"Dark Side" cider

[doctor strangebrew]

I've been doing some re-learning about brewing beer, especially about using steeping grains. This gave me a crazy idea... adding some steeping grains "wort" to my cider. Besides adding interesting flavors and aromas, it might help the yeast and also add body to the cider. Have I totally lost my mind this time? Has anyone tried something like this? I would steep the grains, strain it out, then boil (no hops), cool, then add to the cider.

 

[RPh_Guy]

It's called braggot graf (sometimes spelled graff). Some people also use just a little crystal malt to add sweetness.
You're probably going to want to use a beer yeast.


Edit: not braggot.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

Sort of a braggot, unless a good amount of honey is added, then it would absolutely be a braggot. Yes?

No, not really. “A braggot is a mead made with both honey and malt providing flavor and fermentable extract. Originally, and alternatively, a mixture of mead and ale. A braggot can be made with any type of honey, and any type of base beer style. The malt component may be derived from grain or malt extracts. The beer may be hopped or not. If any other ingredients than honey and beer are contained in the braggot, it should be entered as an Experimental Mead. Smoked braggots may be entered in this category if using smoked malt or a smoked beer as the base style; braggots made using other smoked ingredients (e.g., liquid smoke, chipotles) should be entered in the Experimental Mead style.”

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

I had a cider in TX called dark cide

 

[RPh_Guy]

No, not really.

Yeah. Brain fart. Edited original post.

 

[madscientist451]

Maybe try light LME; substitute apple juice for the water? You don't need to boil it, just heat to about 170F.
Or just make a standard cider and beer separately and blend to taste.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

Yeah. Brain fart. Edited original post.

It’s okay... made me look it up to be sure. Of course, since I didn’t quote you, my comment looks idiotic now, lol.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Revised again
Ok now? Lol

 

[doctor strangebrew]

I love these forums. Every time I think of something "crazy" it turns out to be a common idea. I was going to use chocolate malt, a little black malt, and crystal malt. I could use extract, but grains add a little something extra (not much work... I'm only making 1 gallon batches trying different ingredients) It's going to be hard to estimate the amounts... very easy to overdo. That Dark Cide is way cool... basically where I got the name (star wars)

 

[doctor strangebrew]

So using some malt extract and/or grain malt is common, but has anyone actually done this with dark malt/grains (or tried something like this)?

 

[GeneDaniels1963]

So using some malt extract and/or grain malt is common, but has anyone actually done this with dark malt/grains (or tried something like this)?

I have made graff with light DME, and it was really good. Today I started another batch with dark DME, 1lb in 2 gal of juice (plus 1 can FAJC). I am expecting some really good stuff.

 

[GeneDaniels1963]

I just moved my dark malted cider from the primary bucket to secondary fermenter. I added 1/2 more juice because my starting grav was too high. It was 20 BRIX, but the additional juice pulled it down to 17.

Anyway, there was a pint too much to go into the secondary, so I poured it off and placed in the fridge. Now, 8 hrs later I am drinking it. It is pretty good. Lots of malt taste, but still apple is in there, sort of at the back, the dark malt is upfront. I imagine it will be really nice in a month or so after bottling.

BtW, I did not use any hops, for two reasons:

1) I don't really like hops, and really don't like them in cider
2) I used 2 lbs of crushed crab apples in the primary to give it some tannin. Those crabs are very tart, so I figured they would nicely balance the malt sweetness. Still too early to tell, but I think that will be about right.

So dark malt cider is a pretty good combo, in my book

 

[JimRausch]

You really want to check out Brandon O.'s thread on Graf. Everything you ever could want to know about mixing beer and cider is in there.....somewhere.