EdWort's apfelwein, poor man's edition

[Inodoro_Pereyra]

Ok, so I'm setting up to make some of EdWort's apfelwein. But, being that my circumstances are kinda difficult, I decided to make a few changes.

1. Instead of a 5 gallon batch, I'm making 1 gallon. Being that the juice EdWort suggested seems to be unavailable in Florida, I'm using Winn Dixie's premium apple juice (not from concentrate). It only has some ascorbic acid (vitamin C), but no preservatives.

2. I'm using table sugar instead of dextrose, and here comes my question:

For what I read, I should use 0.8 parts cane sugar for every 1 part dextrose, but that's all I could find, talking about bottle carbing. Is that the same proportion I should use to get to the recommended 1.066 O.G.?

 

[Schlenkerla]

Ok, so I'm setting up to make some of EdWort's apfelwein. But, being that my circumstances are kinda difficult, I decided to make a few changes.

1. Instead of a 5 gallon batch, I'm making 1 gallon. Being that the juice EdWort suggested seems to be unavailable in Florida, I'm using Winn Dixie's premium apple juice (not from concentrate). It only has some ascorbic acid (vitamin C), but no preservatives.

2. I'm using table sugar instead of dextrose, and here comes my question:

For what I read, I should use 0.8 parts cane sugar for every 1 part dextrose, but that's all I could find, talking about bottle carbing. Is that the same proportion I should use to get to the recommended 1.066 O.G.?

Approximately 1/5th of 2 lbs. 1/5 = 0.2

0.2 x 2lbs = .4lbs

 

[Inodoro_Pereyra]

I understand that. Sorry I wasn't clear enough on my question.

I do know I have to use 1/5th of the sugar used for the 5 gallon batch. My question is regarding the differences between the 2 sugars. All I could find about it is about the differences for bottle carbing, for which is recommended to use 0.8 parts of cane sugar for each part of dextrose, because cane sugar seems to produce more CO2.
That would put the amount of sugar needed for a gallon of juice at about 145g (5.13 oz), instead of the 181g (6.4 oz) I'd need if I used dextrose.
What I need to know is if that proportion also holds true when it comes to O.G., or if I should use a different amount.

 

[Schlenkerla]

For a poor man that crap should not matter. You get more buzz for your money.
The corn sugar is 95% fermentable, whereas cane is 100%.

You are splitting hairs.

What you want pppg. Points per pound per gallon.
According to pro mash they are both at 1.046
I believe apple juice is 1.040. You can easily verify by measuring.

 

[Inodoro_Pereyra]

You sure? According to EdWort, the O.G. was 1.066...

 

[Schlenkerla]

No I think you dont understand pppg.

Yes the abv is 1.066 for AW.

A pppg of 1.046 results in;

1lb of sugar per gallon of water is 1.046
So, a half lb in a gallon water is 1.023
And a quarter lb is about 1.012

Water is 1.000
Apple juice is 1.040
1/2 lb of sugar is 1.023

.040+.023= .063 : add a 1 : 1.063

I dont know for sure the pppg for just juice.

About 5 gallons of juice plus two lbs of corn sugar equals 1.065

 

[Inodoro_Pereyra]

You're right, looks like I didn't understand it, but now I do. Thank you.

I just measured my juice's S.G, and it's 1.050., which gives me 157g sugar for a 1.066 O.G.. I'll go with that, and report back.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Oops! Had a typo with the gravity calc. Fixed it.

1.040 + 1.023 = 1.063

So, 157gm : 0.346lb so very close to .400 lbs for the sugar.

.35 * .046 = .016 (.35lb results in .016 pppg)

1.050 + .016 = 1.066.

Perfecto

 

[Inodoro_Pereyra]

Hmmm...I was about to redo my calculations, to check if I had made a mistake. Now that you confirmed my numbers, I don't have to.

I just mixed my gallon of juice with my 157 g of sugar, and my O.G ended up being...1.090!!!
So, being that you confirmed my numbers weren't wrong, I have to guess yours are... So now I have to go buy another gallon of juice.

Either way, I can think of worse excuses to double my batch size...

 

[Schlenkerla]

Hmmm...I was about to redo my calculations, to check if I had made a mistake. Now that you confirmed my numbers, I don't have to.

I just mixed my gallon of juice with my 157 g of sugar, and my O.G ended up being...1.090!!!
So, being that you confirmed my numbers weren't wrong, I have to guess yours are... So now I have to go buy another gallon of juice.

Either way, I can think of worse excuses to double my batch size...

Give me the exact qty of juice & sugars and whatever else.

Fluid oz of juice, plus the temp at measurement.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Another point here is the ratio of juice to sugar.

If you add about 1/3 of a pound of sugar to one gallon it becomes more than a gallon volumetrically.

So, if you have what is roughly 1 gallon of must its not really at the ratio of 1 gallon:1/3lb sugar. The net effect is less than a gallon of juice plus 1/3 lb of sugar is more like maybe 1 gallon and a 1/2lb or sugar, or something along those lines.

Thats why I asked how much juice was used.

 

[Inodoro_Pereyra]

Sorry I didn't answer earlier. I'm having connection problems.

Initially, here's my numbers:

Everything was at 76*F.
I S.G'ed the juice at 1.050
The juice was exactly 1 gallon (2 64 oz bottles).
I added exactly 157g of cane sugar. I have a scale that can measure 0.1g.
the O.G was, as stated before, 1.090.

But it gets weirder:

Yesterday, while I had the first gallon sanitizing on 1/2 a Campden tablet, I went back to Winn Dixie, to buy an extra gallon of juice, so I could, theoretically, get my O.G down to 1.070.
When I got there, they only had 1 bottle (1/2 gallon).
So I bought it, waited for a few hours until my boiled water (to rinse the bleach I'm sanitizing with) cooled down, and added it to the previous juice/sugar mixture, thinking I was gonna end with a 1.080 O.G.
So I took a reading, and...it was 1.070!!! What the hell is going on?

Now, just to make a few things (that I know are gonna pop up) clear:

Before I got interested in brewing, I made a lot of wine. I know how to use the hydrometer.
My hydrometer cup is a flowerpot, and it's 2 inches wide. No way the hydrometer stuck to the side. Besides that, I always "bounce" my hydrometer down a few times in the liquid, to make sure nothing is going on.
I just checked the hydrometer under a magnifying glass. No cracks whatsoever.