First batch - before I start....any advice appreciated

[NightFlight]

I tried years ago, but let's begin with a clean slate.

Okay, I couple questions. I've got a couple of nice 23L carboy (I think - will have to measure). Can I use the carboy as the primary without overflow? Maybe put it in a pan just in case?
The kit calls for 23L of total volume.

Here is the kit I want to give a whirl - what's the worst that could happen?

What the heck is "REAL ALE" anyhow? LOL

The kit is kind of old... but how bad could it be? I'm willing to experiment. So is that a 2011 expiry or 2007 expiry? LOL does it even matter in 2019?

I picked up some new coopers yeast at the local wine shop. It's a double pack in one, so I'll weigh to prevent overpitching... see I did learn something here.

They have a shelf of coopers kits, which they sell for $20 a can if closing on the expiry date. $25 if still "fresh". I thought it might be freshness related to the yeast packet, but had a BB date of 2016, so it can last....

1 KG of sugar is called for but doesn't mention what type. Been lurking and skimming this newbie thread for a day and would appreciate any suggestions.

I found a priming guide, but that's down the road. My basement temp is 18C (that's 64.4F for the old folks) which I believe may be the bottom end of the yeast tolerance for this kind of kit.

I'm thinking of using the second carboy for clarification of around 3 weeks before prime and botte. I don't have a bottling pail - where to get one pre-made? I'm excited to use all my Grolsch bottles!


Thanks ahead of time for any suggestions.

Initial sugar... ???
Priming sugar... dextrose? Boil and cool the mix?
Temperature too low? I have a heating belt.
Can use carboy?
2nd Carboy for clarification?

 

[ncbrewer]

A good start would be to take a look thru Palmers howtobrew.com - it's a little outdated but still real helpful.

Some thoughts filled into your questions below:

I tried years ago, but let's begin with a clean slate.

Okay, I couple questions. I've got a couple of nice 23L carboy (I think - will have to measure). Can I use the carboy as the primary without overflow? Maybe put it in a pan just in case?
The kit calls for 23L of total volume.
I would want absolute minimum of 1 gallon headspace. I use a 7.9 gallon fermenter for 5 gallon batches to prevent blow-out. With anything smaller you would probably need a blow-off tube.

Here is the kit I want to give a whirl - what's the worst that could happen?
View attachment 654769
What the heck is "REAL ALE" anyhow? LOL
I'm not familiar with Coopers naming system.

View attachment 654770
The kit is kind of old... but how bad could it be? I'm willing to experiment. So is that a 2011 expiry or 2007 expiry? LOL does it even matter in 2019?
I'd say that's too old. Better to get a new kit.

I picked up some new coopers yeast at the local wine shop. It's a double pack in one, so I'll weigh to prevent overpitching... see I did learn something here.
I've recently seen some recommendations for two 11 gram packets of dry yeast for a 5 gallon batch - opinions vary.

They have a shelf of coopers kits, which they sell for $20 a can if closing on the expiry date. $25 if still "fresh". I thought it might be freshness related to the yeast packet, but had a BB date of 2016, so it can last....
Viability of the yeast is really important. Especially for a first try, I'd make sure the yeast is not past the expiration date. And if it's been stored at room temperature, it could still be questionable. It should be refrigerated.

View attachment 654771

1 KG of sugar is called for but doesn't mention what type. Been lurking and skimming this newbie thread for a day and would appreciate any suggestions.
I think they're referring to table sugar, but I would use DME instead for better quality beer. I'm a little skeptical about this either way because adding DME could upset the bitterness balance. (I think the Coopers is hopped extract.) I would feel better about unhoped extract and add the hops separately - it's not difficult.

I found a priming guide, but that's down the road. My basement temp is 18C (that's 64.4F for the old folks) which I believe may be the bottom end of the yeast tolerance for this kind of kit.
64F ambient should be ok for most ale yeast. I'd move it to a warmer room after about four days to help it finish. For future, some investigation into temperature control would be worthwhile.

I'm thinking of using the second carboy for clarification of around 3 weeks before prime and botte. I don't have a bottling pail - where to get one pre-made? I'm excited to use all my Grolsch bottles!
Most don't use secondary any more. Transferring gives the beer an opportunity for oxidation and contamination, with little or no benefit.

Thanks ahead of time for any suggestions.

Initial sugar... ???
Priming sugar... dextrose? Boil and cool the mix?
Temperature too low? I have a heating belt.
Can use carboy?
2nd Carboy for clarification?

Going back to my first comment, looking thru How to Brew would be really helpful. Good luck. And welcome to HBT.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

So is that a 2011 expiry or 2007 expiry?

Here in the US the convention is Month/Day/Year...but seems like Day/Month/Year is common in other places...so 2007?

Initial sugar... ???
Priming sugar... dextrose? Boil and cool the mix?
Temperature too low? I have a heating belt.
Can use carboy?
2nd Carboy for clarification?

1) Any sugar is fine. I have seen some suggestions that Corn Sugar has a cleaner tastes, but plenty of people add standard Cane/Beet table sugar.
2) 64F ambient should be fine. The beer will produce some heat. I might be idea to move it to a warmer area once fermentation slows, but not critical.
3) Headroom is good. You need at least a few liters of headspace, and a blowoff tube as well.
4) I stopped moving my beers to secondary. Less work and my beers are better. The general recommendation is to only use a secondary for long conditioning or for a secondary fermentation on fruit (or similar).

 

[NightFlight]

Blowoff is just a tube from the top of the airlock?

 

[bracconiere]

LOL! as far as the age, don't know...and yes a blow off tube is a tube into a container of sanitizer...ferments can foam up quite a bit at first....

 

[NightFlight]

Yikes. I found a carboy bomb thread on the forum here. Maybe a bucket is better. I have a lid and can get a bung to fit tomorrow!

if I blew up a carboy... if it didn’t kill me, my wife would. She hates the smell of beer. Makes her sick to smell it.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

Yikes. I found a carboy bomb thread on the forum here. Maybe a bucket is better. I have a lid and can get a bung to fit tomorrow!

There is a pretty legitimate concern about severe cuts from broken glass carboys...not so sure about bomb issues. I mostly use PET/Plastic carboys these days but used glass for many years without issues...though a buddy of mine moved to stainless after an ER visit after a broken glass carboy. When I do use my glass carboys I am very careful when moving and use some grippy pads (made for opening jars) to ensure they will not slip.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I'm willing to experiment.

I'll suggest either

• Do a web search on "canned goods rust". Throw the can away.

or

• Throw the can away. Do a web search on "canned goods rust".

 

[kh54s10]

I would say that either 2011 or especially 2007 is too old the mess with - throw that away, and look into getting a quality extract with steeping grains kit. IMO, that can would only make "something alcoholic" if it was brand new. Better to up the ante a little and make a better BEER.

Most kits are made to produce 5 gallons so your 23 liter carboy should be good with a blow off tube.

No need to worry about it exploding unless you seal it tight. Even if the blow off tube gets plugged the stopper would blow out before the carboy would explode. - a mess -

But I would shy away from glass if it were me. There are too many stories of people who thought they were being very careful and got injured by a breaking carboy. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/broken-glass-carboy-horror-stories-compendium.376523/

 

[Harleybrew32]

The can is old, but if your willing to experiment go for it.
I would suggest using DME(Dry Malt Extract) instead of using all dextrose maybe 1/2lb of each.
throw the yeast out under the lid and get a fresh packet of yeast to use. I would brew it to 5gal which i think is 19l. if you use US-05 rehydrate it and you should be fine.
cheers

PS glass carboys are great, but they are heavy and dangerous. I use fermonsters myself. and my old glass carboys are for my wine kits now.

 

[bracconiere]

No need to worry about it exploding unless you seal it tight.

or put boiling wort into it, hind sight is 20/20....lol

 

[Tim H]

Yeah...... I would ditch the kit and get something fresh. Liquid malt extract really only lasts 2-3 years before getting all nasty.

if you are trying for a clean slate- I would start with an easy win using a fresh set of ingredients. Why chance it?

 

[NightFlight]

I’ve seen dry malt extracts at the local wine shop... good owners... but primary focus is on wine. Closest beer brew shop is a 40min drive.

They have light, medium and dark extract baggies.

I’ll toss the can... or better yet start a couple batches. Not sure where to start with the dry malt extract baggie? I would need some sort of guide.

 

[mongoose33]

You lost me at the rust on the can. If I were you, I'd experiment with excellent ingredients, instead of sketchy ones.

Everybody here wants you to do a great job and enjoy both the beer and the journey. Making compromises to quality or process is not the way to do that.

Part of the issue is this: if the beer doesn't turn out--and I'd predict it won't--is it because you screwed up the process somehow or was it the ingredients? No way to disentangle the two. Further, the more things that can go wrong, the more likely it is that one will go wrong. Limit the possibility; use fresh ingredients.

My 2 cents, and both welcome and enjoy!

 

[davidabcd]

Yeah, I agree as above. Toss the lot and start fresh.

A 7.9 gallon, plastic fermenter eliminates the need for a blow-off tube. And without a proper harness or milk crate, the glass is dangerous.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I’ve seen dry malt extracts at the local wine shop... good owners... but primary focus is on wine. Closest beer brew shop is a 40min drive.

They have light, medium and dark extract baggies.

I’ll toss the can... or better yet start a couple batches. Not sure where to start with the dry malt extract baggie? I would need some sort of guide.

Chapter 1 of How to Brew, 4e (the book, not the web site) has enough information to brew your first extract+steep batch. One of the advantages of the book (4e, 2017) over the web site (1e, 1999) is that you don't have to read it twice to "be current" in home brewing techniques.

Another option (free) would be "15 minute pale ale":

• https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/15-minute-cascade-pale-ale.210253/
• https://beerandwinejournal.com/15-minute-pale-ale/

Can you explain what "extract baggies" are?

 

[kh54s10]

https://www.googleadservices.com/pa...itwbaC05nmAhVLM6wKHfLDD5EQ9aACegQIDRA0&adurl=

Can you explain what "extract baggies" are?

I believe he is describing the one pound and maybe 3 pound packages of DME that all LHBSs sell. Packed in clear plastic.

 

[NightFlight]

https://www.googleadservices.com/pa...itwbaC05nmAhVLM6wKHfLDD5EQ9aACegQIDRA0&adurl=

I believe he is describing the one pound and maybe 3 pound packages of DME that all LHBSs sell. Packed in clear plastic.

That sounds correct. Dry Malt Extract. I'll see if I can't find some time to check out the shop(s) today. I do prefer to support local rather than go online and find stuff. Though, I do have amazon prime since they dropped the yearly subscription requirement. However I'm in Canada and I won't order stuff across the border due to customs. I find it ironic that "Northern Brewer" is nowhere near what I would consider North.

I'm trying to go in on this hobby on the cheap. I love buying 2nd hand - there's generally no need to buy new. I scored 50 Grolsch swing tops on kijiji locally for ~$1.50 each, a good deal since they are more than $4ea +tax. new. The same guy has another 50, I should definitely grab them up.

https://beerandwinejournal.com/15-minute-pale-ale/

... speaking of hops. I think I like some hops, but hoppy beer is not my thing. Tastes are changing as I get older and experience more beer as 'session' beers - and looking forward to more of that. But that super-dry bite can turn me off. It would be a shame to condition a batch and then just introduce it to the drain. Really, life's too short to drink beer you don't like. I also find some beers like 'flying monkey' just plain awful. I once tried to finish one and ended up with a headache before I was done the can.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

https://beerandwinejournal.com/15-minute-pale-ale/

Here's a link to some ideas on how to make "15 minute <insert style here>" beers: https://old.reddit.com/r/Homebrewin...ve_any_luck_with_an_all_extract_wort/djwjf8x/

 

[NightFlight]

I ended up just starting a fresh Coopers Dark ale Sunday night. She gave a great Krausen in less than 12hrs. 1.054 OG. Bubbling away nicely now, I've managed to nail an even 20-21C. My basement near the corner is 16C right now and adding a heating belt just at the base of the pail does it.

Also I've discovered Craig's channel on youtube, which is really helping out on the small mechanical things you don't pick up from text.

Thanks everyone for all the guidance!

 

[Soulshine2]

I tried years ago, but let's begin with a clean slate.

Okay, I couple questions. I've got a couple of nice 23L carboy (I think - will have to measure). Can I use the carboy as the primary without overflow? Maybe put it in a pan just in case?
The kit calls for 23L of total volume.

Here is the kit I want to give a whirl - what's the worst that could happen?
View attachment 654769
What the heck is "REAL ALE" anyhow? LOL

View attachment 654770
The kit is kind of old... but how bad could it be? I'm willing to experiment. So is that a 2011 expiry or 2007 expiry? LOL does it even matter in 2019?

I picked up some new coopers yeast at the local wine shop. It's a double pack in one, so I'll weigh to prevent overpitching... see I did learn something here.

They have a shelf of coopers kits, which they sell for $20 a can if closing on the expiry date. $25 if still "fresh". I thought it might be freshness related to the yeast packet, but had a BB date of 2016, so it can last....


View attachment 654771

1 KG of sugar is called for but doesn't mention what type. Been lurking and skimming this newbie thread for a day and would appreciate any suggestions.

I found a priming guide, but that's down the road. My basement temp is 18C (that's 64.4F for the old folks) which I believe may be the bottom end of the yeast tolerance for this kind of kit.

I'm thinking of using the second carboy for clarification of around 3 weeks before prime and botte. I don't have a bottling pail - where to get one pre-made? I'm excited to use all my Grolsch bottles!


Thanks ahead of time for any suggestions.

Initial sugar... ???
Priming sugar... dextrose? Boil and cool the mix?
Temperature too low? I have a heating belt.
Can use carboy?
2nd Carboy for clarification?

nope, dont even open it. Its old. best before 2007 , so it was canned maybe a year before that. just throw it away and order new stuff. You'll have a better brew and first experience to base your NEXT brew.