How long will milled conditioned grains last?

[Straykiller]

Was planning on brewing tonight and decided to test out my new grain mill. I conditioned my grain with about 2% water of the total weight and milled it up. It went amazing I couldn’t believe how well the husks were preserved. Unfourtunatly I’m not going to brew tonight and maybe not even tomorrow. Will the crushed conditioned grain last two days? Thanks for your help.

 

[MHBT]

i would assume 2 days plus damp malt might sour your grist or mold might start to grow but idk for sure

 

[kh54s10]

2 days for sure. 2 weeks should be OK unless you subject them to a lot of humidity. Seal them up in something and if possible put them in the fridge.

 

[kh54s10]

I don't think they should be damp enough to cause a problem.

 

[Straykiller]

2 days for sure. 2 weeks should be OK unless you subject them to a lot of humidity. Seal them up in something and if possible put them in the fridge.

I can’t put them in the fridge the grains expanded after crushing and filled a 5 gallon bucket to the brim. It’s supposed to get cold tomorrow, overnight 25 degrees with a high of 58. I could seal the bucket and store it in the garage possibly, I was planning on keeping it inside where it’s about 68 degrees but won’t if it would be better for them to stay cold.

I don't think they should be damp enough to cause a problem.

They don’t feel damp, the amount of liquid was really only enough to soften the husks to keep them mostly whole after crushing. I also didn’t dump the water in, I misted it in and mixed multiple times. There a decent amount of grain flower so I’m guessing it wasn’t too wet.

 

[Straykiller]

i would assume 2 days plus damp malt might sour your grist or mold might start to grow but idk for sure

Man I hope not. Might have to do an overnight brew tomorrow.

 

[MHBT]

Man I hope not. Might have to do an overnight brew tomorrow.

You said they dont feel damp? you should be good, maybe find a way to spread them out

 

[day_trippr]

If the grain is damp the lacto is going to run wild in hours...

 

[ZuzBrews]

You will be fine. I have stored conditioned crushed grain for over a week in a 5 gallon bucket with a lid for over a week and not had any issues.

 

[kh54s10]

How big a batch. My biggest 5 gallon beer filled a bucket maybe 2/3. It was not conditioned. I wouldn't think it could possibly expand that much unless it is a lot wetter than it seems.

I guess lacto might change the flavor of the mash. I would think it would die in the boil.

I have only conditioned once using a spray bottle. I think I might have used a cup or two of water in the grains for an average 5 gallon brew. How much water do you think you used?

Let us know if it starts smelling bad and how long it takes, so that others will know.

 

[thehaze]

If the milled grains are properly sealed, like from your LBHS, then you would be able to keep them for a few weeks. I have kept crushed grains in both sealed and open bags ( which I sealed back using a zip tie or something simiilar ) for weeks, and I when I finally used them, they did not ruin my beer.

There is however the possibility that I'm making bad beer and I have bad taste in beer and low expectations, but those crushed grains did not negatively influence my brews, to such an extent, that I had to dump the beer or even give it for free to enemies.

 

[Yooper]

If the milled grains are properly sealed, like from your LBHS, then you would be able to keep them for a few weeks. I have kept crushed grains in both sealed and open bags ( which I sealed back using a zip tie or something simiilar ) for weeks, and I when I finally used them, they did not ruin my beer.

There is however the possibility that I'm making bad beer and I have bad taste in beer and low expectations, but those crushed grains did not negatively influence my brews.

Me too- but I never conditioned the grain first and then tried to store it.

Moist crushed grain at room temperature sounds like it could be more likely to spoil, but I don't know how fast that would happen. I'd definitely keep an eye on it and not use it if it started to go sour. You can taste the grain, and see if it's still fresh before using it.

 

[RM-MN]

Taste the grains and plan on brewing tonight. It doesn't take a lot of moisture to let bacteria get started and if your grains swelled after milling I think you have a lot more moisture than you think.

 

[thehaze]

I mean, I did taste and smelled the hell out of the crushed grains, which having been stored for a longer time, just to be sure that they are not obviously spoiled. And they never were, as spoiled grains usually have a pretty obvious, sharp smell to it and taste will definitely tell you what's wrong.

 

[ba-brewer]

I have only conditioned once using a spray bottle. I think I might have used a cup or two of water in the grains for an average 5 gallon brew. How much water do you think you used?

That is way too much water to condition grain, it has been so long ago that I put marks on my spritz bottle but I think it is something like 3oz or 4oz of water for a 5gal batch(9 to 10lb of grain).

 

[mattdee1]

I'm surprised I've never heard of this business of spraying water on grains before crushing them... all I know is it seems pretty darn likely to me that mold (or something) wouldn't wait long to take hold in the room temperature darkness of a moist grain bucket.

My latest batch used grains that were crushed 2 months prior and the beer tastes great, but those grains were kept dry and sealed in a bucket with airtight lid.

 

[MaxStout]

I'm surprised I've never heard of this business of spraying water on grains before crushing them... all I know is it seems pretty darn likely to me that mold (or something) wouldn't wait long to take hold in the room temperature darkness of a moist grain bucket.

My latest batch used grains that were crushed 2 months prior and the beer tastes great, but those grains were kept dry and sealed in a bucket with airtight lid.

The idea of conditioning is that the husks will remain largely intact during the milling process. But conditioning/milling should be done shortly before mash in.

 

[mattdee1]

The idea of conditioning is that the husks will remain largely intact during the milling process.

I see... and why are intact husks a goal? Is it to reduce tannin extraction, or is it to help prevent stuck sparges (i.e., like rice hulls would)?

If it's the latter, as an aside, I don't really understand why stuck sparges are such a scourge in homebrewing. I've got a basic orange Igloo cooler MT with false bottom, never once used rice hulls, and never once had a stuck sparge, even when I did a beer with almost 50% flaked wheat. Slow and steady wins the race, I guess.

 

[ba-brewer]

I see... and why are intact husks a goal? Is it to reduce tannin extraction, or is it to help prevent stuck sparges (i.e., like rice hulls would)?

If it's the latter, as an aside, I don't really understand why stuck sparges are such a scourge in homebrewing. I've got a basic orange Igloo cooler MT with false bottom, never once used rice hulls, and never once had a stuck sparge, even when I did a beer with almost 50% flaked wheat. Slow and steady wins the race, I guess.

More intact hulls help to filter the mash and improves the odds of not getting a struck sparge. Conditioned grain can be milled tighter and result in more smaller size broken kernels with less flour. 20 to 40min is about all the time required.

 

[ancientmariner52]

Conditioning grain makes the hulls, for want of a better term, leathery. They pass through the mill in much larger pieces, providing the same benefit as rice hulls. I spread my grist out in a large shallow plastic storage bin, I think intended for storing stuff under a bed. I spray a third of the water, cover, shake, repeat. Wait 20 minutes, mill and mash. I use about 1 oz per 3 lb, and I like the results. I can't see a scenario where I would condition or mill except right before the mash, so I can't help there. I rinse and air dry the conditioning tote, and never use it for anything else. I'm not reccomending this method, it's just what I do.

 

[Yooper]

I mean, I did taste and smelled the hell out of the crushed grains, which having been stored for a longer time, just to be sure that they are not obviously spoiled. And they never were, as spoiled grains usually have a pretty obvious, sharp smell to it and taste will definitely tell you what's wrong.

Of course- but it's different when the grains are wet. Dry crushed grains can be stored for quite a while before going "bad", but may lose some freshness. Damp crushed grain at room temperature would not be at all the same.

 

[RM-MN]

I see... and why are intact husks a goal? Is it to reduce tannin extraction, or is it to help prevent stuck sparges (i.e., like rice hulls would)?

If it's the latter, as an aside, I don't really understand why stuck sparges are such a scourge in homebrewing. I've got a basic orange Igloo cooler MT with false bottom, never once used rice hulls, and never once had a stuck sparge, even when I did a beer with almost 50% flaked wheat. Slow and steady wins the race, I guess.

You aren't milling your grains fine enough if you have never had a stuck sparge even when using that much wheat.

 

[MaxStout]

Conditioning the grain prior to milling is a method also used by LODO brewers, to minimize oxidation effects on the grain. Having more intact husks minimizes the surface area exposed to the air, and hence, less oxidation.

 

[grampamark]

I'm a grain farmer. I've grown a lot of malting barley over the years. Grain, whether whole or crushed, with or without a little extra moisture, will store safely a lot longer than you folks think it will.

RDWHAHB.

 

[mattdee1]

You aren't milling your grains fine enough if you have never had a stuck sparge even when using that much wheat.

If I hit predicted numbers with reasonable/typical accuracy and the product turns out well, I don't really understand why I would look at changing how fine the grains are milled. Am I missing something?

 

[RM-MN]

If I hit predicted numbers with reasonable/typical accuracy and the product turns out well, I don't really understand why I would look at changing how fine the grains are milled. Am I missing something?

If you are happy with your results, ignore my post. Many of would rather get higher mash efficiency and then adjust the recipe to reflect that. With a conventional mash tun the conventional wisdom is to keep adjusting the mill finer until one gets a stuck sparge, them open the mill just a bit. Wheat is a smaller and harder kernel than barley and when the mill is adjusted to take that into account it will tend to compact down, plus wheat has no husk to help form a filter bed. If you went 50% wheat and had no stuck sparge without rice hulls the recipe you followed was planned for low efficiency.

 

[Straykiller]

Just brewed with the grain last night, we will see how it turns out. The grain didn’t smell off at all. To whom asked it was 16 1/2 lbs of grain conditioned before milling using a spray bottle. After milled it was almost flush with the top of the bucked so it did expand becuse the husks were very intact. The grain never felt wet before milling and it didn’t gum up my mill which would have indicated they were too wet.

 

[ba-brewer]

How did you end up storing the milled grain and for how many days?

 

[Straykiller]

How did you end up storing the milled grain and for how many days?

In the house at 68 degrees for two days if I recall correctly. I placed foil over the top of the bucket, if there was moisture I didn’t want to trap it.

 

[kh54s10]

That is way too much water to condition grain, it has been so long ago that I put marks on my spritz bottle but I think it is something like 3oz or 4oz of water for a 5gal batch(9 to 10lb of grain).

Well that was just an estimate. I didn't really pay attention to how much. I was noting the amount because it didn't make the grains swell at all.

I also tried it only once. I use a Corona style mill and they shred the hulls anyway. I didn't notice any difference, and my system isn't susceptible to stuck sparges so a handful of rice hulls is a lot easier.