxygen meter in my wort. It's typically telling me i my wort is 0-0.5ppm of dissolved oxygen.

Add my yeast starter to the wort.

Then blast it with oxygen to about 10ppm of dissolved oxygen. That's about 20-30 seconds.

Then I close up my fermentor and attach keg purging lines. I use the fermentation CO2 to purge my keg. The keg discharges CO2 into a growler filled with water.

If I pitch at 2AM its going gangbusters buy 6AM.

This is not crazy fast. I have one video on my phone that's like one continuous raspberry. This runs like this for about 36-48 hours at 68F. Then I swap in and out connections, connect the blow-off to my fermentor ball valve, and drop to my purged keg.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Let it ride. Us05 is very hearty. In the future I wouldn't do a starter. Just sprinkle it in.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Let it ride. Us05 is very hearty. In the future I wouldn't do a starter. Just sprinkle it in.

I've using S05 for years dry. It works good and very reliable. A couple days to start with week to two fermentation.

It's a faster more vital fermentation with big pitch.

I'm kegging in 36-48 hours after pitching on 1.056 OG beer. I also spund. I'm pitching Monday night. Dropping to a keg on Wednesday or Thursday. By Monday it's carbed and time to put in the keggerator.

 

[ryanj]

Gosh...this strain is sloooooww. Primary fermentation rolled in almost right after I made this thread, but it’s only dropped a few points per day. I guess I’m just used to liquid strains with starters chewing through 80% of the fermentation within 2 days and then hitting that long tail to finish out.

Still have a pretty decent amount of air lock activity but very slow gravity changes. At this point I’m probably just along for the ride.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Gosh...this strain is sloooooww. Primary fermentation rolled in almost right after I made this thread, but it’s only dropped a few points per day. I guess I’m just used to liquid strains with starters chewing through 80% of the fermentation within 2 days and then hitting that long tail to finish out.

Still have a pretty decent amount of air lock activity but very slow gravity changes. At this point I’m probably just along for the ride.

What's are your fermentation temps and did you oxygenate?

 

[Schlenkerla]

FYI

American Ale strain which produces well-balanced beers with low diacetyl and a very clean, crisp palate.

Safale US-05 is a dried American Ale strain with fermentation properties resembling that of Wyeast 1056 (American Ale) or White Labs WLP001 (California Ale). Sedimentation is low to medium, and final gravity is medium.

Optimum temp: 59°-75° F

 

[Dland]

I use US-05 all the time. One packet direct (dry) pitched for 10 gallons, pitch and primary fermentation temp; 65-68F. It is always working the next morning, and done in about a week.

 

[ryanj]

What's are your fermentation temps and did you oxygenate?

68F in a temp controlled chamber.

I always oxygenate with a wand and pure O2.

 

[Hanglow]

You don't really need o2 with uso5/chico as it has such low o2 requirements, unless you are making a huge beer. Although I've always found that it's a bit slow to finish average og worts compared to british yeasts though, say a week to finish rather than a few days.

 

[CodeSection]

I use US-05 all the time. One packet direct (dry) pitched for 10 gallons, pitch and primary fermentation temp; 65-68F. It is always working the next morning, and done in about a week.

Wow. That's considerably less than the recommended amount from Fermentis. But if it works for you, why change....

Based upon Fermentis' recommendation with just shy of 11 gallons of wort, the calculation comes in at 2.87 packets. So, I use three packets. Maybe that is why I see active fermentation in a short time....

 

[Dland]

Wow. That's considerably less than the recommended amount from Fermentis. But if it works for you, why change....

Based upon Fermentis' recommendation with just shy of 11 gallons of wort, the calculation comes in at 2.87 packets. So, I use three packets. Maybe that is why I see active fermentation in a short time....

Maybe you get your info from somewhere else, but instructions on packet says 1 pack for 20-30 liters. 30 liters is about 8 gallons, so my pitch rate is not too far off from mfg recommended, but yes, it always works and makes good beer. I do usually oxygenate w O2, even though it is probably not needed.

I doubt there is any downside to pitching the amount you do, other than increased cost.

 

[Immocles]

While I can’t monitor gravity in real time, I pitched a packet of 05 yesterday at about 3pm. It was forming a nice krausen and swirling quite actively at 6am this morning which is in line with most of my experience with it.

 

[CodeSection]

Maybe you get your info from somewhere else, but instructions on packet says 1 pack for 20-30 liters. 30 liters is about 8 gallons, so my pitch rate is not too far off from mfg recommended, but yes, it always works and makes good beer....

Here is info from their website....

Fermentis pitching recommendation...
"The recommended pitching rate for our Lager strains in a first use of active dry yeast is from 80 to 120 g/hl, corresponding to 7 to 11 million cells/ml and for Ale from 50 to 80 g/hl corresponding to 3 to 5 million cells/ml.

It is linked to the fact that our standard dosage in our packaging is around 10×10^9 cells/gr. On packaging, we are not mentioning the standard results but the absolute minimum guarantee so 6×10^9 viable cells/gr...."

https://fermentis.com/en/tips-n-tricks/questions-and-answers/

https://fermentis.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/SafAle-US-05.pdf

EDIT: The below quote and math calculation from brewbama may help...

Just another data point (or two):

Fermentis doesn’t offer a calculator I can find but they have a chart listing suggested pitch rates:

ALE YEASTS: 50-80 g/hl (0.06-0.10 oz/gal), 4-6 106 cells/ml. I use an average at 65 g/hl = 13.65 g per 21 liters (~5.5 gal) which is a bit more than one so I pitch two packs....

LAGER YEASTS: 80-120 g/hl (0.10-0.16 oz/gal), 8-12 106 cells/ml. Again, I average at 100 g/hl = 21 g per 21 liters so I pitch two packs....

 

[Schlenkerla]

68F in a temp controlled chamber.

I always oxygenate with a wand and pure O2.

Ok, those are eliminated. Hmm.

How old was the yeast?

You got any extra packs?

 

[Dland]

Here is info from their website....

Fermentis pitching recommendation...
"The recommended pitching rate for our Lager strains in a first use of active dry yeast is from 80 to 120 g/hl, corresponding to 7 to 11 million cells/ml and for Ale from 50 to 80 g/hl corresponding to 3 to 5 million cells/ml.

It is linked to the fact that our standard dosage in our packaging is around 10×10^9 cells/gr. On packaging, we are not mentioning the standard results but the absolute minimum guarantee so 6×10^9 viable cells/gr...."

https://fermentis.com/en/tips-n-tricks/questions-and-answers/

https://fermentis.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/SafAle-US-05.pdf

EDIT: The below quote and math calculation from brewbama may help...

That's cool, but I'll stick to the instructions they put on their packages. More understandable to my age and alcohol addled mind, and it works, and it's cheaper.

Heck, I started brewing before there even were websites. ;}

 

[schematix]

I've had some packets take up to 48 hours. Not sure i have an explanation for it though. I bought a 500g block a few months ago and i've pitched from it 4 times now. All were going vigorously within 8 hours and were in the keg within 4 days. Within that batch its been consistent. I am pitching massively though. Almost 3 times what you did.

 

[davidabcd]

I don't notice US-05 being slow and it starts within six hours or something like that. Fermenter goes quiet after five days and FG has been reached when I check it 3 weeks later. I use 2 packs since all my beers I make with it have high OGs. I sprinkle it on and then paddle to oxygenate whether that's needed or not. I also use yeast nutrients with every batch.

 

[kh54s10]

RDWHAHB. US05 first pitch is always a bit of a bummer. If you harvest the yeast, I have gotten very active fermentation’s from it within 2-4 hours. For some reason, the first pitch always seems to take about 24-36 hours to take hold, but that is my anecdotal experience.

I use US-05 a lot. With dry yeast there is no reason to oxygenate. That need is handled in the engineering of the yeast - sterols in the coating applied, I think
I have never had one that was not going well by the next morning so no more than 18 hours and it finishes just about as fast as most other yeasts I have used.
I wait 2 weeks before bottling/kegging. It has been done by then. I often procrastinate and don't get it packaged that soon.

So, IMO, US-05 is not a slow yeast.

 

[Schlenkerla]

I've had some packets take up to 48 hours. Not sure i have an explanation for it though. I bought a 500g block a few months ago and i've pitched from it 4 times now. All were going vigorously within 8 hours and were in the keg within 4 days. Within that batch its been consistent. I am pitching massively though. Almost 3 times what you did.

After I considered KMB/SMB being a hindrance I bought a DO Meter. I too pitch big. Somebody over in LOB Forum mentioned vitality starters, after trying that, I never looked back. Not to mention I want to brew and keg in the same week. So pitching big is where it's at for me.

 

[Schlenkerla]

I use US-05 a lot. With dry yeast there is no reason to oxygenate. That need is handled in the engineering of the yeast - sterols in the coating applied, I think
I have never had one that was not going well by the next morning so no more than 18 hours and it finishes just about as fast as most other yeasts I have used.
I wait 2 weeks before bottling/kegging. It has been done by then. I often procrastinate and don't get it packaged that soon.

So, IMO, US-05 is not a slow yeast.

True. Typically, it's NOT a slow yeast.

The age of the yeast and how it was stored makes a difference. If ones got an old pack and has seen temp swings it could be sluggish.

 

[ryanj]

Ok, those are eliminated. Hmm.

How old was the yeast?

You got any extra packs?

So... I think I figured out what could be the issue. First, I never work with dry yeast, so I’m a little rusty. When rehydrating, for some reason I thought I read to to use 110-112F water. So maybe my cell count dropped out due to the higher temps.

I decided to just toss another pack in with proper rehydration temps...

When I popped the lid on my anvil fermenter I had a pretty nice head of Kraussen, so I’ll just sit back and let this batch ride for a few days.

 

[day_trippr]

[...]Primary fermentation rolled in almost right after I made this thread, but it’s only dropped a few points per day. [...]

Something ain't right then. In my experience, with a proper pitch and run in its comfort zone temperature-wise, US-05 will reach terminal gravity within four days from the pitch (and probably earlier, but I've never checked after 72 hours)...

Cheers!

 

[brewbama]

One pack in 5 gal 1.056 is not enough IMO. That’s why folks complain about the sluggish ferment the first pitch. The OEM says that will happen when you under pitch. It required 15.1 grams. If you use two packs you get much better results.

 

[Schlenkerla]

One pack in 5 gal 1.056 is not enough IMO. That’s why folks complain about the sluggish ferment the first pitch. The OEM says that will happen when you under pitch. It required 15.1 grams. If you use two packs you get much better results.

View attachment 653828

Word to your mother!!!!

 

[Ralphie0523]

I use US-05 a lot. With dry yeast there is no reason to oxygenate. That need is handled in the engineering of the yeast - sterols in the coating applied, I think
I have never had one that was not going well by the next morning so no more than 18 hours and it finishes just about as fast as most other yeasts I have used.
I wait 2 weeks before bottling/kegging. It has been done by then. I often procrastinate and don't get it packaged that soon.

So, IMO, US-05 is not a slow yeast.

Dry yeast is much better than they used to be and I have never had a problem with US05, just slower than its progeny after harvesting.

A 4th pitch of US05 with UltraFerm in a Brüt IPA is something to behold.

Glad everything worked out. Cheers!

 

[kh54s10]

I've pitched only one pack of US-05 in batches up to 1.070 or thereabouts. Without fail there was good fermentation going in the morning so the longest would have been less than 18 hours. My longest lag time ever was not US-05 and was about 24 hours.

 

[brewbama]

Fermentation starts immediately, but significant CO2 release and aroma formation will only be perceptible after 12 to 24 hours for ale yeasts and 16 to 32 hours for lager yeasts. I have experienced must faster evidence.