How sweet it is? AG Mash questions

[HeavyKettleBrewing]

First, thanks for reading. I started my second batch of AG yesterday after getting some tips at my LHBS. First batch was not as efficient as I would have liked and I learned a few things about sparge rates. I went too fast, that's what she said! Second batch was a Cream Ale. Recipe looked like this:
8lbs Maris Otter
8oz Carapils
8oz Caramel 10
1lb flaked corn
1oz cascade (60m)
1oz Saaz (15m)
1oz Saaz (5m)
WLP080 Cream Ale Yeast
Single infuse mash at 152 (60m)
Start Gravity = 1.052/1.055
OG = 1.072

I vorlauf and batch sparge. Iodine test showed conversion was there. Ended up with initial boil volume of 5 gal. Boil, hops, chill and measure. Lost a gallon in boil but the gravity spiked above 1.07! I was shooting for a OG of 1.055 before fermenting, SO, I added one gallon of aerated water to fermenter, pitched yeast and forgot to check the gravity after adding the extra gallon of water (Late night). The wort was really, REALLY sweet and malty. If anybody can tell me if that high a jump in gravity is common, I would appreciate it. Also, first time with MO, is this typical a flavor profile before fermenting (SWEET)? What should I expect (flavor profile) after finishing? Sorry if I am long winded, just trying to make each batch better than the last.

 

[daveooph131]

I use MO in my IPA and love it. It shouldn't be too sweet. Not sure about your spike in gravity.

 

[rp5brew]

Maddad-

By my math your OG is about 93.7% brew house efficiency- pretty impressive!

When I first made the switch to AG it took me a few time to figure out what sort of efficiency to expect, and as a result I would overshoot my target OG. IMHO higher efficiency is not a bad thing. It saves you money on grain.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

The wort should be incredibly sweet especially at higher OGs.

And, upon entering the recipe into beersmith, it is not at all weird for you to be getting a gravity reading of 1.072 for 4 gallons if your efficiency is around 80%

With a gallon top-up, beersmith is giving an OG of 1.057... you're fine

 

[Golddiggie]

If your pre-boil volume was 5 gallons, then that explains it right there. It would have been smarter to take the OG once you were at ~5 gallons, prior to pitching the yeast.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

By my math your OG is about 93.7% brew house efficiency- pretty impressive!

Did you take into account that it was 1.072 at 4 gallons and he topped up with a gallon of water?

 

[rp5brew]

Did you take into account that it was 1.072 at 4 gallons and he topped up with a gallon of water?

I did the 5 gallon pre-boil volume. Thought he said it was a pre boil OG. mis read.

 

[HeavyKettleBrewing]

All, thanks for the quick response. I have created a monster of a hobby, but it is one that my friends have been able to enjoy more than my other endeavors. I was worried about having an overly sweet beer and one that may not be as dry as I hoped.

@Golddiggie: Quite a jump of 20pts even with the loss of a gallon during boil. I measured gravity pre-boil to evaluate efficiency. My hijacking the kitchen for six hours had me rushing the wort into fermenter, thus forgetting to check the gravity prior to pitching.

How does one evaluate desired OG when preparing the grain bill and water requirements when mashing/sparging? Concerned over the changes with loss of H2O during boil. I have seen reference to Brewsmith but am reluctant to buy/learn new software. Has it made brewing easier for those using it? Is it intuitive?

 

[Reno_eNVy]

So, in reference to your last paragraph, here are some things you need to condier:

1) Your grain will absorb your mash water. General rule is 10# of grain will absorb roughly 1 gallon of water

2) You are probably going to experience some dead-space loss. In other words, there are going to be regions of your MLT that your manifold cannot get to so you may lose a few pints up to a quart or two (depending on how efficient your lautering is)

3) You're going to lose liquid to the boil, which is obvious. However, depending on how strong your heat source is and the relative humidity in your region, boil-off rates can be faster or slower that what others may experience.

These are things you're just going to need to dial-in on, seeing as they are different for every set-up. My general rule is if I want to end up with 5.5 gallons in the fermenter, I shoot for a total of 8 gallons of mash and sparge water.... this, of course, can vary depending on the amount of grains I use but I always shoot for a pre-boil volume of 7 gallons since I generally lose 1.5 gallons to boil-off.

 

[HeavyKettleBrewing]

@Reno:
Thanks for the rundown. I expected the loss in mash but did not expect a one gallon boil off. I did boil more vigorously this time around thinking it may help with the hot break. Judging from what seems to be typical, the gravity will change from pre-boil to fermenter. Your statement is valid as each setup is different. I hope to fine tune my process soon. This is part of the fun and keeps brewing a challenge.