First Time Making Cider - Critique My Reciepe

[deekortiz3]

Hi Home Brew Talk Users,

First time poster, not-so-long time lurker. I found this site looking for kegerator advice (which I am still working on). After a few weeks of reading and also hearing about some home brew from my boss at work I have decided to take the plunge and make something that can go in the kegerator I am building. From reading different articles it seems like starting with a cider is a good idea.

I've come up with a basic idea of what I want to do and I am hoping you guys could share some knowledge with me and point out any flaws.

Ingredients:
5 Gallons Cold Pasteurized Apple Cider (No sodium benzoate or potassium sorbate) - 1/2 Gallon Containers
1 Packets Nottingham Yeast
1 Cup Brown Sugar
1 Cup Cane Sugar (Turbinado)
1 Cup Honey

Make Starter (Day Before):
Pour out a few ounces of Apple Cider
Add One Yeast Packet
Reseal bottle and shake it
After 5-6 hours check bottle
You should see bubbling, release the pressure in the bottle
Reseal the bottle and put in refrigerator
Take starter out a few hours before brewing

Brew Day:
Warm up some cider on stove top (do not boil)
Mix in Sugar and Honey
- Note: I am only heating to aid mixing in the Sugar and Honey
Pour all Cider into Fermentation Bucket
Once Cider has cooled almost down to room temperature add the Starter
Stir the mixture for a minute or two
Seal the lid and affix the air lock
Let sit in a cool place 60-75 degrees (In the 60's is optimal)
Leave for 3 weeks
Siphon to another fermentor
Reseal and put on airlock
Leave in cool place for 2-3 weeks

Transfer to Corny
Put corny in kegerator
Enjoy

Any tips or advice would be great.
Thanks!

 

[deekortiz3]

Just got back from the LHBS. I am the proud new owner of two fermentors, some Nottingham yeast and sanitizer.

The person there suggested that I skip making the starter. Just get the cider into the fermentor and add yeast. Any thoughts? I don't think the starter could hurt anything and I would be able to see that the fermentation start but I have seen recipes that do things both ways.

*edit*
I just realized they were probably just giving me the normal home brew advice to not make a starter using dry yeast. What I am making isn't really the same "starter" as home brew.

 

[Yooper]

Just got back from the LHBS. I am the proud new owner of two fermentors, some Nottingham yeast and sanitizer.

The person there suggested that I skip making the starter. Just get the cider into the fermentor and add yeast. Any thoughts? I don't think the starter could hurt anything and I would be able to see that the fermentation start but I have seen recipes that do things both ways.

I never use a starter for wine or cider. They start right up, as yeast love fructose.

 

[deekortiz3]

I never use a starter for wine or cider. They start right up, as yeast love fructose.

Cool, I was planning to make my starter tomorrow and then do everything else Saturday.

I'll just skip the starter and make everything tomorrow.

 

[smh]

Especially with dry yeast, a starter really isn't needed. The starter in this will just give you more opportunities for infection. As a newcomer the best idea is to keep it simple.

I started with cider and it was a great foray into all grain brewing; teaches the basics well.

Also, your recipe looks nice. It will bump the OG up pretty high with that sugar though. Might be fine for you but you're going to have a fairly potent (i.e. alcohol) tasting brew. If it were me, and I realize it's not, I wouldn't add any sugar. Just go with the cider and the yeast. Some nutrient will help the business if you've got it; I generally add it in.

 

[deekortiz3]

Especially with dry yeast, a starter really isn't needed. The starter in this will just give you more opportunities for infection. As a newcomer the best idea is to keep it simple.

I started with cider and it was a great foray into all grain brewing; teaches the basics well.

Also, your recipe looks nice. It will bump the OG up pretty high with that sugar though. Might be fine for you but you're going to have a fairly potent (i.e. alcohol) tasting brew. If it were me, and I realize it's not, I wouldn't add any sugar. Just go with the cider and the yeast. Some nutrient will help the business if you've got it; I generally add it in.

Thanks! I think I am going to cut the sugar in and honey in half. I'd like to end up with the ABV being somewhere around 5%-8%. I'm thinking that will achieve it. If I am way off the mark let me know.

 

[deekortiz3]

Ended up with Flash Pasteurized apple cider... Should be alright, just not exactly what I planned on.

 

[smh]

I still haven't sat down and figured out how to predict changes in OG from amounts of added sugars. Basically take a gravity reading before adding sugar and then adjust as necessary, testing the gravity as you add. THen predict that the cider will ferment down to 1.000 (probably will go lower) and calculate your predicted ABV from that.

 

[deekortiz3]

Alright the Cider is fermenting so I figure I would post some pictures...

Fermenter from the LHBS...

Cleaning supplies... Used BKF for a quick first cleaning and then followed up with OxyClean.

Followed that up with Star-San (Spigot and Air Lock also pictured).

This was the Cider I used. Great stuff on its own, hopefully it will provide some good hard cider...

Raw Sugar, Brown Sugar and Honey ended up with just bit over 1/2 cup each.

Used a half gallon of cider to mix in sugar and honey and then poured it along with rest of the cider into the fermenter. Then added yeast. I placed it in my room under my desk. The room was a bit warm so I had to put a couple ice bags and an ice gel pouch around the bucket. Will be putting it into a larger tub tomorrow.

 

[Listen_Up_Sonny]

Good luck. I like that you just riffed off other people's ideas and made your own recipe. I think that's the fun in it. I've started tinkering with recipes, too.

Anyway, I am also very new. One thing I'd suggest is not using Bar Keeper's Friend to clean the buckets. It is a bit abrassive, and it might scratch the buckets, which will provide more areas for bacteria to remain.

Just my 2 cents, but I am new too, and I could be way off base.

 

[CanFarmer]

I'd sure like to have a taste of that stuff when it's done. My recipe is a lot simpler and still makes tasty cider - yours oughta be interesting!

5 gal apple juice
2 lbs dextrose
1 packet EC1118 champagne yeast

Dump it all together in sterilized carboy with airlock (no heating, mixing, etc). Ignore it on table in basement until it quits bubbling and clears up (30 days?). Bottle with a bit of priming sugar. Leave bottles in basement for one more year. Enjoy.

 

[deekortiz3]

Good luck. I like that you just riffed off other people's ideas and made your own recipe. I think that's the fun in it. I've started tinkering with recipes, too.

Anyway, I am also very new. One thing I'd suggest is not using Bar Keeper's Friend to clean the buckets. It is a bit abrassive, and it might scratch the buckets, which will provide more areas for bacteria to remain.

Just my 2 cents, but I am new too, and I could be way off base.

Thanks! Yeah the BKF was kind of a pain to use in the bucket. In the future I think I will just use the Oxyclean. Unless the bucket has some stains or something that needs the BKF I will just keep using it for surfaces.

 

[deekortiz3]

I'd sure like to have a taste of that stuff when it's done. My recipe is a lot simpler and still makes tasty cider - your's oughta be interesting!

5 gal apple juice
2 lbs dextrose
1 packet EC1118 champagne yeast

Dump it all together in sterilized carboy with airlock (no heating, mixing, etc). Ignore it on table in basement until it's quits bubbling and clears up (30 days?). Bottle with a bit of priming sugar. Leave bottles in basement for one more year. Enjoy.

That sounds like it would make a damn good wine. I don't know how you can wait that long for it to age wish I had that kind of patience. Maybe I'll gain some with this hobby.

I am hoping to end up with something in the vain of Angry Orchard. I opted not to try a clone or follow any recipe too exactly though because I just didn't want to stress over following particular steps. I also figured if I did a clone and it wasn't close I'd be disappointed that it isn't the same even if was good so I just made my own thing.

 

[CanFarmer]

Just happened that I made two batches at once and still have some left a year old. It's just starting to get great...

 

[deekortiz3]

Moved the fermenter into a tub that I could add some water and ice to.

Rotating ice gel packs and frozen water bottles to keep the water cool. It is fermenting right around 68 degrees.

The air lock is bubbling and whistling beautifully.

There is a fan to the left blowing over the whole thing during the day. At night I put that into the window of the room to draw in cool air.

 

[Vikings]

The fan will only make it heat up faster during the day, it would be best to leave it off. (Think convection oven vs standard oven.) At night when it is blowing in cool air is a different story though.

 

[deekortiz3]

The fan will only make it heat up faster during the day, it would be best to leave it off. (Think convection oven vs standard oven.) At night when it is blowing in cool air is a different story though.

Thanks for the tip. Just turned my fan off for the day.

 

[deekortiz3]

The smell around my fermenter is getting stronger. It stinks! I know this is part of the process, hopefully all good.

I haven't taken the lid off to check it yet, is that okay? Should I check it. I can see why a clear car boy is desirable now.

 

[DanielB83]

I am an absolute self admitting newbie, so excuse the potentially silly question. I've just finished brewing a lager and plan on doing a cider tonight. I'm just curious as to why you syphon off into another fermenter after three weeks and then let it sit again for another 3 weeks?

Is that so as to remove it from the yeast and let it sit longer, clearing the liquid, without sitting in the yeast getting off flavours? Or is there another reason?

 

[deekortiz3]

I am an absolute self admitting newbie, so excuse the potentially silly question. I've just finished brewing a lager and plan on doing a cider tonight. I'm just curious as to why you syphon off into another fermenter after three weeks and then let it sit again for another 3 weeks?

Is that so as to remove it from the yeast and let it sit longer, clearing the liquid, without sitting in the yeast getting off flavours? Or is there another reason?

As far as I know you are correct.

 

[deekortiz3]

Here are a few pics from last Monday...

Moving to another container for clarifying...

Yeast had settled to the bottom nicely...

Thick layer of dead yeast at the bottom of the bucket...

 

[tomb1]

I really like hard cider and mead. Tried adding honey to one of my batches and used it to back-carb another. Disliked both. On my fifth and sixth batch now, just juice and yeast. Starting to realise simpler may be best.

 

[tomb1]

Not knocking your recipe. I hope it turns out awesome. The honey adds a different flavor than I expected.

 

[deekortiz3]

Not knocking your recipe. I hope it turns out awesome. The honey adds a different flavor than I expected.

Interesting... What kind of flavor did it give off?

 

[tomb1]

Hopefully you've eaten Bit o' Honey candy before. Imagine that flavor w/o any sweetness at all added to dry cider. My recipe may not have been good because it was dry. The honey flavor must need sweetness to balance. All the meads I like are very sweet. I'm pretty much a newbie too. Just sharing what little I've learned.

 

[deekortiz3]

Figured I would give an update...

I bottled the cider today. Taste-wise it was definitely really dry. It didn't really seem like vinegar but it was pretty sour. I hadn't prepped for back-sweeten so I just bottled and will hope it gets better with age.

There was a lot of sediment at the bottom when I racked it into my bottling bucket. Almost looked like milky-coffee when I poured some in a glass. What I bottled was very clear though.

 

[oljimmy]

Hi Deek,

"I bottled the cider today. Taste-wise it was definitely really dry. It didn't really seem like vinegar but it was pretty sour. I hadn't prepped for back-sweeten so I just bottled and will hope it gets better with age."

This has been my experience with the majority of ciders that I've made. Even a friendly yeast like Nottingham can strip most of the flavor and leave you with almost nothing but the original acid. The second thing I have (recently) learned is that acid levels vary enormously from orchard to orchard, and that it is not uncommon for some juice to have twice as much malic acid as the 'ideal' juice will have. A combination of these factors can leave us with cider that needs a loooong time to age. Good luck with it!

 

[deekortiz3]

Hi Deek,

"I bottled the cider today. Taste-wise it was definitely really dry. It didn't really seem like vinegar but it was pretty sour. I hadn't prepped for back-sweeten so I just bottled and will hope it gets better with age."

This has been my experience with the majority of ciders that I've made. Even a friendly yeast like Nottingham can strip most of the flavor and leave you with almost nothing but the original acid. The second thing I have (recently) learned is that acid levels vary enormously from orchard to orchard, and that it is not uncommon for some juice to have twice as much malic acid as the 'ideal' juice will have. A combination of these factors can leave us with cider that needs a loooong time to age. Good luck with it!

Hey oljimmy,

Thanks for the wise words. I really should have transferred it again at some point earlier on. I didn't think I would have so much active yeast left after moving it into the bucket for clarifying. Based on how much sediment was at the bottom of the bucket there was a ton.

I didn't note it before but I am expecting the carbonation to take about two weeks. I made a simple syrup and added it while I transferred to the bottling bucket. I'm thinking once it is sparkling and is chilled it won't seem as harsh. I don't think in two weeks it will be drastically different but I am hoping it is a bit more drinkable. Probably a couple months at least until it gets really good though.

 

[rnm410]

I still haven't sat down and figured out how to predict changes in OG from amounts of added sugars. Basically take a gravity reading before adding sugar and then adjust as necessary, testing the gravity as you add. THen predict that the cider will ferment down to 1.000 (probably will go lower) and calculate your predicted ABV from that.

I've linearly fit an og-sucrose relationship,

Sugar (Oz) = 421.9* OG - 421.1

Example:
SG/OG 1.070

Sugar = 421.9 * 1.070 - 421.1 = 30.33 Oz
30.33 Oz / 16 (Oz/#) = 1.9# of Sucrose (cane, beet, etc. - sugar)

Likewise:

(Sugar (Oz) + 421.1) / 421.9 = SG

Note, this is per gallon basis- if you have 5 gallons multiply your sugar required weight by 5.

Alt. you can look at the PPG value of sugars.

 

[Nautalus01]

after placing my juice in the fermentor, I add the yeast without making a starter... have had great success in the fermenting process with rolling bubbles within 24 hours..