Heady Topper- Can you clone it?

Williams 728
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I don't have access to pearl malt locally. What's a good substitute? I've got canadian 2-row, golden promise, franco belge pils, franco belge pale, MO.
 
shuckit said:
I don't have access to pearl malt locally. What's a good substitute? I've got canadian 2-row, golden promise, franco belge pils, franco belge pale, MO.
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Golden Promise or MO are your best bets.
 
Brewed up a pale ale with ecy29 yesterday, and I woke up today to sky high ferm temps...upper 70's any idea how conan behaves at these temps?
 
flyingfinbar said:
Brewed up a pale ale with ecy29 yesterday, and I woke up today to sky high ferm temps...upper 70's any idea how conan behaves at these temps?
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Lots of diacetyl, had the same issue. Took of like a shot and got real hot, tasted like buttered popcorn. I was lazy and let it be, but there are methods to scrub the diacetyl if you taste it there when it's done fermenting.
 
threephase said:
Lots of diacetyl, had the same issue. Took of like a shot and got real hot, tasted like buttered popcorn. I was lazy and let it be, but there are methods to scrub the diacetyl if you taste it there when it's done fermenting.
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Ugh, not what I'm looking for, haha. It was high temp for probably about 18 hrs total. It really took off, like, wow. I managed to get it down to under 70 ASAP, but I fear the damage may already be done. As to scrubbing diacetyl, I have no idea what to do, haha. Thanks for the input!
 
paulster2626 said:
Anyone harvest Conan out of a single can? I made 500mL of 1.020 wort and tossed 'er in 2 days ago. Not sure if there's action or not - there are bubbles on top but not sure if that's just leftover from me shaking it up previously. It's on a stir-plate.

Should I just crash/decant and add to 1L of 1.040 and see what happens?
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BeerGrylls said:
Make sure to taste the liquid from at least the last step to make sure there aren't any off flavors indicating you had some pathogens or wild yeast.
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BLECH!

Took a sniff last night and it had soured. Guess that's what happens when you try harvesting from a can in September that you bought in February.

By the way, the beer was still tasty. Not the usual blast of aroma, but the flavour was still great.
 
gcdowd said:
Wow very interesting. Can it be true?
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Imo it's gotta be a typo. I don't get any noble hop spicy character out of Heady. I guess it could be in there but not "overflowing" the way that states.
 
Eustace said:
Wonder if anyone can comment on this bit of info:

http://www.vtbrewfest.com/pdfs/festival_guide.pdf

From the link above:
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I emailed them, they said Jim Koch had just dissed Heady Topper in an interview so this was a subtle jab at Sam Adams. LOL :rockin:

Edit: I just found it: http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/food/blogs/99bottles/2013/04/mystic_brewing_finds_a_niche_j.html

Both brewers were knowledgeable and gracious, giving credit to others in the industry. They were also forthcoming. Koch in particular has a problem with hob-bombs, the big, boozy, 100-plus IBU beers that have been en vogue in recent years. I asked Koch what he thought of the Alchemist's Heady Topper and other massive IPAs. In a part of the interview that didn't make the paper, Koch said, "They're big IPAs. There's 100 of them. Are they new or interesting? Not really. I mean they're good, but there's nothing I'm going to learn from tasting that. There's not a huge set of skills to make an 80-IBU beer."

"There's probably 100 really good 80-IBU IPAs, and there's probably 500 or 1,000 that are out there. It's not that they're bad. It's like drinking Bud or Miller or Coors. You know what you're going to get, you're not going to be surprised. If you're surprised it's generally a bad surprise."
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Koch sounds like a cock.
 
stompbox said:
I emailed them, they said Jim Koch had just dissed Heady Topper in an interview so this was a subtle jab at Sam Adams. LOL :rockin:

Edit: I just found it: http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/food/blogs/99bottles/2013/04/mystic_brewing_finds_a_niche_j.html

Koch sounds like a cock.
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He does sound a bit dickish, but I don't totally disagree. IPAs don't take a whole lot of skill to make. Mastering malts and creating beers with balanced and complex malt profiles takes a hell of a lot more skill than just putting a ton of hops in a beer. I'm not saying HT isn't a masterpiece for the style, is definitely is. But most IPAs are pretty freakin simple. Some 2 row. A little crystal malt. And a whole lot of hops. They are by far the easiest beers to make. In fact, it doesn't even seem fair to compare them to a lite American lager, because these take a whole lot more expertise to make well.
 
bottlebomber said:
He does sound a bit dickish, but I don't totally disagree. IPAs don't take a whole lot of skill to make. Mastering malts and creating beers with balanced and complex malt profiles takes a hell of a lot more skill than just putting a ton of hops in a beer. I'm not saying HT isn't a masterpiece for the style, is definitely is. But most IPAs are pretty freakin simple. Some 2 row. A little crystal malt. And a whole lot of hops. They are by far the easiest beers to make. In fact, it doesn't even seem fair to compare them to a lite American lager, because these take a whole lot more expertise to make well.
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Agree 100%.

I blame Beer Advocate and the like for fostering a craze for what I call "sledgehammer beers", i.e. it isn't great unless it is imperial, barrel aged, and/or high ABV. The consequence is the classic, more subtle styles are ignored while the latest brewery pumps out the 8,574th DIPA on to the market, which is no better than anything I can make in my garage.
 
g-star said:
Agree 100%.

I blame Beer Advocate and the like for fostering a craze for what I call "sledgehammer beers", i.e. it isn't great unless it is imperial, barrel aged, and/or high ABV. The consequence is the classic, more subtle styles are ignored while the latest brewery pumps out the 8,574th DIPA on to the market, which is no better than anything I can make in my garage.
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It's funny, I was a big fan of brewing sledgehammer beers until I started kegging. I don't know why it's so much different, but off a tap I want a nice, smooth beer that I can quaff. My IPAs are going to stop at 7% now for the most part, and I've become much more interested in brewing beers like Centennial Blonde and Co3C. Soon I'll be ready for milds, a style I gave no consideration to before.
 
bottlebomber said:
It's funny, I was a big fan of brewing sledgehammer beers until I started kegging. I don't know why it's so much different, but off a tap I want a nice, smooth beer that I can quaff. My IPAs are going to stop at 7% now for the most part, and I've become much more interested in brewing beers like Centennial Blonde and Co3C. Soon I'll be ready for milds, a style I gave no consideration to before.
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Eh, why? Don't get me wrong, I've brewed milds before too, but what's the problem with having a 11.5% barleywine (I have one right now) on tap? Is it just that it takes longer to go through the keg? Otherwise I don't see what difference bottle vs keg makes.
 
afr0byte said:
Eh, why? Don't get me wrong, I've brewed milds before too, but what's the problem with having a 11.5% barleywine (I have one right now) on tap? Is it just that it takes longer to go through the keg? Otherwise I don't see what difference bottle vs keg makes.
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I don't know why, like I said. I think to me that a keg tap says "for frequent consumption" while those high gravity beers are better left in bottles for aging and special occasions. I've actually got a 11.5% BW in a keg as well as fate would have it, and I'm having a hard time with it. I may actually just give it away to someone in my club. Call it a transformation.
 
I agree with kock that everyone just pumps out identical mediocre dipas...except that HT is actually significantly different from all other dIPAs, so it makes me question whether he's even had HT before.
 
Petekiteworld said:
I agree with kock that everyone just pumps out identical mediocre dipas...except that HT is actually significantly different from all other dIPAs, so it makes me question whether he's even had HT before.
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Good point. It uses an unusual yeast, an atypical malt bill, and a complicated hop schedule. I would hardly call a well crafted IPA/DIPA "the easiest style", far from it.
 
Brewbien said:
Good point. It uses an unusual yeast, an atypical malt bill, and a complicated hop schedule. I would hardly call a well crafted IPA/DIPA "the easiest style", far from it.
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Nobody is comparing HT to a typical IPA. It is unique for the reasons you mentioned. However, there is no style of beer that is more forgiving of mistakes than an IPA, and I stand by that.
 
I think Koch is just jealous that since all these craft brewers started brewing great IPAs people are looking at Sam Adams more like Budweiser. If Sam Adams was so great maybe they could brew an IPA that actually scores over a 90 on beeradvocate. And for all the people dissing on IPAs...it isn't beeradvocate...people like IPAs! And if someone brews some crappy IPA like that Kennebunkport IPA they sell at Trader Joes, it will get a bad rating. I barely rated that one higher than Busch, I'd rather drink the beer I decanted off my starter...or a Coors. :eek:
 
Apologize if this has already been said, but Heady Topper was cloned in the latest BYO magazine. Any thoughts on that one?
 
ianmatth said:
If Sam Adams was so great maybe they could brew an IPA that actually scores over a 90 on beeradvocate.
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Even if Sam Adams could brew the best DIPA on the planet and it would never score that high on BA, because it would be widely available. The avid "beer advocate" wouldn't be able to taste the rarity.
 
Wonder why so many breweries make IPA's these days? They are the best selling beer in craft brewing today. Not just this year either. Easiest to make? Yeah. Sure.
 
g-star said:
Even if Sam Adams could brew the best DIPA on the planet and it would never score that high on BA, because it would be widely available. The avid "beer advocate" wouldn't be able to taste the rarity.
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Agreed. There's something to keep in mind when you look at beer ratings.

If it's a great beer, and it's widely available, it'll have a good rating, but due to so many reviews, and obviously differences in peoples tastes, you will have lower scores, than the same beer if it's distribution was cut in half.

If a great beer has, limited distro, or no distro. Smaller batches, seasonal brewing, or... defies all of the above, but its harder than hell to get, then it will always get a higher mark.

Go look at the top 5 rated beers for styles, and most are pretty hard to get within reason in most cases.
 
FATC1TY said:
Agreed. There's something to keep in mind when you look at beer ratings.

If it's a great beer, and it's widely available, it'll have a good rating, but due to so many reviews, and obviously differences in peoples tastes, you will have lower scores, than the same beer if it's distribution was cut in half.

If a great beer has, limited distro, or no distro. Smaller batches, seasonal brewing, or... defies all of the above, but its harder than hell to get, then it will always get a higher mark.

Go look at the top 5 rated beers for styles, and most are pretty hard to get within reason in most cases.
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Well then, this raises the question: What is the best widely-available IPA? I'd lean towards DFH60 I guess.
 
g-star said:
Even if Sam Adams could brew the best DIPA on the planet and it would never score that high on BA, because it would be widely available. The avid "beer advocate" wouldn't be able to taste the rarity.
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I think you're right. I think the rare or seasonal factor gives beers at least a 5 point push on BA..
paulster2626 said:
Well then, this raises the question: What is the best widely-available IPA? I'd lean towards DFH60 I guess.
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Damn, it just might be. Maybe SN Torpedo? That ones pretty good too. I think Lagunitas lil sumpin is probably my favorite widely distributed IPA. Those 3 are all up there though.
 
I'm with you Bottlebomber, my vote goes to Torpedo since it is in no way regional, you get get it pretty much everywhere. Even places that don't lean towards craft at all almost always carry SN
 
While beers like Heady and PTE may not have wide release, they have 4,000+ and 7,000+ reviews respectively that agree they are great beers, that means PTE has more reviews than a lot of widely distributed beers like Stone Ruination and Stone IPA. My ratings for Heady, Abner, and Ruination are all 4.75, while I rate Stone IPA and Flower Power 4.73, so while I think Heady is a shade better than Abner, Abner is a shade better than Ruination, and Ruination is a shade better than Stone IPA, it has nothing to do with the rarity and everything to do with how they taste. I'll admit I'm a little under-impressed by some highly rated IPAs like Sculpin, Union Jack, and Racer 5, and highly under-impressed by Hoptical Illusion, Magic Hat IPAs, and Hop-a-lot-amus, but my preference for a beer - and it would seem most others' preference as well based on the BA ratings - is for a beer with a lot of high quality late hop additions and dry hopping rather than a beer with a complex malt profile.
 
roflomingo said:
Apologize if this has already been said, but Heady Topper was cloned in the latest BYO magazine. Any thoughts on that one?
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grathan said:
You mean the one here?
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/heady-topper-clone-byo-390556/


This one has 118IBU bittering 60 min hopshot addition and the other doesn't even add hops until 30 minutes. I would think 2 completely different beers because of this alone.
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Actually in post #33 there is another BYO recipe. I met someone today who spoke with the brewers at Alchemist and he was also saying they use just the Pearl malt and %5 mix of Carievnne and dextrose.
 

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