Friendly advice is killing my move to all-grain (advice on setup please)!

[Novesette]

Hopefully some of the resident wizards here can sort me out. I currently have (more or less) the common starter extract setup: 5 gallon stainless pot, (2) 6.5 gallon fermenting buckets (so I can cook up 2 beers over a weekend and have both fermenting at the same time), a 6.5 gallon bottling bucket plus the requisite odds and ends. I decided to get into the all-grain game because there are some recipes I'd like to try that are either difficult or seemingly impossible with extract. The most I've done and intend to do are 5 gallon batches (though I'd oddly enough prefer to brew 2.5-3 gallons and fill up a case of 22oz bombers per recipe rather than 2 cases at 5 gallons ~I brew mostly for myself and just like smaller batches for a number of reasons).

I talked with a friend who's been brewing at home for a long time now and he suggested I grab an 8 gallon aluminum pot ($40), an immersion chiller ($45) and a BIAB bag ($30) and just go that route, using the 5 gallon for batch sparging and the 8 gallon for BIAB mash on a 3-5 gallon recipe. I already have the small stuff I think I need (steaming rack which makes a perfect false bottom and so on) and I'm looking to invest in the BeerSmith application in case I need to reduce a recipe. I mentioned this to another friend who is also into home brewing (no idea if his beers are good or what his setup is like as he's not local to me) and he told me that there was no way that I'd be better off doing it that way because I also said I wanted to try my hand at higher gravity beers (9-13% max) and that it would just be cheaper to get a 10 gallon mash/lauter tun with a false bottom and skip the larger pot, chiller and bag. His reasoning is because (A) I brew on the stove (my other hobbies already occupy the rest of the spare real estate in the house and the yard) and (B) he insists I'll run into issues trying to get into 9-13% ABV territory (Russian Imperial Stouts for example) using friend 1's method.

I thought I had this all nailed down but now I'm not so sure. It seems like this is over-complicating the move to all-grain brewing based on my current narrow focus. I mean, I understand that most people probably move beyond the 3-5 gallon batches but I've always been a small batch kind of guy in everything else (bread/pizza dough making, smoking meat etc...) and I'd rather have 5-6 different brews each in a case of bombers sitting in the cellar than 5-6 cases of the same stuff.

So now I'm looking at a larger audience of knowledgeable folk to hopefully get me back on the right track. Any insight is appreciated (besides telling me I'm goofy for not brewing 10+ gallon batches lol).


Thanks in advance!

 

[photobru]

I say either get a 10 gal kettle or plan on sparging somehow if you're set on an 8 gal kettle. I have an 8 gal and it's too small for 5 gal BIAB batches. I've actually switched to mashing in a bag (MIAB) in a cooler, which I find easier in general, plus it allows me to mash more grain and sparge more easily if needed.

 

[ptrack]

First, I would say the large pot and chiller are two musts. You can live without a chiller and either chill in a ice bath or go no chill but I think it is well worth the investment. To get something reasonably cheap you can either make one yourself which costs as much as a roll of copper and some hose adapters/clamps or look at some of the economy options that places like Adventures in Homebrew sells ($35 right now).

As for the pot, you will want something you can do full volume boils in if you are going all grain. You will need to be able to collect 6+ gallons of wort from whatever mash method your use to get good efficiency out of you mash when making 5 gallon batches. With that much wort you will need at least 8 gallons to boil in. I would recommend looking at some of the Bayou Classic pots if you want to go stainless but keep the price reasonable.

Finally, as far as I know there is no issue brewing high gravity beers going BIAB. I don't personally do BIAB but a good buddy who does often does big Barleywines without issue. The only thing to make sure of is that your bag is large enough to fit your entire grain bill. You will also need to make sure your pot can handle that much grain plus an appropriate amount of water while mashing. I am sure others can speak better on limitations of BIAB so don't take my word for it.

 

[McKnuckle]

I'm a smaller batch person too, also 2-3 gallons. I drink most of it myself, and monster batches are not practical for me. However I also make an occasional 5 gallon batch to fill one of my kegs. I also BIAB most of the time.

I have two setups as a result.

44 qt kettle with basket for the large batches, 8 gal or 6 gal kettle for the smaller ones. Same bag for both - a simple 5 gallon paint strainer variety.

Don't get too frustrated by the varied advice. This is a personal hobby, and everybody has his or her own preferences. Many of us also try one system but tweak this or that, and end up with a bunch of stuff over time.

I'd suggest BIAB for sure, and a 10 gallon simple stainless pot. A one vessel system is great and presents very few if any negatives. You can boil 3 gallons of wort in it, no problem. However, if you're brewing on a stove, make sure it fits under any hood you might have. That could be the limiting factor. If so, you'll have to scale back to a smaller pot and brew batch sizes that work.

And +1 on the immersion chiller. If you go bigger than 2-3 gallons, it's required. Even if you don't, it's a very welcome piece of gear that will significantly shorten brew day vs. an ice bath or other "ghetto" cooling solutions.

 

[Beernik]

My advice is to get a BK double the size of the maximum batch you think you'll be brewing for the next 5ish years because it helps maintain upward compatibility with future setups you may eventually want to have. So I f that's a 5 gallon batch, get a 10 gallon BK. You should also be able to BIAB just fine in a 10 gallon BK. BIAB in an 8 gallon BK may limit how big your beers can be.

I'm not anti-MT like some BIABers are. I've had one. But if I had to do it again, I'd get a bigger BK and do BIAB and build the MT later if I thought I wanted it.

Actually, I am doing it again and that's what I'm doing. I'm currently doing 5 - 6 gallon BIAB in a keggle. I'm working my way up to a HERMS.

Some kind of a chiller is advisable for 5 gallons of beer. It takes a long time for it to chill on its own. ICs work great, don't require pumps, and are easy to build. But unless you use a prechiller, they will only get your beer as cold as your tap water.

 

[gmoney0831]

Just go with converted 15 gallon kegs u wont regret it in the long run i wish someone would have told me that when i started 3 pots later..

 

[d3track]

If you're only going to do 2-3gal batches, you're good with the first option (you can always use dme and sugar to get gravity points) and you won't be out anything if decide to go to an mlt.

 

[dkennedy]

Get a bag and try it out in your current pot, if you like smaller batches. If you're heating option is your range, then a keggle/super big pot may not work well for you...regardless of how you mash, you still have to boil it all. Just a thought.

PS- chiller is good too

 

[Calypso]

I was in a similar boat to you. I decided to go with partial mash BIAB. Basically, I know given my setup (9 gallon pot, full volume boil) that I can only safely and easily handle 9 pounds of grain. So I construct my recipes with 9 pounds of grain (whatever specialty grain along with a balance of base malt for conversion). If the recipe requires more than 9 pounds, the rest is DME. If I'm doing a big beer this might mean 6 pounds of DME, but it works and I'm very happy with the setup.

 

[misterkidd]

From a similar starting point with similar goals, i went with a 10 gallon biab kettle, bag and immersion chiller. Very happy with my choice, and i regularly make big beers.

 

[C-Rider]

Like you I drink most of my brews by myself and so I do 2 gallon BIAB beers. I've got it wired so I get 3 six packs each time. I've done a 10.5 ABV IRS w/no problem. I mash in a 5 gallon cooler. I have a few pots...4,5 and 6 gallons all SS. But I do in on a gas burner. Trying to do 8 gallons in house might be tough to reach boil unless you have gas. Check out this "old" video to see my methods. I've changed a little over the past 2 years, but this is still the basic method.

 

[btbnl]

It sounds like the limiting factor in all of this is your heat source. If you're compelled to stay on the stove-top then you're likely limited to 4G boils, which should be enough for a 2.5G batch but not much more unless you're topping-off. In a 5G pot that will leave room for up to about 12lb grain, enough for a plenty big beer!

I'd suggest getting just the bag for now and trying it with your existing set-up and a free online recipe builder like Brewer's Friend. It'll certainly be do-able, but it'll also tell you which direction(s) you want to prioritize making easier for yourself (bigger pot, immersion chiller, different software, propane burner, whatever).

If you do go the top-off route (as it sounds like you may already be doing with some of your extract batches), be aware that - unlike with extract - your efficiency will drop with a big grain bill.

 

[podz]

First of all, you will greatly struggle trying to get more than 5 gallons boiling on an electric stovetop. Even with 5 gallons, the length of time to get a full rolling boil is significant. You can get a faster boil using a lid, but then you might also get bad odors into your wort.

Second, I wouldn't try to boil 5 gallons of wort in the kitchen in less than an 8 gallon kettle due to boilover. Good way to ruin an entire kitchen and get SWMBO into divorce mood.

Extract brewers using prehopped kits don't face the same problem because hop isomerisation is already complete and you can just boil your extract in a little bit of water and add the rest of the water to the fermenter.

 

[Brew_Dude41]

Going bigger on your kettle than what you think you need is the best advice i can give. I bought a ported 8 gal pot last year while still doing extract and it was fine but i am already converting to a15 gal keggle. I seem to get much more hot break and boiling over since going all grain, and i hate making/cleaning the mess.

 

[RM-MN]

Gosh, a lot of people are sure willing to spend you money. I'd start simple. Buy a paint strainer bag. Do a 2 1/2 gallon batch in the pot you already have. Chill it like you would your extract batch or just do a no-chill. You shouldn't "need" any more equipment for several batches. Your limitation will be in the amount of grain you can mash so you can't do a real high gravity brew. With my equipment I seem to top out at about a 10% ABV brew. :cross:

After you have done several 2 1/2 gallon batches you can decide on which way to go from there. Maybe a bigger pot, maybe your own mill, maybe you need a chiller, but until you have made a few AG batches you won't know what works with your space and heat source.

 

[Novesette]

Wow! Thanks for all of the varied but in-point advice. You all really helped clear things up quite a bit. I'm intrigued by the Mash in a Bag MLT cooler option (something I hadn't considered before). It looks like I can go that route for my smaller batches and if I ever decide I need to do larger, I can buy a 10 gallon kettle and still use the MLT in my brewing as opposed to getting an 8 gallon now that might be too small if I go to larger batches or a 10 gallon I might never really use given my circumstances. Seems like a larger kettle would be a waste of money since I can build a nice 10 gallon MLT for around the same price as a cheap kettle that will be useful no matter which way I go. My stove setup includes a low-hanging range hood (gas stove) so kettle size is an issue which is why I was looking at an 8 gallon kettle. If I do go to larger batches and a 10 gallon kettle, I'll need to appropriate a new space for it (space currently being occupied by my other hobbies) and use a burner setup.

For the record, I don't necessarily want to do even 5 gallon batches, I only do them now when the extract kit or recipe calls for it as opposed to splitting them. 2.5-3 gallons seem to work out fine for me.

 

[TheHappyHopper]

Gosh, a lot of people are sure willing to spend you money. I'd start simple. Buy a paint strainer bag. Do a 2 1/2 gallon batch in the pot you already have. Chill it like you would your extract batch or just do a no-chill. You shouldn't "need" any more equipment for several batches. Your limitation will be in the amount of grain you can mash so you can't do a real high gravity brew. With my equipment I seem to top out at about a 10% ABV brew. :cross:

After you have done several 2 1/2 gallon batches you can decide on which way to go from there. Maybe a bigger pot, maybe your own mill, maybe you need a chiller, but until you have made a few AG batches you won't know what works with your space and heat source.

100% agree - this is the route to go if you are not wanting to spend a lot up front. The paint strainer bags from any hardware store run around $2 each and are definitely sufficient for 2.5 gallon AG BIAB with your current kettle. You can always upgrade and add more equipment later as you get more into the hobby. If you want to do 5 gallon batches, but still don't want to spend the extra on a larger pot, etc., you can do partial mashes (basically mash as much grain as you can with the BIAB setup, and then replace the rest of the base malt with extract as needed).

 

[McKnuckle]

For the record, I don't necessarily want to do even 5 gallon batches, I only do them now when the extract kit or recipe calls for it as opposed to splitting them. 2.5-3 gallons seem to work out fine for me.

A 5 gallon cooler should work out fine then. You can mash in a bag in the cooler, which is cheaper and easier than building/buying a manifold/false bottom. Scale your recipes so you boil no more than 4 gallons of wort on your stovetop in your 5 gallon kettle. Depending on your boil-off rate, I can see 3.5 gallon batches being possible as a maximum (i.e. with 1/2 gal/hr evaporation).

If you eventually want to do bigger batches, a 10 gallon kettle will then allow you to BIAB in one vessel, and you'll be good to go without buying more stuff - except the burner of course.

 

[Gavin C]

Gosh, a lot of people are sure willing to spend you money. I'd start simple. Buy a paint strainer bag. Do a 2 1/2 gallon batch in the pot you already have. Chill it like you would your extract batch or just do a no-chill. You shouldn't "need" any more equipment for several batches. Your limitation will be in the amount of grain you can mash so you can't do a real high gravity brew. With my equipment I seem to top out at about a 10% ABV brew. :cross:

After you have done several 2 1/2 gallon batches you can decide on which way to go from there. Maybe a bigger pot, maybe your own mill, maybe you need a chiller, but until you have made a few AG batches you won't know what works with your space and heat source.

Great advice there.

You can always add any equipment and gadgets you need/want over time. I would advise getting a better bag from @Wilserbrewer rather than paint strainer bags however. Not a big investment.

I use two bags I got from Northernbrewer doubled up. Works well but will be getting a Wilser bag if and when my current ones fail.

I think BIAB is a great process and can produce excellent beer. I rarely make anything over 6% ABV. That's the kind of beer I favor. If you drink a lot of high ABV beers and that's your preference MIAB may be a better bet owing to volume restrictions and the power of your stove.

I brew on my NG stove without difficulty.

Best of luck going forward. I wish you every success.

 

[Oginme]

Gosh, a lot of people are sure willing to spend you money. I'd start simple. Buy a paint strainer bag. Do a 2 1/2 gallon batch in the pot you already have. Chill it like you would your extract batch or just do a no-chill. You shouldn't "need" any more equipment for several batches. Your limitation will be in the amount of grain you can mash so you can't do a real high gravity brew. With my equipment I seem to top out at about a 10% ABV brew. :cross:

After you have done several 2 1/2 gallon batches you can decide on which way to go from there. Maybe a bigger pot, maybe your own mill, maybe you need a chiller, but until you have made a few AG batches you won't know what works with your space and heat source.

^^^ This is the most economical way to start into all-grain. You can do higher gravity brews by spiking some DME, LME, or sugars near the end of the boil as a start. Once you have this down, you can prioritize your purchases to make brewing more comfortable (i.e. larger kettle, immersion chiller, etc.).

I do mostly 10 liter BIAB batches (2.8 gal) with a 5-gal kettle. Every once in a while for a recipe that I want to keep more of or for higher gravity beers, I will do a 5 gallon batch with my mash tun. Still the simple process of a bag and single pot is my go-to set up.

 

[BrewSavage]

Based on my experience when I moved to all grain earlier this year I think a 10 gallon kettle is the minimum size for a comfortable boil when you're targeting a 5 gallon batch.

 

[madscientist451]

Hopefully some of the resident wizards here can sort me out. I currently have (more or less) the common starter extract setup: 5 gallon stainless pot, (2) 6.5 gallon fermenting buckets (so I can cook up 2 beers over a weekend and have both fermenting at the same time), a 6.5 gallon bottling bucket plus the requisite odds and ends. I decided to get into the all-grain game because there are some recipes I'd like to try that are either difficult or seemingly impossible with extract. The most I've done and intend to do are 5 gallon batches (though I'd oddly enough prefer to brew 2.5-3 gallons and fill up a case of 22oz bombers per recipe rather than 2 cases at 5 gallons ~I brew mostly for myself and just like smaller batches for a number of reasons).



I thought I had this all nailed down but now I'm not so sure. It seems like this is over-complicating the move to all-grain brewing based on my current narrow focus. I mean, I understand that most people probably move beyond the 3-5 gallon batches but I've always been a small batch kind of guy in everything else (bread/pizza dough making, smoking meat etc...) and I'd rather have 5-6 different brews each in a case of bombers sitting in the cellar than 5-6 cases of the same stuff.




Thanks in advance!

I also make smaller batches, usually 3 to 4.5 gallons and I always have 5-7 different beers available to choose from. I don't want to have 10 gallons of one kind of beer, I don't drink all that much anyway. Some guys have kegs on tap and a bunch of buddies to drink it and so 10 gallon batches make sense.
Your 5 gallon SS pot, is fine for doing BIAB 3 gallon brews, you really don't need anything. You could add a 5 gallon cooler if you want to. If you want full 5 gallon brews you could get an 8 gallon pot.
An immersion chiller would be an upgrade. If you have freezer space, freeze 1/2 gallon milk jugs and put the whole pot in a washtub with cold tap water, change out the water when it gets warm, add the frozen jugs to the second water dose.
Just get brewing and upgrade your equipment little by little and you'll figure out what works for you. Cheers!

 

[ptrack]

If you are planning on doing mostly 3 gallon batches a 10 gallon cooler mash tun might end up being pretty big for your needs. You will end up having quite a bit of dead space in there above the mash which could give you trouble with holding temp. I don't have any experience mashing with that much dead space in the cooler but I seem to recall others bringing it up as an issue with keeping stable temps through a mash.

A 5 gallon cooler works well for my 5.5 gallon batches if the grain bill is under 11 pounds or so. I would assume something that size would work fine for pretty much any 3 gallon batch you want to make. It would also save you some money and space.

EDIT: The 10 gallon cooler would be nice to future proof your setup if you think you might get into larger batches in the future so that is worth keeping in mind. Also, my info on dead space issues and temp control might be way off.

 

[photobru]

For the record, I don't necessarily want to do even 5 gallon batches, I only do them now when the extract kit or recipe calls for it as opposed to splitting them. 2.5-3 gallons seem to work out fine for me.

If this is the case, I'd go with RM-MN's suggestion and save yourself a bunch of money. If your main reason for doing 5 gallon batches is the recipe, as long as it's not a kit just use half the amount of ingredients called for and you've got a 2.5 gal batch. And if it's an AG kit, you might be able to split the ingredients anyway and save them for later.

As for a MLT, once you've got the paint strainer bags you can mash in any cooler big enough to hold your mash, rectangular or round, doesn't matter (though it really helps if it has a drain), so you can always borrow a cooler from someone to test out the method for free.

 

[Homercidal]

Paint strainer bag works great. Cheap. And you can try it out a few times and IF you want to continue BIAB, you coudl upgrade to a Wilserbrewing bag later. I hear they are really nice.

Don't fret about kettle size, gravity, etc. That stuff is all doable in some way or another. You have the advantage that you are planning on doing smaller batches. A turkey fryer kettle will work great for you. A 10 gallon kettle is actually better though, you just might not need it until later.

if you want to do a higher gravity beer you can mash thick and use lots of grain, then sparge in a separate kettle (or bucket filled with hot water or cooler or whatever) and combine to get a high OG wort, then dilute at chill time with cold sanitized water.

I do recommend a nice IC, though. Sure beats a sink full of ice.

 

[dwhite60]

Having undersize equipment for what you want to do sucks.

Having oversize equipment sucks too and you have more money in
it.

Do some 3 gallon batches with what you have then decide if you need
to go bigger. I do 2 - 3 gallon batches due to space limitations. I did
5 gallon batches when I got started but have found the smaller batches
easier and I have more variety on hand and I get to brew more often.

Wort chiller will help a lot. Make your own. It's easy and will save you
some headaches, dollars, and time. Bite the bullet and get one.

Really don't know what I enjoy more, making empties or filling empties?

All the Best,
D. White

 

[Novesette]

Thanks for all of the awesome replies! Given the information here and taking further inventory as to what else I have on hand that I can appropriate, I'm going to stick to the 5 gallon kettle for now. I have a 5 gallon beverage cooler and picked up a 10 gallon today at home depot. I'm going grab a bag for my grain and play around with the following "methods".

1. Small batch BIAB (2.5 gallons).
2. Pseudo BIAB with a sparge (using the 5 gallon cooler as a "sparge tank" coverted to small MLT setup).
3. MIAB with larger grain loads in the 10 gallon cooler converted to an MLT using the 5 gallon as a sparge tank (same as #2).

That should cover whatever I'm likely to make in the foreseeable future. I'm still grabbing an immersion chiller.

 

[smAllGrain]

Thanks for all of the awesome replies! Given the information here and taking further inventory as to what else I have on hand that I can appropriate, I'm going to stick to the 5 gallon kettle for now. I have a 5 gallon beverage cooler and picked up a 10 gallon today at home depot. I'm going grab a bag for my grain and play around with the following "methods".

1. Small batch BIAB (2.5 gallons).
2. Pseudo BIAB with a sparge (using the 5 gallon cooler as a "sparge tank" coverted to small MLT setup).
3. MIAB with larger grain loads in the 10 gallon cooler converted to an MLT using the 5 gallon as a sparge tank (same as #2).

That should cover whatever I'm likely to make in the foreseeable future. I'm still grabbing an immersion chiller.

This is exactly what I did when I moved to AG & was very happy with it. Then I slowly got a propane burner & a 10Gal kettle.

Cheers!

 

[eadavis80]

We're in a similar boat. I only have an 8-gallon kettle. I got it last spring thinking this would be the last kettle I'd ever get because "I'd never get into all-grain." Well, 11 months later, after only one BIAB kit, I'm starting to think my remaining extract kits might be my last. However, I do 5 gallon batches, so the 8 gallon kettle is now kind of a bummer. But, if you're sure you'LL never do anything more than 2-3 gallon batches, a smaller kettle is okay. But, if there is ONE thing I've learned in my 15-16 months of this addiction it's "never say never." And, another thing I've learned is I've never read anyone on a forum who regretted buying anything in a bigger size (flask, kettle, etc.).

 

[Novesette]

Thanks folks. In regards to the last 2 posters, I may one day go to a larger setup, but that would be when we buy a new house (4-5 years from now) or when I give up working on my Wrangler, my motorcycle, sell my guns, stop gaming or get too old to lift weights (in other words, not for many, many years). I just don't have the space to do a solid larger setup and I can't realistically completely take over the entire kitchen (at least not until the kids are both grown and on their own which would be 9 years from now minimum ). Brewing even a bunch of 5 gallon batches would end up requiring a dedicated place to brew, ferment, store and it would all pile up fast. I just don't drink enough beer to keep up (and I still like to drink commercial craft brews so my own stuff piles up unless I keep batches on the small side) and I like a variety of beers.

 

[Novesette]

This is exactly what I did when I moved to AG & was very happy with it. Then I slowly got a propane burner & a 10Gal kettle.

Cheers!

So what was your process with this setup? Did you find a need for the 10gal mash tun with a 5gallon kettle or was the 5gal enough for a 3gallon batch?

 

[Novesette]

I say either get a 10 gal kettle or plan on sparging somehow if you're set on an 8 gal kettle. I have an 8 gal and it's too small for 5 gal BIAB batches. I've actually switched to mashing in a bag (MIAB) in a cooler, which I find easier in general, plus it allows me to mash more grain and sparge more easily if needed.

The bonus with MIAB is that your kettle doesn't need extra space to accommodate the grain during the mash, so theoretically you could do batches closer to the capacity of your kettle than even BIAB (like 7-8 gallon batches in a 10 gallon kettle)?

 

[McKnuckle]

I have a 5 gallon cooler. It is more than adequate for a 3 gallon batch. You will not need a 10g cooler, and as someone mentioned, the extra dead space in a larger vessel is NOT desirable for heat retention.

You can actualy fit 5.5 gallons of volume in a 5 gallon cooler when maxed out to the very tippy top.

The bonus with MIAB is that it's easier for some folks to keep mash temps stable in a cooler rather than in a kettle on a stove with pure BIAB. You have to drain the bag after mashing, which usually means sticking it in a pot or some other vessel while the kettle gets up to a boil. Since you have to clean that vessel, might as well make it a cooler - you mash in the cooler, drain the liquid, begin boiling, and leave the bag in the cooler to gravity drain til the boil is ready. Then dump in the rest of the liquid. You lose nothing to mash tun deadspace that way; you only lose what's absorbed in the grain, which will be less than if you had mashed "naked" (without the bag).

You just gotta get started with this stuff and you'll see for yourself.

 

[Novesette]

I have a 5 gallon cooler. It is more than adequate for a 3 gallon batch. You will not need a 10g cooler, and as someone mentioned, the extra dead space in a larger vessel is NOT desirable for heat retention.

You can actualy fit 5.5 gallons of volume in a 5 gallon cooler when maxed out to the very tippy top.

Thanks. That's what I was thinking. Right now I'm looking at a Russian Imperial Stout that has 20lbs of grains in a 5 gallon batch...so just halving that (staying simple) at 2.5 gallons means 10lbs of grains. As long as I can fit that in a 5 gallon cooler (no false bottom as I'll use a bag) I'm good to go with the 5 gallon and can wait on the 10 for now.

 

[PinzonCachondo]

Sorry I haven't read all 4 pages of this thread but for BIAB you usually skip the MLT and just use a single kettle almost twice your batch size. I frequently do 6-7 gallon APA's and IPA's in a 10 gallon pot. You mash in the pot, pull the bag of grains and fire up the burner to bring it to a boil.

Another suggestion: Morebeer has a 29" x 29" biab bag for $7 that should work fine in your current kettle. You could get that and a maybe chiller that you can use later no matter which way you go. That way you have minimal up front costs and can try a couple of 2.5 -3 gallon batches in your current 5 gallon kettle and see how it goes.

 

[photobru]

Thanks. That's what I was thinking. Right now I'm looking at a Russian Imperial Stout that has 20lbs of grains in a 5 gallon batch...so just halving that (staying simple) at 2.5 gallons means 10lbs of grains. As long as I can fit that in a 5 gallon cooler (no false bottom as I'll use a bag) I'm good to go with the 5 gallon and can wait on the 10 for now.

You should be fine with the 5 gallon cooler, even with most 5 gallon batches. Reason being that if you're ever unable to fit the full volume mash in the cooler, you can just mash using half your water and then batch sparge with the other half. I think you can also do that with BIAB, but it's probably a lot messier and you'd need a second kettle.

 

[BrotherBock]

Get a kettle for whatever size batches you need. No sense making 10+ gallons if you don't want or have room for it. 3 gallon batches are just as fun.

I have a 6.5 gallon aluminum turkey fryer pot and I've made d@mn near 5 gallon batches in it without boiling over. Just requires watching like a hawk and quick adjustments to the flame (the aluminum pot reacts quickly to flame changes). Usually I do 4 gallons batches in it.

I can't imagine 8 gallon pot not being big enough for a 5 gallon batch. I with my pot I boil off 1.25 gal/hour. Don't know what you'd get with your setup, but 8 gallon pot should be plenty. Especially if sometimes you're not gonna be interested in a 5 gallon batch.

Definitely get a 10 gallon cooler though. You max out grain around 24 lbs. Making imperial strength 5 gallon batches is near impossible with a 5 gallon tun. You could never fit that much grain in a tun like that. Plus if you got the 5 gallon tun route one day you'll be sitting there with your recipe and realize you can't do what you want. Just go with the 10, you won't regret it.

 

[balrog]

Get a bag and try it out in your current pot, if you like smaller batches. If you're heating option is your range, then a keggle/super big pot may not work well for you...regardless of how you mash, you still have to boil it all. Just a thought.

PS- chiller is good too

Gosh, a lot of people are sure willing to spend you money. I'd start simple. Buy a paint strainer bag. Do a 2 1/2 gallon batch in the pot you already have. Chill it like you would your extract batch or just do a no-chill. You shouldn't "need" any more equipment for several batches. Your limitation will be in the amount of grain you can mash so you can't do a real high gravity brew. With my equipment I seem to top out at about a 10% ABV brew. :cross:

After you have done several 2 1/2 gallon batches you can decide on which way to go from there. Maybe a bigger pot, maybe your own mill, maybe you need a chiller, but until you have made a few AG batches you won't know what works with your space and heat source.

Paint strainer bag works great. Cheap. And you can try it out a few times and IF you want to continue BIAB, you coudl upgrade to a Wilserbrewing bag later. I hear they are really nice.

Don't fret about kettle size, gravity, etc. That stuff is all doable in some way or another. You have the advantage that you are planning on doing smaller batches. A turkey fryer kettle will work great for you. A 10 gallon kettle is actually better though, you just might not need it until later.

if you want to do a higher gravity beer you can mash thick and use lots of grain, then sparge in a separate kettle (or bucket filled with hot water or cooler or whatever) and combine to get a high OG wort, then dilute at chill time with cold sanitized water.

I do recommend a nice IC, though. Sure beats a sink full of ice.

Just quickly chiming in as someone who recently moved to AG from extracts, and I **ONLY** have a couple 5G pots. I use the paint strainer bag, have mashed up to 11.5# albeit somewhat sloppily, right in the 5G BK, dunk sparge in the other 5G, boil 3.5-4G as a partial boil.

I could boil in both but that's just more than I want to do. I use my stove top, and I do have the Immersion Cooler and highly recommend that.

It's **VERY** easy to do this to get into AG and all I really needed was the paint strainer bag.

 

[brew_darrymore]

As long as I can fit that in a 5 gallon cooler (no false bottom as I'll use a bag) I'm good to go with the 5 gallon and can wait on the 10 for now.

Yes, you will be able to fit 10lb in a 5-gallon cooler. I use an Igloo 5-gallon beverage cooler, I mash in a bag, and I'm able to fit 12lb of grain @ 1.25qt/lb strike water. I just did a Westvleteren XII clone with 11lb of grain and even had some space for an extra pound of grain or so.

 

[smAllGrain]

So what was your process with this setup? Did you find a need for the 10gal mash tun with a 5gallon kettle or was the 5gal enough for a 3gallon batch?

I have found that the 5Gal Mash Tun has been plenty for my 3Gal Batches as well as my 5Gal batches. The only issue with the 5Gal batches is that I need to add some DME if I want a higher ABV. But I usually don't. I try to keep it as simple as possible and have really enjoyed it