Help, why does my oatmeal stout taste like teriyaki sauce?

[qazwax13]

Here was my recipe:

1lb Amber Dry Extract
6lb Dark Liquid Extract
8oz Caramel/Crystal Malt – 60L
1lb Roasted Barley
1lb Oats, Flaked
1oz Fuggels 4.5% - 60min
1oz Willamette 5.5% - 45min
1oz Willamette 5.5% - 6min
¼ tsp Irish Moss – 10min
1pkg Irish Ale Yeast (White labs #WLP004)


I did a partial mash, with the mash temp at 150 F, but i accidentally let it go up to 190 F.

I left it in the primary for 2 weeks and i just did a Gravity test and tasted the sample and it tasted like teriyaki sauce. Do i need to transfer it to a secondary and let it sit longer. Or just go ahead and bottle it and let it sit for a while?

Or is it because of the high mash out temp?

Thanks,
Travis

 

[Grippe]

How long was it at 190? Usually I think of astringency when temps that high are involved.

 

[DannPM]

Not trying to be a dick, but there isn't really anything you would brew with that would create that flavor alone.

Maybe you're tasting a mineral flavor? A smokey phenol? A combination of both. They both have a similar quality to what was described.

 

[BMan1029]

A soy sauce/teriyaki sauce flavor can be attributed sometimes to autolysis, but since you were only on trub for two weeks I doubt its from dead exploding kamakazi yeast. I second the idea of perhaps its a smokey phenol you are picking up on.

 

[qazwax13]

I actually have a log of the fermentation temp for one week, if that is any help to anyone.

 

[qazwax13]

A soy sauce/teriyaki sauce flavor can be attributed sometimes to autolysis, but since you were only on trub for two weeks I doubt its from dead exploding kamakazi yeast. I second the idea of perhaps its a smokey phenol you are picking up on.

When I was reading through the forums I read that a few times. I just went ahead and bottled it and I'm hoping it will age out.

 

[qazwax13]

How long was it at 190? Usually I think of astringency when temps that high are involved.

Maybe 10 min or so.

 

[veritas524]

Your fermentation temps are higher than optimal. That can produce off flavors and.high alchohol tastes.... does it taste really sweet? What was your fg?

 

[stompbox]

I agree, your average temp looks about 10 degrees higher than it should, not to mention that i assume those are ambient air temps? The internal temps are generally higher during fermentation due to the work being done.

 

[konrad]

Qazwax what do you use to monitor your ferm temp?

 

[the_bird]

Most likely would seem to be a stressed fermentation. Higher ferment temps can cause some weird flavors like that. Insufficient aeration might also be a cause. Might as well give it a little time to mellow, but if you're looking for areas to improve your brewing, look to being able to better-control fermentation temperatures and maybe look to improving your aeration. Keep your yeast happy!

My first though was Sam Adams' Triple Bock, which basically tastes like a bottle of oyster sauce.

 

[Zamial]

Green beer.

I had a "failed barley wine" that was based on a stout I missed temps and had the worst efficiency I think possible, it was my fault for doing to large a brew in to small a MLT.

I hit mine with AE and it tasted like it should go on stir fry. After all was said and done I bottled it and let it age for months. It was so bad that I actuall Freeze concentrated some to do as "shots"...The flavor is slowly fading and it is much more beer/stout like 6 months later.

You may have extracted some tannins but those will hit the VERY back of your tongue. Ferm temps may be high but once again I think the main reason you have these flavors is it needs to age. High ferm temps throw strange flavors but I have not heard Soy Sauce before from that.

EXAMPLE: I have an IPA on tap now that would pucker your face off, It is a combo of it being young and is mixed carb bite. 90% of the time, time will fix your beer.

 

[knotquiteawake]

Here was my recipe:

1lb Amber Dry Extract
6lb Dark Liquid Extract
8oz Caramel/Crystal Malt – 60L
1lb Roasted Barley
1lb Oats, Flaked
1oz Fuggels 4.5% - 60min
1oz Willamette 5.5% - 45min
1oz Willamette 5.5% - 6min
¼ tsp Irish Moss – 10min
1pkg Irish Ale Yeast (White labs #WLP004)
4oz kikkoman soy sauce


I did a partial mash, with the mash temp at 150 F, but i accidentally let it go up to 190 F.

I left it in the primary for 2 weeks and i just did a Gravity test and tasted the sample and it tasted like teriyaki sauce. Do i need to transfer it to a secondary and let it sit longer. Or just go ahead and bottle it and let it sit for a while?

Or is it because of the high mash out temp?

Thanks,
Travis

Found your problem.

 

[BaronVonMeisterburger]

Many people who rate beers detect soy sauce in the nose and or flavor of some commercial beers, but they aren't typically strong soy sauce notes.

 

[HopSong]

Maybe the FV was a used soy sauce bucket?

 

[MotorcycleMatt]

If its soy sauce and terryaki flavored send me a bottle, I want to marinate a steak in it

 

[tcsteeler1993]

When did you add in the soy sauce? I brew beer and also cook at a restaurant and I know if you added the soy early in the boil it brings out more of the saltiness of the soy and would become a terryaki like sauce because it also would thicken. U would swap it to the primary and see what happens after letting it sit a few weeks.

 

[tcsteeler1993]

When did you add in the soy sauce? I brew beer and also cook at a restaurant and I know if you added the soy early in the boil it brings out more of the saltiness of the soy and would become a terryaki like sauce because it also would thicken. U would swap it to the primary and see what happens after letting it sit a few weeks.

Swap it to the seconday I mean and see how it tastes before bottling.

 

[Mattyc88]

Qazwax what do you use to monitor your ferm temp?

This ^^ very curious

 

[qazwax13]

your fermentation temps are higher than optimal. That can produce off flavors and.high alchohol tastes.... Does it taste really sweet? What was your fg?

og: 1.060
fg: 1.020

 

[qazwax13]

Qazwax what do you use to monitor your ferm temp?

I use a HOBO U12 Temperature/Relative Humidity Data Logger - U12-011

 

[qazwax13]

Most likely would seem to be a stressed fermentation. Higher ferment temps can cause some weird flavors like that. Insufficient aeration might also be a cause. Might as well give it a little time to mellow, but if you're looking for areas to improve your brewing, look to being able to better-control fermentation temperatures and maybe look to improving your aeration. Keep your yeast happy!

My first though was Sam Adams' Triple Bock, which basically tastes like a bottle of oyster sauce.

Thanks for the advice on ferm temp. I knew that was going to be a problem, i just have to figure out a way to do it, old refrigerator off Craig's list maybe.

As for aeration, it was shaken up quite a bit (10 min vigorously) before yeast pitch, a a little more afterword. If anything it was too aerated, could that be a problem?

 

[qazwax13]

Green beer.

I had a "failed barley wine" that was based on a stout I missed temps and had the worst efficiency I think possible, it was my fault for doing to large a brew in to small a MLT.

I hit mine with AE and it tasted like it should go on stir fry. After all was said and done I bottled it and let it age for months. It was so bad that I actuall Freeze concentrated some to do as "shots"...The flavor is slowly fading and it is much more beer/stout like 6 months later.

You may have extracted some tannins but those will hit the VERY back of your tongue. Ferm temps may be high but once again I think the main reason you have these flavors is it needs to age. High ferm temps throw strange flavors but I have not heard Soy Sauce before from that.

EXAMPLE: I have an IPA on tap now that would pucker your face off, It is a combo of it being young and is mixed carb bite. 90% of the time, time will fix your beer.

I have heard the tannins possibility a few times, but its smells of straight teriyaki. I doubt you could smell the difference in a blind test lol

 

[qazwax13]

Found your problem.

Excuse me troll, but i am coming on this forum to receive advice form peers. For you to give false information is not cool bro. Go over to 4chan if you wanna troll, this is not the place.

 

[qazwax13]

Maybe the FV was a used soy sauce bucket?

It is a brand new glass carboy, washed, then sanitized.

 

[RM-MN]

I think your problem is in the use of the roasted barley. I would have expected about 4 ounces of it in a 5 gallon batch but you used a full pound. That coupled with dark extract should make this brew very strongly flavored and not in a good way.

 

[bgeek]

I think your problem is in the use of the roasted barley. I would have expected about 4 ounces of it in a 5 gallon batch but you used a full pound. That coupled with dark extract should make this brew very strongly flavored and not in a good way.

This. I made a dry stout where I over used the chocolate malt and roasted barley (0.75lbs. each for a 5 gallon batch) and it took four months in the bottle for the roast to mellow. At the very least, your beer is still green; give it some time to carb up and age (1 month) before you taste again.

 

[the_bird]

There may or may not be too much roasted barley (a pound is a little much), but the over-use of that grain would be more likely to result in an acrid/ashtray-kind of off-flavor - not "teriyaki." And, I don't think a pound of RB is really all that far out of whack, given that it's the only roasted malt being used. I've certainly used 3/4# of RB before, often with a small amount of other roasted malts, and never had this kind of off-flavor.

The beer being young is a possible answer (the best possible answer). I'm going to stick with it sounding like your yeast got stressed; if it's not aeration, it's probably temperature (remember, fermentation creates heat; the wort was fermenting at a temp higher than the ambient), or maybe the yeast wasn't particularly viable. Could have been an older vial, or one that wasn't handled properly. Did you make a starter?

 

[malevolent]

Ferm temp and mash temp are too high. I can't see either of those creating a teriyaki flavor.

 

[Canada2012]

A little late but, how it work out after aging.

Teriyaki sauce is basically sake, soya sauce and brown sugar. Soya sauce is fermented soya bean and wheat.

A hot alcohol taste combined with your toasted barley in a young beer would give you the taste of Teriyaki sauce.

 

[triangulum33]

I use a HOBO U12 Temperature/Relative Humidity Data Logger - U12-011

Looked this up. Expensive! $100 for the monitor and another $50 for the software?

 

[qazwax13]

Looked this up. Expensive! $100 for the monitor and another $50 for the software?

Yea no kidding. I would never have bought it myself, but my dad owns a heating and air conditioning company and has a ton, and was allowing me to borrow one for a while. So it didn't cost me anything

If you were looking to buy one i would check this out. The free software is nice a nice feature, but i don't know anything else about to product.
http://www.lascarelectronics.com/temperaturedatalogger.php?datalogger=105

 

[qazwax13]

Ill be tasting on the forth of April to see if it what it is like. Im hoping it is either better or worse then the sample.

If it is worse then it might have been a bacterial infection, give it a few more weeks and check again. And that would bring me closer to the answer.

If its better, Great! Ill drink it. But it doesn't bring me any closer to finding the cause.

Let you guys know what happens.

 

[jamoke]

If you were looking to buy one i would check this out. The free software is nice a nice feature, but i don't know anything else about to product.
http://www.lascarelectronics.com/temperaturedatalogger.php?datalogger=105

I have this one, works great for a multitude of uses.

http://www.amazon.com/Lascar-EL-USB-2-LCD-Humidity-Temperature-Point/dp/B001J5BEQY

 

[truebe]

is it possible that a bottle of 4oz kikkoman soy sauce was mislabeled?

 

[qazwax13]

is it possible that a bottle of 4oz kikkoman soy sauce was mislabeled?

There was no soy sauce. The other user was just being funny.

 

[qazwax13]

The brew turned out pretty good. The teriyaki sent and flavor subsided after 3 weeks of bottle conditioning. It has a silky mouth feel, and a vary large light brown head, with excellent retention. The flavor is sweet, hints of coffee, and chocolate. It has a rather sharp after taste that is bitter, and tastes of burnt coffee.

Overall, I give it a 7.9. Would add more oats next time and maybe some coffee. And make sure i watch the mash temp.

Thanks to all who replied

 

[RM-MN]

The brew turned out pretty good. The teriyaki sent and flavor subsided after 3 weeks of bottle conditioning. It has a silky mouth feel, and a vary large light brown head, with excellent retention. The flavor is sweet, hints of coffee, and chocolate. It has a rather sharp after taste that is bitter, and tastes of burnt coffee.

Overall, I give it a 7.9. Would add more oats next time and maybe some coffee. And make sure i watch the mash temp.

Thanks to all who replied

I suspect that the sharp aftertaste is from the roasted barley as it has quite a strong flavor. Were it me brewing this I would have put in only 4 to 6 ounces of it.

 

[Keither]

I haven't brewed much, but I have been drinking a lot of different types of beer lately to try and get some ideas for what I might like to try to make in the future. I am drinking a "St Ambroise Oatmeal stout" right now while I read this, and I was thinking about the first time I ever tried Guiness when I was a kid. I thought at the time that it tasted more like soy sauce than a beer should. Now I like Stout, but twenty years ago I remember comparing it to soy sauce. Even now, when I stick my nose into this glass of really excellent stout, I can see why someone might make the connection.

I was going to comment, therefore, that maybe your beer will just end up tasting better if you age it, which I gather from lurking on this forum, is what you should do with stouts anyway. Glad to see it worked out for you.

 

[Joesl8]

Curious what the outcome was? I have a chocolate oatmeal stout that taste kind of sour and isn't carbonating after a week? Kind of scared, my last batch (a wit beer) did the same thing...think the yeast was infected??

Guess my yeast was o.k., into second week of bottle carbonation and it's carbonating. I think my fermentation temp was a little high, around 75 F in the home, should have been around 68. So the sour and fruity flavors I'm getting might be coming from that and not the WL004...or maybe both? Anyway, it's good, not as smooth and chocolaty but good.