Going stainless, need advice.

[Miraculix]

Hi!

I found myself recently looking up plastic buckets in a particular size, and thought that I might not want to go that plastic route anymore. Glass would be good, if it wouldn't be easy to break so the only option remaining is stainless steel. I am looking for a bucket type fermenter, with an airlock and one spigot. No conical, wanna keep it as simple as possible.

My personal reasons for going stainless:

Nearly all my buckets were not air tight, I hope the stainless fermenter will be.
Easy cleaning.
Long lasting.

What I am looking for is a maximum volume of fermenting beer of 12-14 litres (that's 3.3-3.7 us liquid gallons).

Allowing for some head space, I think the fermenter should have at least 16, maybe 18 litres. I wouldn't want anything that does not allow me to ferment 14 litres.


I was now looking at what's available and I only found stainless buckets that were either too small or too big. If I remember correctly, there's an anvil around 20litres and one that was 3 us gallons.


If I would go with the 20 litres version, would there be any detrimental effect to the beer if it sits in primary with that much head space, given that I mostly ferment 12-14 litre batches?

Is there any well priced stainless bucket fermenter that I might have missed, ticks my boxes and you would recommend?

Thanks,

M

 

[Franktalk]

I don't think you're going to find a better value than the Anvil for what you want.

 

[Miraculix]

I don't think you're going to find a better value than the Anvil for what you want.

I just double checked. They only have 4 gallon and 7.5 gallons. So either a bit too small or much too big...

 

[RPh_Guy]

Nearly all my buckets were not air tight, I hope the stainless fermenter will be.
Easy cleaning.
Long lasting.

FWIW I recommend Fermonsters. There is a 6 gallon (22.7L) with spigot option. They seal well (lid is threaded and had a gasket) and cleaning is as easy as any (PBW soak, acid rinse). Headspace isn't a problem.

 

[Hanglow]

Or you could ferment in a keg. Not done it myself but you can get 20l slimline ones.

 

[Hanglow]

Or possibly even a pin cask. They are 20l aren't they? I don't think there's any reason to use one over a keg though

 

[Miraculix]

Cleaning a keg or cask doesn't look too appealing to me tbh...

 

[blizz81]

Cleaning a keg or cask doesn't look too appealing to me tbh...

You can generally just clean with some PBW and water, but if you can't get your arm in there I could see it being a minus I guess.


With a keg, you would also get the benefit of being easily ready for spunding and / or closed transfers with CO2. Not sure if the Anvil is pressure-rated at all for either of those capabilities.

 

[Miraculix]

FWIW I recommend Fermonsters. There is a 6 gallon (22.7L) with spigot option. They seal well (lid is threaded and had a gasket) and cleaning is as easy as any (PBW soak, acid rinse). Headspace isn't a problem.

I was looking at those and they look almost like everything I need. Unfortunately, they are not temperature resistant. I would like to have the possibility to dump the boiling wort directly into the fermenter to do no chill over night.

My last bucket was heat safe and that was a feature that I really liked. Leaky as fock, but could take boiling wort.

 

[RPh_Guy]

I would like to have the possibility to dump the boiling wort directly into the fermenter to do no chill over night.

Max recommended temp is 125°F (52°C). No PET for you, sorry -- unless you want to no chill in the kettle.
Speidels are nice from what I've heard. There's a 20L.

 

[Miraculix]

Max recommended temp is 125°F (52°C). No PET for you, sorry -- unless you want to no chill in the kettle.
Speidels are nice from what I've heard. There's a 20L.

Yes, but those are also not heat safe

 

[Hanglow]

I don't scrub my buckets at all as I don't want to micro scratch them, I just use oxycleaner in them then rinse and sanitise. I suppose I have piece of mind that I can actually see if there is any visible crud still on them after the oxy soak. But I'd personally have no problem with fermenting in a keg and using the apropriate chemical cleaners in them instead of any sort of elbow grease

There appears to be quite a few threads about fermenting in both corny and sankey kegs on this forum

 

[kh54s10]

I like the idea of Stainless Steel fermenters until I add up the cost. I have had as many as 7 beers and wines in fermenters at the same time. (not often) I would need the 7.5 gallon Anvil so $130 X 7 = $910 plus shipping probably. I use buckets and Better Bottles. Many of the Better Bottles were bought on BOGO sales from Northern Brewer years ago. So I paid about $15 each on average for those add buckets at full price and say $25 each x 8 = $200 that saved me over $700 and gave me one more fermenter.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Yes, but those are also not heat safe

Hmm. Their HDPE should be as heat tolerant as any other.
I'm not sure where this 140°F/60°C limit came from; their site doesn't say that. In general it's not recommend to use HDPE over 120°F, so the 140°F is likely just a generic recommendation.

I like the idea of Stainless Steel fermenters until I add up the cost. I have had as many as 7 beers and wines in fermenters at the same time. (not often) I would need the 7.5 gallon Anvil so $130 X 7 = $910 plus shipping probably. I use buckets and Better Bottles. Many of the Better Bottles were bought on BOGO sales from Northern Brewer years ago. So I paid about $15 each on average for those add buckets at full price and say $25 each x 8 = $200 that saved me over $700 and gave me one more fermenter.

Being able to see inside is a huge benefit too.

 

[kh54s10]

I did distort the bottom of one of my Better Bottles. For reasons I don't remember I drained the mash into one. It was too hot. I like my Better Bottles. They are a touch on the small side and I have to use a blow off tube EVERY time. But I can see the fermentation and they are very easy to clean. For me they are even easier than my buckets. I soak in Oxyclean, rinse, insert a washcloth and swirl it around with about 1/2 gallon of water, rinse well and done. The longest period of work is filling them with water and Oxyclean.

With the buckets I have to reach to the bottom, and the bottom "corner" is always a bit difficult to reach and get clean. Not very difficult but a bit more than the Better Bottles.

 

[Brooothru]

I was looking at those and they look almost like everything I need. Unfortunately, they are not temperature resistant. I would like to have the possibility to dump the boiling wort directly into the fermenter to do no chill over night.

My last bucket was heat safe and that was a feature that I really liked. Leaky as fock, but could take boiling wort.

Have you looked into SS Brewtech Brew Buckets? They are all stainless steel and come in 3,5,7 and 14 gallon sizes (SS BrewTech.com). I switched to all stainless steel almost two years ago after making wine and brewing beer in glass carboys as well as every type of plastic vessel known to man, for 25 years. Expensive move, but my only regret was not having done it sooner.

I had started having issues with oxidation and contamination and was in need of replacing basically all my plastic, so I was looking at investing major $$$ anyway. I started out with a 7 gallon Brew Bucket and was immediately sold on stainless over glass/plastic. That soon morphed into a conical and more recently a unitank. The Brew Bucket has been relegated to wine making recently and I added heating and cooling to the conical, and Santa is bringing a new toy glycol cooler to feed the conical and unitank. As you can see, the downside of switching to stainless is "mission creep". The upside is great beer and bragging rights.

At long last I can say my major purchases are basically done. And as it is said, "You can't take it with you." That's why hearses don't have bumper hitches.

Brooo Brother

 

[Miraculix]

Have you looked into SS Brewtech Brew Buckets? They are all stainless steel and come in 3,5,7 and 14 gallon sizes (SS BrewTech.com). I switched to all stainless steel almost two years ago after making wine and brewing beer in glass carboys as well as every type of plastic vessel known to man, for 25 years. Expensive move, but my only regret was not having done it sooner.

I had started having issues with oxidation and contamination and was in need of replacing basically all my plastic, so I was looking at investing major $$$ anyway. I started out with a 7 gallon Brew Bucket and was immediately sold on stainless over glass/plastic. That soon morphed into a conical and more recently a unitank. The Brew Bucket has been relegated to wine making recently and I added heating and cooling to the conical, and Santa is bringing a new toy glycol cooler to feed the conical and unitank. As you can see, the downside of switching to stainless is "mission creep". The upside is great beer and bragging rights.

At long last I can say my major purchases are basically done. And as it is said, "You can't take it with you." That's why hearses don't have bumper hitches.

Brooo Brother

A five gallon new bucket would probably be what I am looking for.

However, I can't find this size anywhere!

I saw them saying that it comes in 5 gallons, but apparently, nobody seems to sell it this size, not even the company themselves. I drop them a quick email.

 

[Brooothru]

A five gallon new bucket would probably be what I am looking for.

However, I can't find this size anywhere!

I saw them saying that it comes in 5 gallons, but apparently, nobody seems to sell it this size, not even the company themselves. I drop them a quick email.

Actually, I misspoke (or at least 'miswrote'). The sizes are 3.5 gal, 7 gallon and 14 gallon. I had a 'period' instead of a 'comma' delimeter between the 3 and 5. Sorry for the confusion.

That said, if you're looking to do a hot wort transfer to a fermentation tank for no chill, you should only consider stainless along with the ability to apply head pressure to the vessel to compensate for contraction and the dreaded suckback.

On the one hand you definitely need to be sealed up to keep the wild yeasts and bacteria out of the cooling wort. On the other hand you need to prevent your fermenter from imploding under negative pressure. There are several after-market solutions to provide a 1~2 psi pressure that will help to stave off infections until the yeast have a chance to get established.

Brooo Brother

 

[firerat]

I ferment exclusively in corny kegs now.

Convenient and not that hard to clean out. Transfers are easy and closed so no exposure to O2 (or as little as I'm ever going to get anyways).

 

[Miraculix]

Actually, I misspoke (or at least 'miswrote'). The sizes are 3.5 gal, 7 gallon and 14 gallon. I had a 'period' instead of a 'comma' delimeter between the 3 and 5. Sorry for the confusion.

That said, if you're looking to do a hot wort transfer to a fermentation tank for no chill, you should only consider stainless along with the ability to apply head pressure to the vessel to compensate for contraction and the dreaded suckback.

On the one hand you definitely need to be sealed up to keep the wild yeasts and bacteria out of the cooling wort. On the other hand you need to prevent your fermenter from imploding under negative pressure. There are several after-market solutions to provide a 1~2 psi pressure that will help to stave off infections until the yeast have a chance to get established.

Brooo Brother

I basically just attach an airlock and wait till it is chilled. My airlocks work in either direction, so no problem with negative pressure or suck back.

 

[eric19312]

I ferment exclusively in corny kegs now.

Convenient and not that hard to clean out. Transfers are easy and closed so no exposure to O2 (or as little as I'm ever going to get anyways).

I'd agree that for your size target fermenting in corny kegs seems to be no brainer.

 

[Miraculix]

I'd agree that for your size target fermenting in corny kegs seems to be no brainer.

I never actually saw one for myself. Can you open the top completely?

Doesn't have a spigot, does it? I am not intending to attach co2 or something, only need a vessel to ferment in and to get the beer out via spigot.

 

[Cavpilot2000]

When I first went stainless, I used corny kegs for primary, and I still do when I have more batches than my 2 SS Brewtech Brewbuckets will hold.
That said, I didn't love cleaning the crud from primary fermentation out of them. You know how hard it can get caked on. Hot PBW and an overnight soak works great, but I also don't love that I can't see inside all of it to make sure.

So, I primary in Brewbuckets and spund to kegs. For multiple batches like you are doing, if you are spunding, the primary is never occupied for more than a week, and that's with lagers. Usually I am spunding from the primary to keg in 2-3 days with ales, so if your concern is multiple batches, I wouldn't worry because they won't be staying in primary for long if you spund.

Brewbuckets work for closed transfer - all you need is 1-2 PSI, so they are fine for pressurized closed transfer.

The extra headspace (I can't remember if it's 6.5 or 7 gallons) is a complete non-issue. The amount of CO2 released by primary fermentation will purge that space many times over (for evidence look at the folks who use fermentation CO2 to purge their secondary/spund kegs. It's something like 30x the volume of a keg that is given off, if not more, so your head space will be entirely oxygen-free by the end of fermentation (but you are still better off adopting spunding to free up the primary for the next batch).

I have not used the Anvil buckets, but I have heard they are almost as good as the SS Buckets but cost much less.

I like the Brewbucket better than kegs for ease of cleaning and they are lighter. Plus, if you want to, you can get creative with adding new fittings and such to the lid (or even the bucket walls) if you are comfortable drilling the steel (step bits are a Godsend).

 

[Brooothru]

I ferment exclusively in corny kegs now.

Convenient and not that hard to clean out. Transfers are easy and closed so no exposure to O2 (or as little as I'm ever going to get anyways).

Completely agree. When I first got my conical I eliminated secondary fermentation. When the beer got to about 5 points of final gravity I'd do a pressure transfer to a keg and slap a spunding valve on the gas out post while the fermentation completed and settling and clearing occurred. Voila: finished beer fully carbed and ready for transfer to a serving keg.

With a unitank I now just wait for ~5 points of FG, slap on a spunding valve, let the temperature free rise to 68-72F for a few days, cold crash and pressure transfer the carbed and finished beer to a keg.

Life is so much simpler now. And the beer is so much better!

Brooo Brother

 

[Jag75]

https://www.morebeer.com/products/anvil-stainless-bucket-fermenter-4-gallon.html

 

[Brooothru]

I basically just attach an airlock and wait till it is chilled. My airlocks work in either direction, so no problem with negative pressure or suck back.

I've also heard of people using a three piece airlock, but instead of putting water/sanitizer in the cup they stuff in a paper towel soaked with Meta or Star San so that the air that fills the void in the fermenter (created by the vacuum from cooled air) gets scrubbed with sanitizer or oxygen scavenger.

I've never tried it or can testify to it's efficacy, but it sounds like it could at least mitigate rouge airborne organisms.

Brooo Brother

 

[Miraculix]

https://www.morebeer.com/products/anvil-stainless-bucket-fermenter-4-gallon.html

That's too small I'm afraid. They recommend to brew 2.5 gallon batches for this one.

 

[Brooothru]

https://www.morebeer.com/products/anvil-stainless-bucket-fermenter-4-gallon.html

There ya'll go! Great price, and NB has that 15% Off sale going on now. I didn't see whether it could be pressurized, but I'd think any ss bucket would safely hold 1-2 psi head pressure.

Brooo Brother

 

[kh54s10]

I've also heard of people using a three piece airlock, but instead of putting water/sanitizer in the cup they stuff in a paper towel soaked with Meta or Star San so that the air that fills the void in the fermenter (created by the vacuum from cooled air) gets scrubbed with sanitizer or oxygen scavenger.

I've never tried it or can testify to it's efficacy, but it sounds like it could at least mitigate rouge airborne organisms.

Brooo Brother

An s style airlock serves the same purpose. What is more of a factor is that with either you are allowing oxygen into the fermenter while cold crashing. I personally have only done a few cold crashes and have not noticed any off flavors from oxidation. Others claim it ruins their beer.

 

[Miraculix]

There ya'll go! Great price, and NB has that 15% Off sale going on now. I didn't see whether it could be pressurized, but I'd think any ss bucket would safely hold 1-2 psi head pressure.

Brooo Brother

Nope, too small. Maximum 2.5 gallons fermenting recommended by anvil on their site.

 

[Miraculix]

An s style airlock serves the same purpose. What is more of a factor is that with either you are allowing oxygen into the fermenter while cold crashing. I personally have only done a few cold crashes and have not noticed any off flavors from oxidation. Others claim it ruins their beer.

We are not talking about cold crashing here but no chill.

 

[Dland]

I never actually saw one for myself. Can you open the top completely?

Doesn't have a spigot, does it? I am not intending to attach co2 or something, only need a vessel to ferment in and to get the beer out via spigot.

You push beer out the liquid post at top of keg with CO2 pressure, ether to tap or another keg if you want to spund off the trub.

A avid brewer like you should be in stainless and also limiting O2 exposure, with all your reported experimenting in little plastic tubs, ongoing infections, etc.

Agree C kegs should work well for you with your batch size, lids do come off, and internals easily cleaned. You can always trim liquid tube with tubing cutter if you want to leave some trub behind.

 

[Jag75]

Nope, too small. Maximum 2.5 gallons fermenting recommended by anvil on their site.

It said 3 gallon batches ?
Maybe time to step up to 5 gallon batches as I'm sure some would take some off your hands

 

[Jag75]

I'd do a 3 gallon on that and use a blow off.

 

[Miraculix]

It said 3 gallon batches ?
Maybe time to step up to 5 gallon batches as I'm sure some would take some off your hands

Still a bit too small.

I want to stay within the apartment and use the hob, so there's limitation to the kettle (also don't want to have too much beer on hand all the time).

 

[kh54s10]

We are not talking about cold crashing here but no chill.

Ah yes, I got sidetracked with suggestions of using corny kegs as a fermentation vessel.

 

[blizz81]

You can always trim liquid tube with tubing cutter if you want to leave some trub behind.

Or use a floating diptube with a mesh screen.

But OP did mention they want to gravity transfer via a spigot vs. using CO2.

 

[firerat]

Or use a floating diptube with a mesh screen.

But OP did mention they want to gravity transfer via a spigot vs. using CO2.

I tie small paint strainer bags on the end of mine.

Or if I'm lazy, use a picnic tap to purge out the goop then go to the jumper when it's clear.

 

[Miraculix]

I tie small paint strainer bags on the end of mine.

Or if I'm lazy, use a picnic tap to purge out the goop then go to the jumper when it's clear.

Exactly, co2 is out of question for me atm.

 

[firerat]

Exactly, co2 is out of question for me atm.

You can rack out of a keg just like anything else.