East Coast Syle IPA Advice

[rlonardo]

I'm planning to brew an East Coast Syle IPA next week and was hoping to get some pointers before I fully commit (i.e. mash in).

Take a gander at the recipe below - my goal is a handsomely cloudy (NOT murky) IPA that has that fruit explosion that you get from the East Coast type IPA. My main questions:

- How do the hop additions look? I have limited experience with whirlpool so I'm not quite sure how much to add...

- I am going to use store bought RO water - what additions should I add? What should my mineral targets be for this type of ale?

- The Gigayeast GY054 Vermont Ale - anyone have any experience with it? Is it slow? Explosive? What is the ideal temperature to coax a few fruity esters out of that sucker?

Any assistance would be MUCH appreciated!

BeerSmith 2 Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: ECIPA001
Brewer: RLonardo
Asst Brewer:
Style: American IPA
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (30.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 7.04 gal
Post Boil Volume: 6.24 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.75 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.062 SG
Estimated Color: 5.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 142.5 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 78.3 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
11 lbs Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM) Grain 1 83.8 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Oats, Flaked (Briess) (1.4 SRM) Grain 2 11.4 %
10.0 oz Carapils (Briess) (1.5 SRM) Grain 3 4.8 %
0.75 oz Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus (CTZ) [15.00 %] - Hop 4 34.6 IBUs
2.50 oz Calypso [14.90 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 25. Hop 5 39.9 IBUs
2.50 oz Mosaic (HBC 369) [11.90 %] - Steep/Whirl Hop 6 31.8 IBUs
2.25 oz Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus (CTZ) [15.00 %] - Hop 7 36.1 IBUs
1.0 pkg Vermont Ale (Gigayeast #) Yeast 8 -
1.50 oz Calypso [14.90 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days Hop 9 0.0 IBUs
1.50 oz Mosaic (HBC 369) [12.40 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Hop 10 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Columbus/Tomahawk/Zeus (CTZ) [15.00 %] - Hop 11 0.0 IBUs


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 13 lbs 2.0 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash In Add 16.81 qt of water at 165.7 F 154.0 F 60 min

Sparge: Batch sparge with 2 steps (0.94gal, 3.57gal) of 168.0 F water

 

[Beer-lord]

I've not brewed one yet but am planning too soon-ish and have done a bit of research and I've not seen many recipes yet that have less than 6 oz of dry hops and many with lots more.
Grain wise, I'm thinking using 2 row and about 20% (maybe more) wheat malt.
So honestly, I'm of very little help, sorry.

 

[bigdinosaur1337]

I've brewed a few batches of an 'East Coast' style IPA - one recently for the brewery I own - turned out to be our best seller for the season. I combed through the numerous forum posts here on HBT and honestly the amount of research put into the style was a huge help - definitely worth reading every page available about the various clones. The recipe I did up at the brewer is below, my friend got me some cans of The Veil's Crucial Taunt and the color, aroma and flavor were nearly identical - theirs lingered a bit longer (grapefruit). I recently changed the recipe a bit and included that one below as well. Keep in mind, at the brewery I was limited to my hops since we don't have a contract (Centennial, Chinook, Cascade). Both beers used the GigaYeast you're asking about. The batch at the brewery took off without a hitch, the most recent batch I did took about 5 days to finally show signs and is finally bubbling away.

East Coast IPA (Brewery)
Pale Malt (2-Row) - 88.89%
White Wheat Malt - 6.35%
Flaked Oats - 3.17%
Honey Malt - 1.59%

Magnum - Boil 90min (97.8IBU)
Flameout:
Chinook - 15min Whirlpool - 10.3IBU
Centennial - 15min Whirlpool - 15.8IBU
Cascade - 15min Whirlpool - 6.5IBU

Chill to 180*F - no calculated IBU's, at least per beersmith. I went heaviest on Centennial, followed by Cascade then Chinook. For a 25gal batch (small test batches on a 1bbl system) - I did 18.18oz, 13.64oz, 9.09oz respectively.

OG - 1.073
IBU - 130.4 (Crazy but it didn't taste like it at all, just straight "juice")
SRM - 5.5
Mashed at 152 for 60min

Dry Hop for 25 gallons (2x) - first dry hop was 4 days into fermentation:
9.09oz Chinook
18.18oz Centennial
13.64oz Cascade

Photo - Crucial Taunt left, mine on the right.

The most recent East Coast Style IPA for a 5gal batch that is currently fermenting away is below - keep in mind, I have no tasting notes or anything of the sorts, just keeping my fingers crossed it tastes as good as the airlock smells!

2-row - 90%
White Wheat - 5%
Honey Malt - 2.5%
Flaked Oats - 2.5%

Magnum - 60min, 27.2IBU

Flameout/Steep Whirlpool - 15min:
Mosaic - 18.4IBU
Galaxy - 10.5IBU
Citra - 27IBU

Chill to 180*F, whirlpool 30Min:
Mosaic - 3oz
Galaxy - 1oz
Citra - 4oz

Mash 152*F - 60min
1.073OG
83.1IBU
5.9SRM
7.7%

Dry hop matches the 2nd whirlpool addition. The second picture is of this most recent batch - I did want to brighten the color up a bit in writing the recipe which I think I hit that mark as well. Both fermented at 63*F.

Not sure if this answers any of your questions, but from a commercial market standpoint recipe #1 certainly hit the mark. We'll see what happens with number 2. As for the drop in IBU's and changes from the first to seconds malt bill - I couldn't locate the first ones recipe for a few days so I went off memory, but that is part of the joys of brewing, even if it turns out poorly the end result will still get me to the same place!

 

[crusader1612]

IMO - Get rid of the Carapils, and increase you Oats to at least 15%. simple grain bill with plenty of oats is key to the style.
the oats will make up the bulk of the body.

Is your first addition at 60min? It will work that way. alternatively - FWH this and usethe remeining at FO and it looks solid. (although I dont know much about Calypso)

 

[bigdinosaur1337]

I use Calypso in my Kolsch up at the brewery to supplement the lack of Apple/Pear I get from White Labs 029 to help align it more with the style/flavor I look for. Pretty strong flavor profile, leans more towards green apple in my experience.

 

[olotti]

I use Calypso in my Kolsch up at the brewery to supplement the lack of Apple/Pear I get from White Labs 029 to help align it more with the style/flavor I look for. Pretty strong flavor profile, leans more towards green apple in my experience.

Where do you work if you care to give the name I'm in Lansing area.

 

[bigdinosaur1337]

East side of the state, don't want to give too much away

 

[val214]

This is my most recent batch. Pretty similar to the "north east IPA" recipe.

48% 2 row
24% Maris otter
16% oats (flaked)
6% Carapils
6% flaked wheat

1oz centennial fwh
1oz farmhouse blend @10min
1oz simcoe @10min
1oz azzaca @10min

Flameout / whirlpool @180* for 20min
1oz farmhouse @FO
1oz azacca @FO
1oz mosaic @FO
2oz simcoe @FO

Dry hop 1
1oz azacca @day 5
1oz simcoe @day 5
1oz mosaic @day 5

Dry hop 2
3 oz Azzaca @day 8
1 oz simcoe @day 8
1 oz mosaic @day 8

Kegged at day 14.

Yeast Omega Conan
Mash@152*

Hydro @day 13
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1470889252.318512.jpg

 

[olotti]

East side of the state, don't want to give too much away

Well that's no fun.

 

[rlonardo]

So I ended up brewing this on Monday and ended up going with the following grain bill:

8 lb. 2-Row
2 lb. Flaked Oats
2 lb. Vienna
12 oz. White Wheat

Hop schedule I kept the same as above. I used store bought RO water and treated with a total of:

5 g CaCl
8.9 g Gypsum

I was targeting the following water profile:

Ca - 100
Mg - 0
Na - 0
SO4 - 150
Cl - 100

Made a starter Sunday night, brewed Monday and left overnight and the next day in the bath tub with ice water to drop down into the low 60's (my tap water only got it to ~85 F with my immersion chiller). Yesterday afternoon there was good activity in my yeast starter and the wort had chilled to 64 F, so I pitched and put it in my Cool Brewing bag (the thing is terrific, by the way).

I'll let everyone know how this turns out - it had a lot of fruity flavors going on when I tasted the hydro sample so I have high hopes! Thanks for all of the advice.

 

[jpakstis]

I've been immersing myself in the NE IPA/PA styles and it seems that a simple grain bill is one component. Most of Trillium's IPAs are 2-row with C-15, white wheat, and dextrine and dextrose. The Pale Ale just removes the dextrose. And when I was trying clone Maine Beer Co's Dinner, someone mentioned that the MBC guys recommended simplifying the grain bill.

As for hops, very little bitterness. Huge flameout/whirlpool additions. Also, Trillium said that they dry hop when the krausen is still going strong so that the hop oils will mix better. And of course double-dry hopping seems to be the norm. Trillium uses only two types of hops for the most part, but I know Dinner has more than that, maybe close to four? Falconer's Flight is a big one for them.

I brewed up a Trillium-style Pale Ale about a month ago that I'm bringing to a getaway weekend this weekend. This was my grain bill:

Pale 2-Row - 78%
White Wheat - 13%
Carapils (Dextrine Malt) - 6.5%
Caramel / Crystal 15L - 2.4%

Hops:

0.5 oz - Columbus Pellet - Boil 25 min
0.5 oz - Columbus Boil 0 min
2 oz Mosaic - Whirlpool at 140 °F 30 min
1 oz Columbus - Dry Hop 2 days
4 oz Mosaic - Dry Hop 14 days

And because I kegged this about three weeks ago, I decided to add another 2 ounces of Mosaic on Monday to give it a little more oomph.

The predicted OG was 1.057 but it came in a little higher, like 1.062. The predicted FG was 1.015, but this got down to 1.012. I haven't drank it carbed yet, but the samples I pulled throughout were really good and very reminiscent of Trillium's Fort Point Pale.

 

[basisforaday]

This is my most recent batch. Pretty similar to the "north east IPA" recipe.

48% 2 row
24% Maris otter
16% oats (flaked)
6% Carapils
6% flaked wheat

1oz centennial fwh
1oz farmhouse blend @10min
1oz simcoe @10min
1oz azzaca @10min

Flameout / whirlpool @180* for 20min
1oz farmhouse @FO
1oz azacca @FO
1oz mosaic @FO
2oz simcoe @FO

Dry hop 1
1oz azacca @day 5
1oz simcoe @day 5
1oz mosaic @day 5

Dry hop 2
3 oz Azzaca @day 8
1 oz simcoe @day 8
1 oz mosaic @day 8

Kegged at day 14.

Yeast Omega Conan
Mash@152*

Hydro @day 13
View attachment 365848

That looks beautiful. Any tasting notes on your batch?

 

[val214]

That looks beautiful. Any tasting notes on your batch?

I brewed a 11gal batch and split it. One got 3rd gen Omega Conan and the other got 001.

Conan ended @1.012
001 ended @1.010

The Conan got more of the Azzaca dry hop has a medicine/pezz taste followed by a light amount of peach Esters.

The 001 got all simcoe dry hop addictions. The simcoe really come through. The beer has a nice body and is crisp.
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1471469551.763794.jpg

 

[olotti]

I brewed a 11gal batch and split it. One got 3rd gen Omega Conan and the other got 001.

Conan ended @1.012
001 ended @1.010

The Conan got more of the Azzaca dry hop has a medicine/pezz taste followed by a light amount of peach Esters.

The 001 got all simcoe dry hop addictions. The simcoe really come through. The beer has a nice body and is crisp.
View attachment 366621

This pic is great as I think it really hits to the point that grain bill has a lot to do with this style of beer, I'm sure the 001 will drop clearer in time but now both beers are haze for daze and I'm sure the 001 may have a cleaner taste too.

 

[val214]

This pic is great as I think it really hits to the point that grain bill has a lot to do with this style of beer, I'm sure the 001 will drop clearer in time but now both beers are haze for daze and I'm sure the 001 may have a cleaner taste too.

001 at 7 days from kegging
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1471481626.737490.jpg

Conan at 7 days from kegging
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1471483110.486221.jpg

 

[olotti]

001 at 7 days from kegging
View attachment 366664

Beautiful. now do you find you prefer one over the other, I know their different but maybe this shows a nice option if I want a less yeast cleaner taste 001 still works in keeping the haze if the grain bill is on point and of course you hop the snot out of it. My primary IPA grain bill has been 70% 2 row, 16% white wheat, 9% combined flaked oats and barley and 3% carapils.

 

[val214]

Beautiful. now do you find you prefer one over the other, I know their different but maybe this shows a nice option if I want a less yeast cleaner taste 001 still works in keeping the haze if the grain bill is on point and of course you hop the snot out of it.

I don't want to say that a certain yeast taste better than the other. It think hops play a huge part on how the beer turns out. The combination between hops and the esters from the yeast will influence the overall aroma and taste. I think the Grain bill is a huge contributor to the haze. I highly recommend a split batch.

 

[olotti]

I don't want to say that a certain yeast taste better than the other. It think hops play a huge part on how the beer turns out. The combination between hops and the esters from the yeast will influence the overall aroma and taste. I think the Grain bill is a huge contributor to the haze. I highly recommend a split batch.

Fair enough. I can only do 5 gal at a time all grain so I'm brewing a IPA I just made with 1318 and now I'm using the same grain bill, water etc just this time with Denny's fav 50. It's bubbling away now at 68 deg so I look forward to the outcome.

 

[olotti]

001 at 7 days from kegging
View attachment 366664

Conan at 7 days from kegging
View attachment 366669

Do you reuse or wash you Conan strain? I've found myself that the further generations I have the clearer it'll get as that beer looks less hey than you 001 in the pics.

 

[val214]

Do you reuse or wash you Conan strain? I've found myself that the further generations I have the clearer it'll get as that beer looks less hey than you 001 in the pics.

Yes. I washed the Conan yeast. It's 3rd gen that was used for this last batch. I have found that the FG gets lower with each gen by a few points. 1st 1.018,2nd 1.0015 3rd 1.012. The peach aroma is still present.

 

[olotti]

Yes. I washed the Conan yeast. It's 3rd gen that was used for this last batch. I have found that the FG gets lower with each gen by a few points. 1st 1.018,2nd 1.0015 3rd 1.012. The peach aroma is still present.

Hmmm I bought the farmhouse oly-52 strain as that's all that was available at the time. I agree fg does seem to creep lower with each batch but that seems to be what it does although the first batch I used it got down to 1.010 and it usually hovers there unless I use a higher mash temp, only peach I've ever got was from the initial starter but I never taste it in the beer could also be covered up by the massive hops I use like everyone else my 7% IPAs use about a pound of hops if just not over and that is prob on the low end compared to a lot of people.

 

[hopbrad]

my recipe for these NE style ipas are usually 75-85% 2-row and 15-20% wheat, maybe some pils to sub in for the 2-row as i get that in bulk for $1 per kg. and occassionally some cane sugar if i want to bump the gravity a few points.
i havent used oats yet but may do that soon. i dont care if my beer looks like grapefruit juice or if its crystal clear. but im planning on my next batch to have some oats in it to see what it does with flavor/body.
i use conan, i have a few generations saved, currently drinking a batch made with 4th generation. the only batch that didnt attenuate well was the first one. every other has been pretty consistently around 1.012-1.014 range.
i notice the peach/apricot flavors moreso a few weeks into the keg, my guess is its bc the hop flavors mellow some.
my favorite hop combo for this is columbus or apollo to bitter, blend 3:2:1 mosaic:simcoe:apollo/columbus on the late hops. sometimes ill mix in some citra if i want more passionfruit.

to the OP my only changes would be to nix the vienna and sub the calypso with more mosaic or simcoe, or citra

 

[rlonardo]

So to update...I bottled this guy on Monday after 2 weeks in the fermenter. In addition to the hops that I listed originally for dry hopping, I added another ounce each of Columbus, Mosaic and Calypso after the first round had been in for 4 days. 3 days later I bottled.

As I want to see how the hop flavors and aromas change over the next couple weeks while the bottles are conditioning, I popped one in the fridge this morning before work and cracked it open when I got open. I was really surprised at how carbonated this was after only 3 days in the bottle! I'm guessing it has something to do with the low flocculating yeast? I've never opened a beer this soon after bottling that had such bubbly carbonation...

Anyway, the appearance is pretty much dead on to what I was aiming for. A tad bit more opaque than what I wanted, but it still looks bright rather than a murky almost dull orange that I've seen in some other beers in this style...
Aroma is fantastic - super fruity.
The taste is great, but there is a flavor in there that I can't quite place that seems a little out of place. I'm wondering if I should have taken the advice of replacing the Calypso hops with something else. Whatever - I'm sure I'll end up rebrewing this with a modified hop schedule.

Thanks guys for all of the advice - this has turned out to be one of my favorites that I've brewed!

 

[ArmyATCBrewer]

This is my most recent batch. Pretty similar to the "north east IPA" recipe.

48% 2 row
24% Maris otter
16% oats (flaked)
6% Carapils
6% flaked wheat

1oz centennial fwh
1oz farmhouse blend @10min
1oz simcoe @10min
1oz azzaca @10min

Flameout / whirlpool @180* for 20min
1oz farmhouse @FO
1oz azacca @FO
1oz mosaic @FO
2oz simcoe @FO

Dry hop 1
1oz azacca @day 5
1oz simcoe @day 5
1oz mosaic @day 5

Dry hop 2
3 oz Azzaca @day 8
1 oz simcoe @day 8
1 oz mosaic @day 8

Kegged at day 14.

Yeast Omega Conan
Mash@152*

Hydro @day 13
View attachment 365848

Just ordered ingredients for this and I'm super stoked to brew it! I live in South Korea and haven't been able to experience this style yet, but just reading about it, I knew I had to brew it! I'm wondering if anyone has soured this or anything similar. I'm looking to use Conan, WLP644 and Lactobacillus Brevis. Any thoughts on this?

 

[tagz]

The brevis would have a pretty tough time working with all those hops.

 

[ArmyATCBrewer]

The brevis would have a pretty tough time working with all those hops.

I'm still pretty new to sours...any recommendations for something that will be able to stand up to the hops?

 

[tagz]

Pedio is much more hop tolerant but will take longer to get the job done. You could think about using dregs from some commercial sour beers; they tend to have much hardier bacteria and can create acidity in a few months time. You could also use lacto to sour your wort before you boil. Then you could add hops as normal afterward. Lots of options!

 

[ArmyATCBrewer]

Cool! Thanks for the info! I'll look into some locally available sours.

 

[rlonardo]

I would avoid long souring something like this. You're going to lose a lot of your hop flavors and aromas from the boil in that period of time and basically have to rely on dry hopping to make them back up. I think the way to go would be to sour before boiling. Then I would avoid any additions at the beginning of the boil - sour and bitter do not go together well. If you just use late kettle additions at that point, your sourness will balance out the malty sweetness like bitterness normally would in an IPA, and you'll get a ton of hop flavor and aroma.

 

[Wahoo]

I agree with rlondardo. If you want to make a sour IPA of any sort, IMO the best thing to do is to make a kettle sour. This allows you to use the souring attributes of lacto while also making a beer with significant quantities of hops.

Basically, run off your mash into your kettle. Bring to a boil to pasturize. Chill to ~100f and add lactobacillus. When you reach your target pH, bring to a boil as normal and add hops in your boil as you see fit.

 

[pennahighlandbrew]

I hate to hijack this thread, but I've got a question on yeast choice for this style. I understand that most people recommend using Vermont or Conan, but a. I'm unable to procure these at my LHBS, and b. I primarily use dry yeast for a number of reasons.

From what I gather, an English ale yeast seems to be preferable here. Does anyone have any recommendations on a dry yeast selection that may be appropriate for this? Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

 

[elburrogrande]

I hate to hijack this thread, but I've got a question on yeast choice for this style. I understand that most people recommend using Vermont or Conan, but a. I'm unable to procure these at my LHBS, and b. I primarily use dry yeast for a number of reasons.

From what I gather, an English ale yeast seems to be preferable here. Does anyone have any recommendations on a dry yeast selection that may be appropriate for this? Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Try the wlp007

 

[crusader1612]

Try the wlp007

If you only have access to Dry Yeast S04 is a good sub. a Little estery at times, but keep the temps in check and you should be good.

alternatively, you can try one of the british strains from Mangrove Jacks?
I was planning on trying Burton union (Now Liberty Bell) on the Hophands Clone soonish.

 

[Ben58]

WY 1318 is very good choice for this style.

 

[pennahighlandbrew]

If you only have access to Dry Yeast S04 is a good sub. a Little estery at times, but keep the temps in check and you should be good.



alternatively, you can try one of the british strains from Mangrove Jacks?

I was planning on trying Burton union (Now Liberty Bell) on the Hophands Clone soonish.

I was wondering about how US-04 would work out. I've had some good experience with that yeast, just never for an IPA. I really don't have the time/equipment to really bother with liquid yeast, but it's tough to find much information on dry yeast equivalents for this style.

 

[elburrogrande]

You won't get the flavors you are looking for from dry yeast. Just pitch liquid yeast without the starter. Ive done several batches like this due to time and they all attenuate down to 1.01-1.014

 

[crusader1612]

Just pitch liquid yeast without the starter.

This is really bad advice.
Healthy yeast is really quite important.

 

[elburrogrande]

This is really bad advice.
Healthy yeast is really quite important.

How is this bad advice? the advice is actually placed on most liquid yeast vials stating they are good for up to 5 gallons without starter. Are you familiar with brulosophy and their exbeeriments? Please check out Ray's experiment using a single vial vs yeast starter.

http://brulosophy.com/2015/04/20/yeast-pitch-rate-single-vial-vs-yeast-starter-exbeeriment-results/

Here is Ray's conclusion:

"I’m inclined to defer to the yeast labs here and suggest that perhaps they know a thing or two about how their product is going to perform. At the same time, the fact a beer made with a single vial of yeast pitched directly into wort was not reliably distinguishable from a beer fermented with a “proper” amount of cells propagated in a starter, well, that sort of bewilders me."

 

[TheHopfather]

^ Agreed. I've never had a "bad" batch from pitching just a smack pack into 5 gal before. If I'm in a hurry I'll use dry yeast or just pitch liquid without a starter, works fine. The biggest reason I make starters at all is to harvest some yeast to save from over building the starter.

 

[grassfeeder]

pitching direct is just fine as long as you're pitching appropriate number of cells. in these with the OG being over 1.060 you'd beed two vials or packs and hopefully using a yeast nutrient in the boil.