Dry or Liquid Yeast 11 gallons

[musicis]

I did read the thread on dry vs liquid. Reading it makes me wonder why 99% of brewers don't use dry yeast.

I want to make two 11 gallon batches of a 1.100 OG Belgium Ale. With a stir plate Mr. Malty says 8 vials/packs!!

What would you experienced brewers do? I never used the dry stuff before. Just make a starter with 8 packs of dry? There must be a catch here. $18 Vs. $56??

 

[logan3825]

I believe Mr. Malty is talking about smack packs not packs of dry yeast. If you are going to make a Belgian beer I would think you almost have to use liquid yeast. However you do not need more than one vial/smack pack. You just need to step up your starters.

I would never make a starter for dry yeast. It is less expensive to by an extra pack of dry yeast than to make a starter.

 

[smokinj]

The advantage of liquid is the variety of strains available. I use dry in most of my beers, but in more specialized styles where specific yeast characterisics are desired, such as belgians, I prefer liquid.

 

[ShinyBuddha]

I just checked your numbers and yup, for your 22 gallons of beer it looks like its 8 vials for the small starter. If you move the slider bar to the right (larger starter) you can make it 2 vials per batch with a larger starter. Or you could get 8.2 packs of dry yeast per batch (is there a Belgian style dry?).

 

[y6y6y6]

The reason for 99% of brews not using dry yeast comes down to 1) marketing, and 2) having more control over what beer you end up with.

Look at it this way - If you are going to spend a great deal of time building a recipe, especially all grain, to replicate a specific beer style, why would you go with a yeast that isn't suppose to give you that style? Simple as that. If you want a true Belgian Tripel, why use a yeast intended for a generic English ale?

If you just want beer, or the style you're making matches a dry yeast profile, dry is better cheaper and easier.

If you're doing the extra work to match a specific style you like, liquid may be the only way to get it.

If I was in your shoes I'd use two packs of liquid and step it up.

 

[musicis]

If I was in your shoes I'd use two packs of liquid and step it up.

Not quite sure I understand. Two liquid per 11 gallon batch I assume you mean? That calculates to 20 liters of starter. Unless "step it up" means something else.

Did I mention I have only brewed four times (three with starter) as I am a newb.

 

[pohldogg]

Your 5th batch is 22 gallons of really high gravity beer? Your best bet getting the amount of yeast you need would be to brew a 5 gallon batch and divide the cake. Or you could go dry and use the T58. I know Struise uses dry yeast and their beer's great, probably that strain since there aren't really other dry belgian options.

 

[chickypad]

Your 5th batch is 22 gallons of really high gravity beer? Your best bet getting the amount of yeast you need would be to brew a 5 gallon batch and divide the cake.

This sounds like the way to go. The 5 gallon beer is your 20L "starter".

 

[y6y6y6]

Unless "step it up" means something else.

By "step it up" I'm thinking of the process described here -
http://billybrew.com/stepping-up-a-yeast-starter

 

[ShinyBuddha]

Since you're rather new I didn't want to do the yeast cake method but that is a great & easy way to do it. Brew 5 gallons of belgium then after it's fermented use the yeast from the primary fermenter to pitch into your larger batch.

 

[Golddiggie]

Go to yeastcalc.com and you can make two starters (2.75L and 3L) and get the amount of yeast you'll need to pitch (per 11 gallon batch). Otherwise, you'll need over 14L of starter (single packet of liquid yeast). Assuming the yeast is fresh of course. Depending on the age of the yeast, will alter the starter sizes. Still, you can do either a two step, or three step, starter (on a stirplate) and get the amount of cells (or damned close to it) with much smaller starters.

I used this method for my last batch and plan on doing it again for the coming batch. My yeast is a few months old, but still I'll only need a 1.3L and 1.5L starter to make the amount of yeast needed to pitch.

It's rather simple to do this too. My method has been to make the first starter, let it finish on the stirplate (typically no more than 24 hours). Place in fridge for 24 hours to cold crash. Remove from fridge while making the second starter volume. Decant spent starter from flask once new starter volume is ready. Pour second starter wort into flask, on top of yeast already present, and place on stirplate. Let it go another 24 hours (usually it's done sooner) and chill overnight to cold crash. That puts me to my brew day, where I remove from the fridge, let it get up towards room temp so that it will be good to pitch. I decant almost all of the spent starter, leaving just enough behind to create a good yeast slurry. That goes into the fermenter after I've hit the beer wort with pure O2.

 

[BradleyBrew]

Just curious.. why do you want to make 22 gallons of the same beer? Also how big are these fermenters? If you are using ale pails then experiment. Do a few different belgian yeast that are good for Belgian Beers and compare. There are tons of liquid yeast that are belgian strains. The only dry I have heard about are Fermentis S-33 and T-58. Also, there really is no catch with dry vs. liquid. Dry is basically cheaper to produce, ship, and store vs. its liquid counterpart. Most around here agree that using a liquid equivalent of the same strain of dry yeast is a big waste of money. I've brewed over 100 beers and have never bought the liquid versions of US-05 and S-04 and never will if i'm brewing a "generic" American or British Ale.

 

[ShinyBuddha]

...I've brewed over 100 beers and have never bought the liquid versions of US-05 and S-04 and never will if i'm brewing a "generic" American or British Ale.

Very good input, but this is for a Belgian beer. As started earlier in the thread, you have more/different yeast strains available with liquid.

 

[BradleyBrew]

Very good input, but this is for a Belgian beer. As started earlier in the thread, you have more/different yeast strains available with liquid.

agreed...

http://www.fermentis.com/fo/pdf/HB/EN/Safbrew_S-33_HB.pdf
http://www.fermentis.com/fo/pdf/HB/EN/Safbrew_T-58_HB.pdf

both have been used as Belgian / placebo Belgian yeast with decent results.

 

[cullen]

Safbrew S-33 Ale Yeast is listed as a Belgian yeast. That doesn't mean it's necessarily the best for the batch being made, but it provides an alternative to more expensive liquid yeasts.
http://www.fermentis.com/fo/pdf/HB/EN/Safbrew_S-33_HB.pdf

 

[logan3825]

It's rather simple to do this too. My method has been to make the first starter, let it finish on the stirplate (typically no more than 24 hours). Place in fridge for 24 hours to cold crash. Remove from fridge while making the second starter volume. Decant spent starter from flask once new starter volume is ready. Pour second starter wort into flask, on top of yeast already present, and place on stirplate. Let it go another 24 hours (usually it's done sooner) and chill overnight to cold crash. That puts me to my brew day, where I remove from the fridge, let it get up towards room temp so that it will be good to pitch. I decant almost all of the spent starter, leaving just enough behind to create a good yeast slurry. That goes into the fermenter after I've hit the beer wort with pure O2.

What he said here. You make a starter, decant it then make a starter again. Do it a dew times to get the proper spell count.

 

[ShinyBuddha]

What he said here. You make a starter, decant it then make a starter again. Do it a dew times to get the proper spell count.

I love auto correct =)