Saison Cottage House Saison

Yakima 728
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MEPNew2Brew said:
My apologies in advance. I suspect the answers to my questions are somewhere in the 151 prior pages (about 50 of which I have been through).

Which Caramunich does the original recipe use: I (31-38L), II (42-49L) or III (53-60.5)? Does any maltster make "caramunich" other than Weyermann? I understand that Wyermann has a trademark on Caramunich and every maltster is different. But, are there others that make a something very similar? I have read that C-60 is similar, but not really a substitute. It appears that Dingemans may make something similar.

I have my starter of 3711 going and I look forward to brewing Saturday!

Thank you.
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The OP mentions he used caramunich 1 (38-31L) in a previous post.
 
MEPNew2Brew said:
My apologies in advance. I suspect the answers to my questions are somewhere in the 151 prior pages (about 50 of which I have been through).

Which Caramunich does the original recipe use: I (31-38L), II (42-49L) or III (53-60.5)? Does any maltster make "caramunich" other than Weyermann? I understand that Wyermann has a trademark on Caramunich and every maltster is different. But, are there others that make a something very similar? I have read that C-60 is similar, but not really a substitute. It appears that Dingemans may make something similar.

I have my starter of 3711 going and I look forward to brewing Saturday!

Thank you.
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My LHBS only has II. It made a great beer. Go either way with it and it will still be good.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1441159351.614899.jpg
 
60 minute boil with Pilsner? Not concerned with DMS?

I assume if I did a 90 minute boil with this, my FWH would just be 60 minute additions?
 
Yea, 60 min with Pilsner isn't a problem with how its malted nowadays.

If you did 90 min you'd add the hops at 60, although it might be a little harsher bitterness since FWH smooths it out somewhat.
 
bolus14 said:
Yea, 60 min with Pilsner isn't a problem with how its malted nowadays.

If you did 90 min you'd add the hops at 60, although it might be a little harsher bitterness since FWH smooths it out somewhat.
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If I decide to do 90 minutes, I probably could just lessen the addition at FWH as long as it calculates the same IBUs, right? Or would it not really achieve the same thing?
 
When I put this recipe in beer smith its estimating 45.2 IBUs. Almost 10 points higher than the recipe. I made sure the %AA for each are correct addition. Any thoughts?
 
thorHB said:
When I put this recipe in beer smith its estimating 45.2 IBUs. Almost 10 points higher than the recipe. I made sure the %AA for each are correct addition. Any thoughts?
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In my opinion, I don't think you'll notice a difference if your IBUs are up a little than the recipe states. I would just go with the original recipe. There's very little, if any, noticeable hop aroma of flavor with this beer (at least that I've noticed when I brewed this....twice). Don't worry about what BeerSmith is saying about the IBUs and brew it....good luck!

Again, this is just my opinion :)
 
I'm going to brew this again in October. Was wondering if anyone tried this with Champagne yeast? I'm going to split my batch into 3 gallon fermenters. Do one with the Saison yeast and experiment with the other half. Any thoughts?
 
I dont think the champaign yeast will be able to properly ferment the sugars from barley. I had disastrous results trying to primary ferment a beer with what I thought was Unibroue's house yeast
 
askchucky said:
I'm going to brew this again in October. Was wondering if anyone tried this with Champagne yeast? I'm going to split my batch into 3 gallon fermenters. Do one with the Saison yeast and experiment with the other half. Any thoughts?
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I think you'll miss out on the esters produced w/ Saison yeasts. It may ferment ok but just a completely different flavor profile.
Why not try two different Belgian yeasts. Say 3711 in one, or Belle Saison, and a Belgian Ardennes or Leuven?
 
Brewed this last Saturday. Pitched at 68 and held it for three days and slowing raising temp. Now at 73.5-74. I think I am going to hold it there, unless it looks like it is having trouble getting down to the 1.005-02 range.
 
I'm planning of brewing this tomorrow but I wish to use Danstar Belle saison since My room temp is 70F

is there any reason I should not do this?

Edit: I just saw the recommendation two post before.... i'm very sorry for this..
 
My current batch of this is sitting in secondary and I used Belle Saison. It fermented very fast. I prefer dry yeasts at the current time. No need for starters. Just buy more or less yeast and it's cheaper.
 
Wiesty said:
My current batch of this is sitting in secondary and I used Belle Saison. It fermented very fast. I prefer dry yeasts at the current time. No need for starters. Just buy more or less yeast and it's cheaper.
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Yhea Thats what I think, Plus i'm brewing a 2.5 Gallon batch (on my stove top) so 1 pack should be plenty.

This brew day went terribly well (it's my second time all grain, BIAB, and I got 75% efficiency and 14L of this gr8 wort, this is going to be a long 1.5 months :p)
 
Brewed this two weeks ago (tomorrow) with much excitement. Unfortunately, I discovered the day after brew day that my old thermometer was reading incorrectly. It was off in the range of 20-30 degrees above.....which means I could have been mashing around 128 instead of 148. I did a few calibration tests and found that it was hit or miss in it's accuracy. So it could have been 148 or it could have been 128 or lower. I do remember in doing the iodine test, the mash took 90 to 110 minutes to get a successful conversion (which hasn't happened to me before). This had to have only happened for this brew since everything prior had been fine.

Fermentation went off great however around 70 degrees (peaked at 74). I did a refractometer test today and it hit 5 Brix which is way too high. Perhaps fermentation isn't done but I'm a little concerned that I might have mashed too low.

My OG was around 1.055 which I know is low. We'll see what happens. Of course I immediately purchased a new thermometer.
 
Bobo1898 said:
Brewed this two weeks ago (tomorrow) with much excitement. Unfortunately, I discovered the day after brew day that my old thermometer was reading incorrectly. It was off in the range of 20-30 degrees above.....which means I could have been mashing around 128 instead of 148. I did a few calibration tests and found that it was hit or miss in it's accuracy. So it could have been 148 or it could have been 128 or lower. I do remember in doing the iodine test, the mash took 90 to 110 minutes to get a successful conversion (which hasn't happened to me before). This had to have only happened for this brew since everything prior had been fine.

Fermentation went off great however around 70 degrees (peaked at 74). I did a refractometer test today and it hit 5 Brix which is way too high. Perhaps fermentation isn't done but I'm a little concerned that I might have mashed too low.

My OG was around 1.055 which I know is low. We'll see what happens. Of course I immediately purchased a new thermometer.
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Wow, that's a crappy turn if events! I never use my refractometer for post fermentation because I've never gotten reliable results when compared with a hydrometer. The conversion calculators I've tried could be the culprit but I've relegated the refractometer to preboil and post boil readings.

With an iodine test chewing complete conversion I'd bet the beer will finish just fine, possibly super dry, but it should do ok.

What yeast did you go with?
 
This has become my go-to Saison recipe over this past year. I've left the honey out, but the base recipe is fantastic. Have enjoyed playing around with oak and wines in secondary with it.
 
I've now moved 2.5 gallons of the batch to secondary to avoid autolysis. After another month or two I'll move to keg and start drinking it!
 
Superdown said:
I've now moved 2.5 gallons of the batch to secondary to avoid autolysis. After another month or two I'll move to keg and start drinking it!
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That is much, much longer than any saison (thats not spiked with brett/bugs) needs to go. I would advise against a secondary. It will likely cause some degree of oxidation and not help AT ALL with autolysis. I also dont see any benefit of letting go any longer than 3 weeks or so. Ive never let a saison go more than a month grain to bottle

edit: whoops went a few pages back and realized you added brett. Carry on nothing to see here...
 
I made a batch of this a couple of weeks ago after a hiatus of about 9 months from homebrewing. I've made about 12 recipes, so far, over the course of nearly 3 years (yeah, I'm a slacker). Only one or two so far have been better than just "ok" in my opinion. This one still has a week or two left on it before I keg it but I pulled a sample this weekend to check gravity and try a sneak peek taste. It was chilled and force carbed before tasting it, though. I think this may crush my previous homebrewing attempts and come through as the best beer I've ever made. I'm waiting until it's actually finished to get too excited but, initial impressions are that I'd be excited to be able to even buy this beer. I kind of can't believe I made it. Thanks, OP!
 
I grab myself an extra large hydro sample from all of my saisons. I even take 4oz or so to try from the starter wort. I think its partly cause of how warm you can get them without off flavors. I love the tart birghtness that strains like 3711 and wlp585 can provide even from 1.035 unhopped room temp starter beer
 
azscoob said:
Wow, that's a crappy turn if events! I never use my refractometer for post fermentation because I've never gotten reliable results when compared with a hydrometer. The conversion calculators I've tried could be the culprit but I've relegated the refractometer to preboil and post boil readings.

With an iodine test chewing complete conversion I'd bet the beer will finish just fine, possibly super dry, but it should do ok.

What yeast did you go with?
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I always use a hydrometer and this was the first time I didn't since I was in a rush. I guess I panicked. I went back with the hydrometer and I'm at 1.005. My thermometer is definitely messed up but because of everything at the same time, I was worried. Sample tasted great. Not sure why my efficiency went down but can't wait to get this in the bottle. Just got into secondary this morning.

I used 3711. I might harvest the yeast at the bottom and use it again whenever I brew this next.
 
Nargan said:
I made a batch of this a couple of weeks ago after a hiatus of about 9 months from homebrewing. I've made about 12 recipes, so far, over the course of nearly 3 years (yeah, I'm a slacker). Only one or two so far have been better than just "ok" in my opinion. This one still has a week or two left on it before I keg it but I pulled a sample this weekend to check gravity and try a sneak peek taste. It was chilled and force carbed before tasting it, though. I think this may crush my previous homebrewing attempts and come through as the best beer I've ever made. I'm waiting until it's actually finished to get too excited but, initial impressions are that I'd be excited to be able to even buy this beer. I kind of can't believe I made it. Thanks, OP!
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This is a fantastic beer! I've been in love with it since I first brewed it, I'm really happy you now have a new benchmark!
 
Alright, guess I better jump on the bandwagon here. I brewed up 6 gallons of this in about May, and tapped the keg a few weeks ago, so mine has a little age on it.

I used black pepper candi sugar instead of the honey and black pepper, otherwise it was pretty similar. THis beer really came out fantastic. Super, super drinkable. Dry and digestible, you can really put them back.

My neighbor and I were drinking some while playing some bocci ball, and we kept refilling....and refilling....pretty soon we were pretty much hammered, they just go down so smooth at 8%. Really great beer.
 
Man, I cannot believe the fermentation that I am getting on a variant of this recipe. Similar to the OP, but using Wyeast 3724. It was a last minute decision to brew, so pitched 2x packages which were fairly fresh rather than doing a starter.

Started fermentation in a closet indoors at about 78/79 degrees. It didn't explode aka Hefe but quickly picked up a good bubble through the blowoff. Once that started to taper down (4-5 days) I moved it to the garage where it has been for over a week at 88-89 degrees (I live in South FL).

A full 12 days into fermentation, and it still has a steady flow through the airlock. This rate hasn't really changed for the last 4+ days at all. I haven't pulled a gravity because I figure I am not going to stop it early anyway.

Either this beer is going to come out with negative gravity, or this yeast is just one of those slow and steady performers! The notes by Wyeast say it is, so I am trusting that, but its just weired and amazing all at the same time!

-BD
 
I bottled Yesterday and It finished to 1.004 with Danstar belle saison yeast.

Tasted damn good, I can't wait to taste it when carbonated and cold :) It was already really good :rockin:

I just hope I wou'nt have exploded bottles, its my first experiemnt with more than 2.4 Co2 vol, i primed for 3 :p
 
DSC00366_zpsg0qdcfpu.jpg


I totally messed up the hop schedule/ammounts on this one...but it turned out fantastic! 2 weeks after bottling and the beer was great. Going to try another one next week, but so far so good! 6.9%, 55 IBU's.
 
Alright...spent hours yesterday reviewing all the posts...am planning to do 10 gallons this weekend...what is the consensus on type of yeast? I kept reading about one particular yeast that was a beast...any recommendations?

Thanks!
 
3711 in the mid-60s worked great for me. That's the one that, if I remember the phrase right, "will ferment an old gym sock down to 1.000."
 
JonM said:
3711 in the mid-60s worked great for me. That's the one that, if I remember the phrase right, "will ferment an old gym sock down to 1.000."
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Yep--that might be the one I was thinking of...going to split into two batches one with 3711 and perhaps the other will be the Belle Saison.

Looking forward to my first Saison homebrew :mug:

off to my lhbs...
 
depper said:
3711 both times I brewed this in mid 60s. It's a champ!!
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Picked up 3711 (last one)...and WL565...can't remember the feedback on 565...hope it's not a dog...

oh--and wasn't sure if i needed pilsner or the 2-row per the OP since it said both, so ended up with 2 row--i think it should be fine though

gonna make starter tonight...should be ready by this Saturday--3 days from now.
 

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