Funny tasting beer

[stabby]

I need some help. My dark beers lately have been coming out tasting like grapes and or soy sauce. What's going on???

 

[beaksnbeer]

Sounds like a fermentation temperature problem.

 

[unionrdr]

I've noticed that Cooper's ale yeast packets smell like they come from white grapes. But soysauce? I hope you kept notes,as I tend to agree with the brew temps for starters. Could even be some of the ingredients reacting with each other.

 

[nofootbreak]

Sounds like oxidation to me.

 

[hoperific]

Grapes can be an ester or a malt-derived flavor from some specialty malts like Munich. Stronger Bocks, for example, can have plum, prune and grape notes from the malt that are not yeast derived.

Soy Sauce may be from yeast stress, autolysis and aging/oxidation. Could also be from old ingredients/old extract if you are using that.

Here's an older thread where there is some argument on if autolysis can happen in younger beers, so YMMV: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/my-stout-tastes-like-soy-sauce-404788/

 

[stabby]

Here's my porter recipe. It came out tasting like grape flavoring. This one does not have a soy flavor. Could I have used too much dark malt?

Efficiency 65%
Attenuation 79%

5 Gal

Marris Otter - 8.5lb - 72%
Munich - 1.2lb - 10.2%
Crystal 10 - 1.1lb - 9.3%
Chololate - 1lb - 8.5%

Willamette - 60min - 1.5oz - 75%
Willamette - 15min - .5oz - 25%

Mash 152
Fermented at 68 with properly rehydrated safale 05

Og 1054
Fg 1011

 

[Mare_Mortis]

I'm pretty sure my kolsch came out with similar flavors and I have narrowed it down to oxidation...but my question is why would some bottles taste great, some taste soapy and some taste like sour grapes/soy sauce (not to hijack your thread)

 

[stabby]

I'm pretty sure my kolsch came out with similar flavors and I have narrowed it down to oxidation...but my question is why would some bottles taste great, some taste soapy and some taste like sour grapes/soy sauce (not to hijack your thread)

I'm pretty sure mine isn't from oxidation... Pretty sure anyways. I had an oxidation problem when I upgraded my system to 5gal and I started using a wort chiller. I would wait til I cooled my wort to 74, shut off the chiller, and transfer. Later I realized I should've left the chiller on because by the time a third of the wort was left in the kettle it warmed up real fast which f'd up the beer. I think that's where I was getting my soy from. Now it's a weird grape flavor. I'm wondering if my chocolate malt could have been old?

 

[Beernik]

Soy sauce flavor can also be autolysis.

Grape is just weird. I've never experienced grape esters.

 

[progmac]

what's your sample size here? how many dark beers are we talking about? are other beers coming out okay? if it is just this one beer that has this one flavor, it could be an infection or something else.

if all your other beers are fine, look into adding your dark and roasted grains in a different way. either at the end of the mash or just steeping them. or adjust your water.

 

[stabby]

I also made a dry stout before I made that porter and it has the same grape flavor, but it's not as intense, and the grape is hiding behind the roastiness. I have a smoked porter in the chest freezer that has a similar recipe to the porter I just posted about. Kinda of scared to bottle it. Last winter I had the same problem too. I don't think it's infections. I've been brewing for a while and quite often brew very clean delicious 3.5% abv light beers.

I think I may re-make the porter recipe I posted and use a ph stabilizer?

 

[Beernik]

Could you be getting an infection in the bottle? I had that before. The beer was fine before bottling. But I had a couple dozen bottles that I didn't get completely clean before reusing them. The beer turned sour and fruity in those bottles.

 

[stabby]

Idk... The last batch were mostly new bottles that got soaked in oxyclean for about four hours, rinsed, and then thrown in the dishwasher.

 

[progmac]

I also made a dry stout before I made that porter and it has the same grape flavor, but it's not as intense, and the grape is hiding behind the roastiness. I have a smoked porter in the chest freezer that has a similar recipe to the porter I just posted about. Kinda of scared to bottle it. Last winter I had the same problem too. I don't think it's infections. I've been brewing for a while and quite often brew very clean delicious 3.5% abv light beers.

I think I may re-make the porter recipe I posted and use a ph stabilizer?

start checking the ph of your dark beers. you're talking grapes, which is an acidic flavor, which makes me think your ph is too low during mash. dark grains do this, which is why you would only experience the flavor in dark beers.

you can likely substantially improve your beers by taking a look at your water profile and determining what kind of sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) or picking lime addition you can handle. a simple 1/2 teaspoon of baking soda substantially improves dark beers made with MY local water. if your water has low Na (sodium) you can probably just use baking soda. If it doesn't, you may want to use pickling lime.

if that sounds like too much screwing around, the easiest and least fuss way to do this is simple - don't mash your dark grains. just toss them in before you vorlauf and proceed as normal. or you can crush the **** out of them and steep them in water like you're making coffee and add that directly to the boil.

 

[stabby]

I rebrewed the porter with less chocolate malt, did a half hour mash, used a ph stabilizer, and the beer came out amazing. Don't know what helped or if everything did.

 

[unionrdr]

I was going to suggest that maybe the yeast was throwing fruity esters.