Is Sam Adams on their way?

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
J

Joesf35

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2011
Messages
113
Reaction score
2
Location
Margate
Not sure if Sam has been talked to death or not, my search options are limited on my phone. But I think it's great to see this company finally making money and generating a steady cash flow. They seem to spend a lot more, as a percentage of their revenue, on their ingredients and RnD then the other big commercial brewers. They have really paved the way for the craft brewers in this new craft movement in America. Do you guys think they will move to the top?
Blue Moon and Sierra Nevada are also moving up, showing up in bars and on store shelves a lot more.
It looks like the sale of Busch was timed perfectly.
What do you guys think?
 
I like Sam A. alright, but I have to say their cherry wheat seems to be the absolute most hated beer on the face of the earth on this forum. Boston lager is OK though....meh.
 
You mean to tell me they have not been making money up until now?

they sure spend plenty on advertising.
 
Sam has been spending more than they were taking in, like you said a lot of it was marketing and other investments. They were chipping away at their cash. Now they are banking.
It is frigging hilarious that everyone hates the cherry wheat but winds up making it for the wife so that she will support the hobby. (or because they love her.....). I am starting a cherry wheat for the misses tonight!
 
Blue Moon is made by Coors, so they have been doing fine for quite some time now ;)

It is nice to see Sam Adams in alot of places now, especially since my local dive bar which has a limited beer selection now has Boston Lager on tap.
 
No cherry wheat for me, so none for the missus. I don't think SA will ever take over BMC. But please don't compare Blue Moon to SN or SA. Geez, it's the worst, (worse than cherry wheat to me), and it's made by Coors. Sam Adams is great for me, because they do usually have a tap at most bars/restaraunts. Love the Noble Pils.
 
I didn't know blue moon was coors, interesting. Sierra is their own privately owned brewery, they are no stone but they are stealing market share from the big three.
 
I am happy with the increase in SN in my local tiny town. Used to be JUST SNPA. Now we're stocking SNPA, Torpedo and whatever seasonal/new release they get. Also started carrying Bells last month with 2 hearted and a seasonal at any time. I think craft beer in general is growing.

For Blue Moon, yes it's coors. Everytime you see a new "craft" beer show up on your local shelf, I suggest looking around the 6 pack box. The big guys are getting savvy to the craft packaging styles and trying to sneak some in on us. Example, ShockTop is AB, but you have to look for it on the 6'er. That said, it's not a horrible beer.
 
It's a "relative" on their way, as in top of the top. Their market cap is still a fraction of the other guys.
 
Joesf, do you know what percentage of their expenses go to the cost of ingredients, you said it was high, I'm guessing it's somewhere in realm of 40%.

Also as far as boston beer companies cash influx, I guess their IPO is starting to pay off.

Jim Koch seems like one of the most down to earth millionaires in the world, he deserves all of the good fortune BBC
Is experiencing.
 
They have a lot of expenditures. Ingredients and other materials used in making the beer is about 50% of their cash flow. They have spent a lot on machinery/equipment and new plant(s) in the past two years. Of course energy to run the plants and other operating expenses is pretty significant. Then there is advertising and overhead.
 
I guess my two cents (which I've tossed in on other SA threads) is...

I don't like ALL of SA's beers nor do I think each of their beers is the best example of each style you can find.

Yeah sure, people HATE the Cherry Wheat but SA makes something insane like 40 or so different beers and with the exception of the dreaded Cherry Wheat... I think it is a tough argument to make that they "suck". I REALLY like their Black Lager.

Anyway... my point is... I think Jim Koch and Sam Adams has done a TON for "craft beer awareness" and helping craft beer grow in this country for the last ten years and, while no one has said it on this thread, I get frustrated when people accuse SA of being "sellouts" or making crappy beer. They are in the business to make money, just like everyone else, and I think Jim Koch is on the short list of the most influential "beer guys" in the country along with guys like Sam or even Vinnie at RR and Tomme at Lost Abbey/Port.

...and sorry... I realize that isn't EXACTLY on topic but, just wanted to toss it out there.
 
"Finally making money and generating a steady cash flow?" :confused:

SAM's not the most stable profit-generating firm in the world, their numbers tend to bounce around a little, but they've posted a net profit every year since 1993. They've had positive free cash flow every year except one since 1998. They're pretty well-established as a business.

As to the beers... forget Cherry Wheat and the Cranberry Lambic, those should never have been released. I'll agree with the previously-expressed sentiment that the Black Lager and Noble Pils are wonderful beers, and I enjoy their Oktoberfest better than most German ones just because it's fresher. There aren't many Sammy beers other than those fruit beers that I haven't liked.
 
the_bird said:
"Finally making money and generating a steady cash flow?" :confused:

SAM's not the most stable profit-generating firm in the world, their numbers tend to bounce around a little, but they've posted a net profit every year since 1993. They've had positive free cash flow every year except one since 1998. They're pretty well-established as a business.
Click to expand...

I should have been more clear with the original post. Relatively speaking they were making pennies compared to the big guys. They spent lots of money recently to step it up and it was a great investment. They are now generating tons of cash this year and last. I would say their noble pils is the most drinkable for the mainstream tastes.
 
Old_E said:
Ditto. Is this post from 1998?
Click to expand...

Not to sound bitter for being lambasted over here, but I assume you bought a few thousand dollars worth of stock during their IPO?
 
Craft beer is a tiny portion of the market, like 4%. Sam Adams is the largest producer of that tiny share.
 
Weizenwerks said:
Craft beer is a tiny portion of the market, like 4%. Sam Adams is the largest producer of that tiny share.
Click to expand...

Big enough to change the definition of a craft brewery.

Still though, someone advised me to watch beer wars (i think that's the name) and in it Jim makes the case that his entire life's production is the big threes industrial waste. Very true when you look at the scale their breweries are on.
 
gregpio85 said:
Big enough to change the definition of a craft brewery.
Click to expand...
Which means nothing really. BMC aren't worried about craft breweries. Labeling brands and marketing them as craft beers is only slapping the craft brewers in the face. It's a bully move. Craft breweries can get the "magic" 10% of market share and BMC won't lose sleep.
 
I don't think it is a matter of losing sleep... it is a matter of what the market will demand... and I think the growth of SA is evidence of where the market is going. If you look at the number of "beer bars"... I mean REAL beer bars ten years ago, vs. five years ago, vs. a year ago... you will see HUGE growth. Look at the people on this forum. It seems like HBT hits a new all time record of "continuous logins" every couple of months.

The question is... who is in the best position to benefit from that growth? My answer would be SA... and a few others. BMC has stagnant market share that will only be eroded more and more over time. And a company like Sam Adams... has a very small profit base that they are growing at a very healthy clip (the driver of stock price).
 
Hoppin_Mad said:
I like Sam A. alright, but I have to say their cherry wheat seems to be the absolute most hated beer on the face of the earth on this forum. Boston lager is OK though....meh.
Click to expand...

I take it you haven't had the Sam Adams Stoney Brook Red Ale?

Grossest beer I've had. Sour Cherry-infused. No thank you.


Is Sam in every state yet? Living in Boston, its been on tap for years here, but what's it like on the West Coast?
 
SpanishCastleAle said:
It was SA that got me interested in homebrewing in the mid 90s and got me off BMC. So in some small way I'm forever in debt to them.
Click to expand...

I second that....SA was the first "real" beer I ever tried...I've been hooked ever since. and I owe Jim Koch credit for this expensive hobby/obsession of mine :)

Don't hate on Coors for Blue Moon.....Don't forget it was derived at there micro brewery restaurant at Coors field ( Home of the 2007 NL Champion Colorado Rockies) ...a somewhat autonimous opearation within the company...plus they support the AC Golden brewing Co. as an in house craft brewery that does some neat stuff and apparently some R and D.
 
We've been getting Sam Adams here on the east coast of Canada for a couple for of years now. Not all the types made it here, but what has I have liked...Noble Pils, Summer Ale, Boston Lager, Winter Lager, Octoberfest all good! I hope our Liquor store will bring some others.
 
Sam Adams started in '93 right? So 18 years ago they began as the first recognized craft brewery in the country (I'm assuming... I was 12 in '93). Over the course of 18 years they, and all the other craft breweries have stolen 4.4% of the martketshare from BMC. I read an article today in the Grand Rapids Press that gave that figure. I don't think that Sam Adams has hurt for money in well over a decade, and they've been well on their way for a lot longer than that. They make great beers of many styles, I don't understand the hate here for Cherry wheat, its not that bad! I can drink 1 or 2 but no more than that. Its not a grab-a-6 and get drunk on it type of beer.

To the OP, unless you mean something else than what it appears, everyone here is under the impression that you believe Sam Adams has been a pauper company for a long time.
 
RedIrocZ-28 said:
To the OP, unless you mean something else than what it appears, everyone here is under the impression that you believe Sam Adams has been a pauper company for a long time.
Click to expand...

The intent was to see who thought they had a chance to make it into the big three in America (ignoring the fact that Busch is a subsidiary now) and push one of the other guys out of the way. They had been making money but their revenue has more than doubled in the last two years. So now they are making "you can't stop my climb" kind of money.
 
Nothing is for certain. Things happen fast in business and you always fall faster than you climb.

Craft beer has a long way to go if a company wants to oust one of the big production breweries.
 
RMitch said:
I take it you haven't had the Sam Adams Stoney Brook Red Ale?

Grossest beer I've had. Sour Cherry-infused. No thank you.


Is Sam in every state yet? Living in Boston, its been on tap for years here, but what's it like on the West Coast?
Click to expand...

Nah, have only tried the boston lager and the ocktoberfest. Seems like alot of places around me (dallas) do not carry a whole lot of their line.

I just think it is funny how much hate gets directed toward the cherry wheat on here! Seems like you can't screw up a nice fruity wheat beer that bad, but I have not tried it...

I pass on most of their beers when I see them because the boston lager and ocktoberfest didn't really impress me, but compared to BMC I would still take a SA any day.

The cranberry lambic might be a little scary though....
 

Similar threads

T
Anderson Valley Brewing has been acquired
Replies
0
Views
655
TwistedGray
T
RKi
Final beer pH in Ales. Manipulation, factors effecting it etc....
Replies
6
Views
3K
RKi
RKi
M
  • Article
Overview of Land Grant Brewing, Columbus OH.
Replies
5
Views
1K
EDF713
EDF713
M
So am i crazy???...thought of going pro.
2 3
Replies
84
Views
8K
BlkWater_brewer
BlkWater_brewer
huckstep
has craft beer abandoned sam adams
Replies
19
Views
2K
rodwha
rodwha

Latest posts

Back
Top