First Kettle - Welded or Weldless fittings?

[CUSTOM-441]

So I've made a couple brew can kits which have turned out decent, but I'm ready for what's next. A friend of mine suggested I pull the trigger on a Robobrew and go right to all grain, but I want to do the partial extract thing first so I get the full experience and learn a thing or two. I'm in the market for an entry level kettle that's good for 5 gallon batches. I plan to do partial extract kits with steeping grain & hop additions. I've done a bunch of reading online but I'm still unsure, so I'm throwing it out to everyone here. What's best and why: welded, or weldless fittings?

Here are the two kettles I've narrowed it down to. I'll be selecting the 2" thermometer probe (so as not to interfere with a potential immersion chiller), 3 piece ball valve, and side pickup tube. Thoughts?

Welded
https://www.ontariobeerkegs.com/8_G...anced_Brew_Kett_p/brew-kettle-8gal-welded.htm

Weldless
https://www.ontariobeerkegs.com/8_G...d_Brew_Kettle_p/brew-kettle-8gal-advanced.htm

Not related, but I'm also planning to use 1/2" NPT quick-disconnect fittings for my hose to use when transferring to the fermenter, mostly for ease of use.

 

[mongoose33]

Everything else being equal, I'd rather have welded. Most weldless connections of which I'm aware are nowhere near the stability of a good welded fitting.

If one has to add weldless to a kettle, one should look at brewhardware's weldless fittings; much superior to what generally is otherwise available. I have a few of those on a couple kettles and they're as stable and solid as welded.

Might I suggest you upgrade to a 10-gallon kettle? If you are ever inclined to do BIAB, you'll wish you had a 10-gallon kettle to accommodate that. It's the easiest way to go all-grain that I know.

BTW, I personally would not fool with the robobrew. My son had one; eventually just tossed it on the curb hoping someone would just come and take it away. They did. Some have had success with it, but there are enough stories out there that I wouldn't be interested. Better to do either a grainfather (much pricier) or a traditional mash tun or BIAB, IMO.

YMMV.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

I would say that if you are seriously looking at a Robobrew (or similar electric system) I would not spend the money on a quality brew kettle. I have never used a Robobrew, but I don't see a reason you cannot use that for an extract+steep process. Somebody can correct me if I am wrong.

If you are moving to full-boil 5 gallon batches you need a way to heat it up that will support boiling 6+ gallons (I use a propane burner outside) and you need a way to chill that down (I use an immersion chiller...some people let it chill overnight). Then when you get the Robobrew, most of your investment in brewing equipment will not be needed.

A system like a Robobrew is not "cheating". It will still give you the "full experience" of brewing beer. They are not "push a button and let it make beer for you" type systems. They are mostly the same as a pot on a stove, just in a contained system with more ability to control temps.

I personally have a "decent" 10 gal pot (good quality stainless with an aluminum clad bottom, but no ports/ball valves) that I use for 5 gal all-grain BIAB brewing. I have started getting into 2.5 gal stove top BIAB batches as well. I find smaller batches are a great way to learn and give more freedom to experiment. Something like that might be a good path forward if you want to learn more before committing to a system.

 

[CUSTOM-441]

Might I suggest you upgrade to a 10-gallon kettle? If you are ever inclined to do BIAB, you'll wish you had a 10-gallon kettle to accommodate that. It's the easiest way to go all-grain that I know.

The same kettle does come in a 10 gallon option with welded fittings, I'm not opposed to going a bit bigger if it'll give me more options down the line!

I would say that if you are seriously looking at a Robobrew (or similar electric system) I would not spend the money on a quality brew kettle.

Those kettles are considered entry level kettles according to the site, and they seem to be given their price point compared to other brand names. If I pick up a kettle then I can't see myself going to an electric all grain system overnight, and considering the kettles I'm looking at are all under $150 I'm not too heavily invested.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

Those kettles are considered entry level kettles according to the site, and they seem to be given their price point compared to other brand names. If I pick up a kettle then I can't see myself going to an electric all grain system overnight, and considering the kettles I'm looking at are all under $150 I'm not too heavily invested.

Isn't a Robobrew only around $300 (at least in USD)? If you are investing over $100 into a kettle, I would strongly suggest you get a 10 gal pot. I usually start my boil for a "5 gal" batch at almost 7 gals of liquid (with the goal of around 5.7 after boil and enough in the fermenter to get 5 into a keg). I could see the benefit of a ball valve (the usefulness of a thermometer probe seems questionable). If you can afford the 10 gal version of the pots linked, go for it. If not you can get a good quality 10 gal pot for around $100 USD...like this one: https://www.webstaurantstore.com/vi...num-clad-stock-pot-with-cover/473SSPOT40.html

A 10 gal pot will give you plenty of boil headroom and will support a pretty hefty grain bill for full volume BIAB (and a massive grain bill for BIAB with a sparge).

What are you using now for your batches? How do you plan to boil (stovetop? propane? other?). My 10 gal pot will not physically fit on my stove (the overhead microwave is too low).

Personally I see the contained electric systems more as a good system for people that need/want to brew indoors and/or have limited space for a burner and kettle. They do seem to be limited in how big of beers they support. I would rather invest the money into a quality kettle that will last my lifetime and provides a lot of flexibility. I have been very happy with BIAB for 5 gal and 2.5 gal batches (I just picked up a quality 5 gal pot for $60 for small stovetop batches). If I brewed 10+ gal batches, I would probably look at a 3 tier system (I moved away from a crude fly sparge system for 5 gal batches to BIAB).

 

[CUSTOM-441]

Isn't a Robobrew only around $300 (at least in USD)?

You're in the ball park, but I'm dealing in Canadian Pesos unfortunately. The 10 gal kettle would run me $144 while the Robobrew is $500.

What are you using now for your batches? How do you plan to boil (stovetop? propane? other?). My 10 gal pot will not physically fit on my stove (the overhead microwave is too low).

Like I said I've just been doing Coopers kits with no boil. The beer has been lackluster, but it's still beer and I've learned alot. Planning to use my stove to boil the kettle (it'll fit) and would like to pick up a propane burner in the spring.

 

[RM-MN]

If you have a 5 gallon kettle now, buy a strainer bag and give BIAB a try with a 2 1/2 gallon batch to see if you really want to do all grain beers. That should work out on your current stove where a bigger batch may give you trouble as not all stoves can boil the 6 to 7 gallons that an all grain 5 gallon batch will need.

After you have done a batch or 2 you will know the process and whether you can make better beer that way.

 

[kh54s10]

Keep researching the different methods for brewing beer. Decide what route you want to go before you buy a kettle. For stove top you can do extract with steeping grains and then partial mash in a $20usd 5 gallon kettle that you can sometimes find at the grocery store. There will be no fittings on them. You don't need them yet.

Make sure you don't buys something that you don't need long term, or that will not fit in properly with future expansions.

As to welded or weldless, I guess welded though I bought kettles off Craigslist with no ports so all mine are weldless.

Again plan for the future or you will have ports you don't need, or will have to add ports either by getting it welded or using weldless fittings.

 

[jdr01]

Have you considered soldered fittings. I have done two, three vessel systems with these and have had zero problems. Only issue I had was I used too much heat when soldering. I ended up using my culinary torch for more control and it worked great.
Bought most of my stuff here...http://www.brewhardware.com/Default.asp
He also has a bunch of videos explaining the process.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

Like I said I've just been doing Coopers kits with no boil. The beer has been lackluster, but it's still beer and I've learned alot. Planning to use my stove to boil the kettle (it'll fit) and would like to pick up a propane burner in the spring.

Starting easy and working up is a good plan! As I mentioned, I have started doing some 2.5 gal stove top BIAB batches in a 5 gal kettle. I do feel like it is a good middle ground between the "8 bottles from a 1 gal jug" and the "2 cases from a 5 gal batch" options. 2.5 gals is a lot less volume to move around and to heat and cool. I have my first batches fermenting in two 3 gal Fermonster fermenters...I am not sure I like how thin they are though. My GF has started doing some stove top BIAB batches of around 1.6 gals (a 4 gal pot and two 1 gal jugs).

Those pot you are looking at would be a good place to start...but if you can work in a 10 gal I would recommend that as it gives you a lot of growth towards all-grain BIAB or 3-Vessel brewing.

Good luck!

 

[CUSTOM-441]

As I mentioned, I have started doing some 2.5 gal stove top BIAB batches in a 5 gal kettle. I do feel like it is a good middle ground between the "8 bottles from a 1 gal jug" and the "2 cases from a 5 gal batch" options. 2.5 gals is a lot less volume to move around and to heat and cool.

Hmm, this is a solid point. I've found it tough to drink 5 gallons of beer in time to scratch my itch and brew another batch! I'm using 330ml bottles right now, so 5 gallons gives me roughly 60 bottles, which is insane. I nearly have two sets of bottles now which will allow me to overlap brews nicely so I've always got homebrew to drink and one on the go. Would I run into any issues using a 10 gal kettle for a 2.5 gal batch? I think you've talked me into the 10 gal kettle... so I'm just curious HOW flexible it will be. Sounds like the ideal size is 10 gal kettle for 5 gal batch and 5 gal kettle for 2.5 gal batch...? Thanks for all of your input!

 

[ProblemChild]

Well, I have nothing but good luck with weld-less, so welded will only be an upgrade. Necessary? Not for me.

If you can wire a 220 into your brew area, Go all grain, 15 gallon kettle, and do BAIB. There are some good 220V induction cook plates available on webrestaurantstore.com. I have one myself. It kicks butt. With electric, you can build a frame out of 2x4's and put a pulley on it for the bag. Mash, hoist, drain, squeeze and go to boil. Very simple process.

Any induction capable kettle will do the trick. The foot print will be small, will be easy to hook up a plate chiller and a pump on the system. Will be easy to create a re-circulation system and the induction plate will serve as a rims system. Lots of good things there.

 

[McKnuckle]

Just to add another data point to blend the above responses, I do 2.5 or 3 gallon batches in an 8 gallon kettle using BIAB on a 220V induction cooktop. The kettle has welded fittings.

Sometimes I mash in a 5 gallon cooler and then transfer to the kettle for boiling. Other times I mash in the kettle, using a pump to recirc, and the cooktop has a temperature mode (i.e. set it to 150F) that holds temp quite well. It's no PID, but it's so simple and practical that I don't care.

I use 2.5 and 3 gallon kegs so basically I've downsized the entire system from the 5 gallon standard, which is way too much of one kind of beer for me at a given time.

I have an 11 gallon kettle in my shed if I ever want to brew a bigger batch, but that hasn't happened in a long time.

 

[Newbie2]

I haven’t been in the game that long but thought I’d give my 2 cents. I’ve been brewing for a year and am currently 44 batches in. Ranging in size from one gallon to 6. After two “brew house “ concentrate kits I switched to all grain using a cheap bag and a 10g kettle I got local.

I started using 10g to make 5g biab on stovetop 3000w element. This was good but my stovetop vent couldn’t keep up with an inch of clearance to pot top so moved to another setup.

Now I use the 10g as a mash tun and a 4g pot on an induction plate to get the kettle away from the cupboards etc. Basically a 3G batch (to fill a 2.5 gallon keg after trub etc) fills this pot to the brim pre-boil and have to watch like a hawk. If I could do it again I would have spent the bit more on induction capable from the start on the 10g then I would be able to do all I need.

Now I’m kind of stuck between getting a 5g induction kettle in Canada for 200-300$ or a robobrew etc for $500.

I am seriously looking at the robobrew or grainfather now as my next purchase. Since I make 3G batches the “lack of grain capacity “ doesn’t really affect me.

Sorry for the rambling. Good luck with your choice. Always think of the next step because this is an addictive hobby.

 

[tellyho]

I've been brewing in a pot I built with weldless fittings for 3+ years now, no issues. That said, if the price was the same, I'd buy welded. I'm guessing it's not, though.