Homemade Bread Thread

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Well shameless plug for my festbier, first lager in like 30 years, with an easter lunch of cured German meats, French Savoie (cow's) and Basque (sheep's) cheeses, and a Roggenschrotbrot mit Sonnenblumkerne, no flour, just 100% freshly cracked rye ("fein, mittel und groß," fine/pumpernickel, middle and coarsely cracked), sourdough, toasted sunflower seeds.

easter festbier.jpg
easter 2004 repast.jpg
 
^Thanks for the feedback Hoppy2bmerry! Tried to compare it to results I've seen online. No complaints here though and it held up nicely for nearly a week.
 
^Thanks for the feedback Hoppy2bmerry! Tried to compare it to results I've seen online. No complaints here though and it held up nicely for nearly a week.
I hope this helps.
A7B38B5A-A784-4E12-8275-261D4139528D.jpeg

After a couple days in a linen bag, my loaf goes in plastic and into the fridge for toasting.
 
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Baking a few for a meditation retreat beginning tomorrow. Mehrkornbrot, an Austrian sourdough with home milled cracked spelt (fine and middle-grained), cracked rye (middle-coarse), medium rye and wheat flours, oatmeal, flaxseed, roast sunflower seeds, touch of "brotgewürz" or bread spice, a blend commonly used in German/Austrian/Swiss alpine bread baking. Other one is just a rustic levain boule - 70% bread flour, 9% hard spring wheat, 9% hard winter wheat, 9% spelt, 3% rye (all whole grain, home-milled).

mehrkornbrot 4-13-24.jpg

rubaud levain 4-13-24.jpg


Baking one more this morning, a Kasseler Würstchen. "Würstchen" or "spicy" just implies this version has more rye than the "mildes" or "hell" version, which has more wheat. Kasseler is a common German daily, household bread. One from the past.

Kasseler (würzig) 8-31.jpg
 
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Baking a few for a meditation retreat beginning tomorrow. Mehrkornbrot, an Austrian sourdough with home milled cracked spelt (fine and middle-grained), cracked rye (middle-coarse), medium rye and wheat flours, oatmeal, flaxseed, roast sunflower seeds, touch of "brotgewürz" or bread spice, a blend commonly used in German/Austrian/Swiss alpine bread baking. Other one is just a rustic levain boule - 70% bread flour, 9% hard spring wheat, 9% hard winter wheat, 9% spelt, 3% rye (all whole grain, home-milled).

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View attachment 846482

Baking one more this morning, a Kasseler Würstchen. "Würstchen" or "spicy" just implies this version has more rye than the "mildes" or "hell" version, which has more wheat. Kasseler is a common German daily, household bread. One from the past.

View attachment 846485
Bakery quality breads.
 
Bakery quality breads.
Well that's really kind of you man. I do love it, and work at it. There's been some community interest in a sort of nano-bakery....I have a neighborhood listserv of a few hundred people who have come forward, and I'd bake weekly and sell the breads in a van out of a local parking lot, lol. Thankfully, in WI, there is no prohibition and very little hoops to jump through to do just that, provided I keep it small. Far easier than doing a nano-brewery!
 
Well that's really kind of you man. I do love it, and work at it. There's been some community interest in a sort of nano-bakery....I have a neighborhood listserv of a few hundred people who have come forward, and I'd bake weekly and sell the breads in a van out of a local parking lot, lol. Thankfully, in WI, there is no prohibition and very little hoops to jump through to do just that, provided I keep it small. Far easier than doing a nano-brewery!
I wish you good luck should you decide to do that. It's almost close enough to send our son over for your bread. He's in Rochester, MN.
 
Been playing around with really high hydration. Such a fun hobby! I was given 500# of really good bread flour. I gave 400# of it away to friends. Playing with bread has never been more fun!

Awesome! If interested, this guy's work is really, really good, and his book, Open Crumb Mastery, is more than worth it. He goes through the how's and why's, including achieving open crumbs with various degrees of hydration, as well as ratios of whole grain flours and fermentation regimens. Have fun!
 
I just ordered a new kitchen range with a convection oven. I've never had that feature before, plus the old oven would overshoot the temperature setting so much it was hard to cook anything without burning it. (that worked well for pizza) It gets here in about a week and I'm looking forward to trying it out. Any tips on using a convection oven? I assume that would be good for baking bread.

Also this oven has a "steam clean" feature where you pour a cup of water in oven floor and run a short clean cycle. The pour a cup of water in the bottom part should be good for bread baking too. I don't know if that's compatible with the convection fan or not.

I've tried a couple of times lately to make central Texas style kolaches. (enriched dough rolls with filling in the middle like a danish.) The first batch sucked but the dogs really liked them. Second batch where I proofed the yeast before adding the flour etc and I put a little more effort into the filling looked beautiful and tasted almost good but not quite there yet. I think next time I'm going to start with a yeasted donut recipe for the dough but substitute bread flour for the AP it calls for. Straight donut dough would be too tender; the recipe I was using was a little too tough, but that might be because I wasn't working the dough quite right yet.
 
I just ordered a new kitchen range with a convection oven. I've never had that feature before, plus the old oven would overshoot the temperature setting so much it was hard to cook anything without burning it. (that worked well for pizza) It gets here in about a week and I'm looking forward to trying it out. Any tips on using a convection oven? I assume that would be good for baking bread.

Also this oven has a "steam clean" feature where you pour a cup of water in oven floor and run a short clean cycle. The pour a cup of water in the bottom part should be good for bread baking too. I don't know if that's compatible with the convection fan or not.

I've tried a couple of times lately to make central Texas style kolaches. (enriched dough rolls with filling in the middle like a danish.) The first batch sucked but the dogs really liked them. Second batch where I proofed the yeast before adding the flour etc and I put a little more effort into the filling looked beautiful and tasted almost good but not quite there yet. I think next time I'm going to start with a yeasted donut recipe for the dough but substitute bread flour for the AP it calls for. Straight donut dough would be too tender; the recipe I was using was a little too tough, but that might be because I wasn't working the dough quite right yet.
Convection works fine. You probably know this but you'll need to turn the heat down a bit off your normal baking temp (been a fairly long while, but I see 25 F less a lot). And I would go by an oven thermometer, not what's indicated by your digital, if that's built-in.

And yes, the steam pan should work fine (I have a conventional oven and actually use just an old, heavily oxidized crepe pan, loaded with lava rocks, if anything other than a boule; I use a dutch oven for all my round loaves but it sounds like yours would work great). I'd leave the convection off the first 10 minutes or so (wheat or wheat-mixed breads) or 2-6 minutes (rye or rye-mixed breads - rye needs to "set up" more quickly). For both, your convection works against the purpose of the steaming - to gelatinize surface starches and keep the crust moist to allow good spring before setting up, as well as a good, even browning once the steam is off (your maillard - browning - reactions are stunted by the same issue).

Also, be looking at your bread about 20 minutes in on a normal 45 minute bake, especially for wheat breads - oddly, the convection, which is supposed to create a more even surface, can create certain local "blister" area, where I've seen a sort of mottled tendency across the bread (like an overproofed bread can give in a conventional oven - again in my experience).

Your kolaches sound awesome. If you've never come across him, I really like Kent Rollins - the real deal, cowboy, grew up ranching with his dad and eventually ran many chuckwagons. He goes into the idea here, some.

Good luck. Exciting project.
 
Convection works fine. You probably know this but you'll need to turn the heat down a bit off your normal baking temp (been a fairly long while, but I see 25 F less a lot). And I would go by an oven thermometer, not what's indicated by your digital, if that's built-in.

And yes, the steam pan should work fine (I have a conventional oven and actually use just an old, heavily oxidized crepe pan, loaded with lava rocks, if anything other than a boule; I use a dutch oven for all my round loaves but it sounds like yours would work great). I'd leave the convection off the first 10 minutes or so (wheat or wheat-mixed breads) or 2-6 minutes (rye or rye-mixed breads - rye needs to "set up" more quickly). For both, your convection works against the purpose of the steaming - to gelatinize surface starches and keep the crust moist to allow good spring before setting up, as well as a good, even browning once the steam is off (your maillard - browning - reactions are stunted by the same issue).

Also, be looking at your bread about 20 minutes in on a normal 45 minute bake, especially for wheat breads - oddly, the convection, which is supposed to create a more even surface, can create certain local "blister" area, where I've seen a sort of mottled tendency across the bread (like an overproofed bread can give in a conventional oven - again in my experience).

Your kolaches sound awesome. If you've never come across him, I really like Kent Rollins - the real deal, cowboy, grew up ranching with his dad and eventually ran many chuckwagons. He goes into the idea here, some.

Good luck. Exciting project.
Thanks. I've been reading about convection, and it apparently excels at roasting things and baking cookies, or dehydrating things with the oven temp set very low. Might not be useful at all for cakes and breads. Or just turn the fan on for the last half to help brown the crust (like you said.) Even with cookies, I've read some articles that convection can create a hot spot at the front where the air hits the door and bounces back, so cookies might not cook evenly without rotating the pans, which kinda defeats the whole purpose. It'll be fun to experiment with. Also, Wife has been wanting an air fryer, and convection ovens will work for that too; this one comes with a mesh pan for it and an AF mode that doesn't require preheating.

The kolaches I'm trying to make have sweet fillings. The savory ones (which are very good) seem to have taken over in Texas, and when I visit there I often can't find the sweet ones. That's part of my motivation for making them. The savory kind technically have different name; I think it's "klobosniky" (plural) or "klobosnek", but unless you're in one of the Czech villages Texans just call them all kolaches now. West, TX, and to a lesser extent Snook, are famous for their kolaches and the newspaper food sections and Texas Monthly go on and on about how good the kolaches are in West, but I like the ones from Zabcikville at Green's Sausage House a lot better and that's what I'd like to replicate. The ones from West might be more authentic, I don't know. :)
https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUse...26829-Green_s_Sausage_House-Temple_Texas.html

My dad grew up not too far from Snook. I should goto the Caldwell Kolache Festival some year; that's just a few miles from the little town he was from and where he's buried. I lived in Temple for about 5 years before moving up here to the frozen wasteland.
 
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Thanks. I've been reading about convection, and it apparently excels at roasting things and baking cookies, or dehydrating things with the oven temp set very low. Might not be useful at all for cakes and breads. Or just turn the fan on for the last half to help brown the crust (like you said.) Even with cookies, I've read some articles that convection can create a hot spot at the front where the air hits the door and bounces back, so cookies might not cook evenly without rotating the pans, which kinda defeats the whole purpose. It'll be fun to experiment with. Also, Wife has been wanting an air fryer, and convection ovens will work for that too; this one comes with a mesh pan for it and an AF mode that doesn't require preheating.

The kolaches I'm trying to make have sweet fillings. The savory ones (which are very good) seem to have taken over in Texas, and when I visit there I often can't find the sweet ones. That's part of my motivation for making them. The savory kind technically have different name; I think it's "klobosniky" (plural) or "klobosnek", but unless you're in one of the Czech villages Texans just call them all kolaches now. West, TX, and to a lesser extent Snook, are famous for their kolaches and the newspaper food sections and Texas Monthly go on and on about how good the kolaches are in West, but I like the ones from Zabcikville at Green's Sausage House a lot better and that's what I'd like to replicate. The ones from West might be more authentic, I don't know. :)
https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUse...26829-Green_s_Sausage_House-Temple_Texas.html

My dad grew up not too far from Snook. I should goto the Caldwell Kolache Festival some year; that's just a few miles from the little town he was from and where he's buried. I lived in Temple for about 5 years before moving up here to the frozen wasteland.
I made my way through college, in part, by being the baking dude for "Muffin Mania," right across the street from campus. 2 huge convection ovens, and good lord, the amount of batter poured through them tins....and also tankloads of whole chickens to roast for the chicken salad sandwiches. But yeah, I agree, I've personally not had the best results for bread baking (well, a qualifier, breads in tins come out OK, but boules/batards/ovals, etc. - more uneven). Cool you have the air fryer ability. And very interesting on the localized heating issue with the bounceback from the front door, never would have thought of that but makes sense.

Thanks for the lore on the Kolaches/Klobosniky. I love this kind of stuff. Was Czech settlement a big thing in TX generally, or in this area? I'd love to learn more. Most of my side is German-French, with the German stock coming over largely with the national revolutions and upheaval 1848-onwards in SW Germany. Though I'm a good old mutt with Germans coming over here in the 1700s, too. Good memory of your dad, thanks for sharing there too.

Good luck. It would be great to hear of this as it develops.
 
My wife is on a very low carb diet, and my son is out of town for the week so I'm afraid I'm the only carb customer at home currently. Just a 100% whole-grain khorasan (kamut) sourdough. I do love the grain. I've finally gotten around to milling more spelt, rye, kamut, emmer and my personal preference in whole wheat, 50:50 hard red spring and winter wheats.

100% khorasan - 5-21-24.jpeg
100% khorasan - krume - 5-21-24.jpg
 
Made some sourdough ciabatta rolls Monday/Tuesday for the first time. Turned out really well and were surprisingly easy. 2 hours of stretch and folds, 4.5 hour bulk ferment and 15 hours in the fridge. Took out of fridge, shaped and cut into 8, let rise another hour. Baked at 475 for 10 min, rotate tray and bake another 10 min
 

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Made some sourdough ciabatta rolls Monday/Tuesday for the first time. Turned out really well and were surprisingly easy. 2 hours of stretch and folds, 4.5 hour bulk ferment and 15 hours in the fridge. Took out of fridge, shaped and cut into 8, let rise another hour. Baked at 475 for 10 min, rotate tray and bake another 10 min
Very cool man. I really need to get more into rolls and other small breads. "Brötchen" are just such a big thing in the German baking community I'm part of. Lots to learn there. Your recipe sounds great and it looks delicious, congrats.
 
When to add the salt? (generally speaking) I don't bake much, but hopefully that will change with the new oven that actually seems to hold a temperature. 😂 When making yeast bread, do you add the salt at the beginning, or knead it in after the first rise? Or at some other point? I suspect salt affects flour hydration, yeast growth, and gluten development.

I'm making some pizza dough right now (with slightly-sour milk replacing all the water except the little bit I proofed the yeast in, who knows if that was a good idea) I haven't added the salt yet. It's about 15 minutes into the rise and is just starting to expand.
 
That's a question that could get a lot of answers.

Some people just throw it in with all the other dry ingredients at the beginning and make good bread. What most good or even somewhat professional dough makers I've worked with have done is wait to add it until after a brief (20min?) autolyse where you've mixed flour, water, and yeast together, given the flour time to finish hydrating, and the yeast time to develop, then add your salt, mix a little, and knead.

You'll have to see what works for you.
 
When to add the salt? (generally speaking) I don't bake much, but hopefully that will change with the new oven that actually seems to hold a temperature. 😂 When making yeast bread, do you add the salt at the beginning, or knead it in after the first rise? Or at some other point? I suspect salt affects flour hydration, yeast growth, and gluten development.

I'm making some pizza dough right now (with slightly-sour milk replacing all the water except the little bit I proofed the yeast in, who knows if that was a good idea) I haven't added the salt yet. It's about 15 minutes into the rise and is just starting to expand.
Different people do different things. And you called it - salt affects hydration, growth, and gluten.

By yeast bread, I presume you mean cultured yeast (i.e., not sourdough, right?). I don't generally do an autolyse with yeasted breads, so salt goes in with the bulk mixing. If I do sourdough with a high or full proportion of bread flour (i.e., not rye, spelt, emmer, etc.), I will typically do an hour without any leavening or salt, just a rough mix, then leave it alone for the autolyse. Then, I will add in the sourdough starter, typically, do the gluten development, then add in salt near the end to mix through. Some, like the French baker Calvel, suggest not adding in salt at the end, because mixing oxidises/bleaches flour, and salt helps forestall that. But I think Calvel's thing with oxidation is because he was responding to the real decline in French baking, where they'd mix at hypersonic speed to turn and burn bad bread - they've since returned to the fold (no pun intended).

The only time I add in salt early, during starter development, is to retard the starter for various reasons - too warm, or by design (look up the "Monheimer Salzsauer" process).

I personally have never heard of holding off salting until some amount of bulk fermentation has taken place. Doesn't mean anything because I don't know a ton. But for me, bulk fermentation is about developing flavor and structure, and I don't want anything to mess with that. I'd be interested on hearing more.
 
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