Cooling Wort Between Steeping And Boil?

[OppR2nist]

Would this damage my beer? If, let's say, I had to take a break during my brew, and couldn't start the boil right away, could I leave the steeped wort alone for a bit until I could start the boil?

This could define how I handle my brew day.

 

[unionrdr]

I would only if something came up that just can't wait,like emergencies. Otherwise,I announce when brew day will be so things that need doing get done ahead of time or the day after if they can wait.
Having said that,if the kettle has a decent lid to keep bugs out,it's ok for a short time imo.

 

[peterj]

Yeah I don't see why not. Just take the steeping grains out. How long are you thinking?

 

[NTXBrauer]

I don't see any issue here either. It will just take a little longer to hit a rolling boil if the wort has cooled.

 

[eluterio]

Would have to agree emergencies do come up. Ive had someone share with me in the middle of begining boil someone in family had a heart attach. Left the wort in the BK for over 24 hours probably close to 36. When they returned started the Bk and brewed. Turned out fine. But normal practice get it all done in one shot and get the honey do's out of the way! lol

 

[billl]

You don't want to let your wort sit in the "danger zone" for bacteria for any length of time unless it is already boiled. eg 60-130 degrees or so. There are lots of bacteria on grain. It usually isn't an issue since you generally boil them immediately and kill them all off. If you are talking about an extra hour or 2, that isn't a big deal. If you find you won't be able to get to the boil until the next day or something, then toss the wort in the fridge.

Of note: there are some quick souring techniques to do just that - let bacteria grow for a while and produce sour notes before you boil to kill everything. It's not dangerous to drink or anything, but I wouldn't make a habit out of it unless you are purposely going for sour.

 

[peterj]

Steeping (and mashing) temperatures are hot enough to pasteurize the grain and the wort, so everything will be killed off after the steep.

 

[OppR2nist]

Ok. I had planned a brew day, and the town decided to flush the water mains. My steeping water is fine, but the water started to turn as I was setting up the sanitizer. I could start steeping, but I'm not sure when the water will clear, and I have to get my son at school. Assuming the water clears up, I can get right to work, but I have to make sure the wort will be safe when I leave the house for about 45-an hour, possibly longer if the water stays gross.

 

[unionrdr]

No,the usual mash temps are not enough to pasterize. Pasteurization happens about 160F. So leaving warm wort on the counter or stove might get infected unless you have a snug fitting lid. Keep in mind,however that nasties are not ninja acrobats...they settle straight down. But furnace vents & air movement also come into play.
More reasons why I say if you don't have time to go straight through,save it for when you do. And I'd def wait for the water to clear coming out of the tap first. The last time they did that in this town,it took a few hours.

 

[peterj]

No,the usual mash temps are not enough to pasterize. Pasteurization happens about 160F.

Nope, it's around 140F. So mashing and steeping will absolutely pasteurize.

 

[unionrdr]

I remember pasteurizing milk was like 142F,so that's the temp I used for years. then a lab tech brewer type on here corrected me that with wort,it's 160-162F. It takes only seconds to do the deed though.

 

[FuzzeWuzze]

Regardless, with any sugar water...if we are talking hours throw a lid on it your fine, if we are talking days throw it in the fridge or cover it and throw it in the garage if its super cold and you dont have room in your fridge/freezer.

 

[peterj]

The temp won't change based on what you're pasteurizing. Around 140F is just the temperature at which the bacteria and other organisms are killed. It doesn't matter what they are in.

I'm also a lab tech brewer type, haha!

 

[BoShimTang]

To answer the OPs question what you propose should not be a problem. With regards to the discussion about pasteurization, the temps mentioned will not mean sterilization. Thus, given time the bacteria, wild yeast, and mold naturally present on the grains will grow.

 

[unionrdr]

The temp won't change based on what you're pasteurizing. Around 140F is just the temperature at which the bacteria and other organisms are killed. It doesn't matter what they are in.

I'm also a lab tech brewer type, haha!

OK...now I'm confused again. I'll have to research what temps are used in what gravity liquid & how sugary it is. 140F to 160-162F is a big disparity in temps. I wanna be sure to always give accurate information to folks. Your a lab tech...can you think of any reason another lab tech/student might give a dofferent number?? I remember in pasteurizing milk (very old neighbor dary farmers) had differebnt temps they used. one to pasteurize X minutes,& another to seperate X amount of cream. And yes,at these temps,it's sanitation,not sterilization.

 

[eluterio]

Ok. I had planned a brew day, and the town decided to flush the water mains. My steeping water is fine, but the water started to turn as I was setting up the sanitizer. I could start steeping, but I'm not sure when the water will clear, and I have to get my son at school. Assuming the water clears up, I can get right to work, but I have to make sure the wort will be safe when I leave the house for about 45-an hour, possibly longer if the water stays gross.

If not said before I would go and get some RO water from the store. Im assuming your doing an extract batch and all you would need is max 3 gallons. Couple bucks toss water in freezer and use this to help chill wort.

 

[peterj]

To answer the OPs question what you propose should not be a problem. With regards to the discussion about pasteurization, the temps mentioned will not mean sterilization. Thus, given time the bacteria, wild yeast, and mold naturally present on the grains will grow.

Sure, the same way as if you leave pasteurized milk out on the counter long enough bacteria, wild yeast, and mold will grow in it. Pasteurization (which is achieved at temperatures above 140F) will sanitize the wort and reduce the organisms in it to a very low level. As homebrewers nothing we do is ever really sterile. Boiling isn't even technically a valid sterilization method. So unless you have an autoclave the best you can do is sanitizing, which is really good enough.

 

[peterj]

If not said before I would go and get some RO water from the store. Im assuming your doing an extract batch and all you would need is max 3 gallons. Couple bucks toss water in freezer and use this to help chill wort.

+1. I'd rather do that than worry about whatever is getting flushed out of those pipes being in my beer.

 

[unionrdr]

OK,according to wiki,milk,for example,must be pasteurized @ 145F for 30 minutes. It makes no mention of the fact that pasteur first studied what made beer spoil. I'm sure many of us are familiar with the video "how beer saved the world". I just can't for the life of me remember who said it was 160F. but at that higher temp,pasteurization takes seconds rather than minutes. so in light of that info,it might be safer to do at that temp.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasteurization
*Also,here's what White House Artisian Springs does to the spring water coming out of there wells to the tap I fill my jugs with;
http://whitehousesprings.com/OurWater.php Just thought y'all would find this info of use...

 

[peterj]

OK...now I'm confused again. I'll have to research what temps are used in what gravity liquid & how sugary it is. 140F to 160-162F is a big disparity in temps. I wanna be sure to always give accurate information to folks. Your a lab tech...can you think of any reason another lab tech/student might give a dofferent number?? I remember in pasteurizing milk (very old neighbor dary farmers) had differebnt temps they used. one to pasteurize X minutes,& another to seperate X amount of cream. And yes,at these temps,it's sanitation,not sterilization.

I don't know why they would have said that. Gravity, density, sugar content, or what material it is has nothing to do with it.

The lower the temperature is the longer you should leave it to make sure it fully pasteurizes though. Maybe they were saying it only takes a few seconds at 160F-162F but it takes longer at 142F?

 

[unionrdr]

Looking back,I think this is the most likely reason that 145F was said originally. Then this fella said it was 160-162F. He did mention it happened in seconds,so quicker at 160F & longer @ 145F seems the most plausible..

 

[BoShimTang]

Sure, the same way as if you leave pasteurized milk out on the counter long enough bacteria, wild yeast, and mold will grow in it. Pasteurization (which is achieved at temperatures above 140F) will sanitize the wort and reduce the organisms in it to a very low level. As homebrewers nothing we do is ever really sterile. Boiling isn't even technically a valid sterilization method. So unless you have an autoclave the best you can do is sanitizing, which is really good enough.

I have an autoclave... I use for maintaining my yeast cultures.

The OP was looking for less than an hour so yes good enough is sufficient.

 

[peterj]

I have an autoclave... I use for maintaining my yeast cultures.

The OP was looking for less than an hour so yes good enough is sufficient.

Nice! Sounds like a sweet setup! Guess I should have said "As homebrewers nothing most of us do is ever really sterile."

 

[billl]

Just from practical experience:

I can put my mash tun full of spent grains on the back deck for an hour while I boil and it's fine.

The one time I forgot about it overnight, it was absolutely nasty. It had the lid on it and when I opened it, the smell almost knocked me off my feet. The lid was on the whole time it was out there, but there was obviously enough bacteria that survived the mash to completely spoil it in under 24 hours.

 

[BoShimTang]

Just from practical experience: I can put my mash tun full of spent grains on the back deck for an hour while I boil and it's fine. The one time I forgot about it overnight, it was absolutely nasty. It had the lid on it and when I opened it, the smell almost knocked me off my feet. The lid was on the whole time it was out there, but there was obviously enough bacteria that survived the mash to completely spoil it in under 24 hours.

Sounds like great fish bait!

 

[OppR2nist]

Well so here's what happened:
I steeped my grains (which was why I posted in the first place) and ran the wort to my back porch when it was done. The current temperature is 38°F. The water has cleared up, but we have a Cub Scout meeting tonight. I'll do my boil after we get home from that. Let's hope all your advice helped!

 

[OppR2nist]

So after sitting on it for a day, I'm pretty sure that everything has worked out. It's a sweet stout, and the initial gravity reading was 1.062. A touch high but it's tolerable. I used Danstar Notty and it looks as though I may have a gentle ferment going with it. By tomorrow I'll know whether it's being gentle or just getting a slow start.

How does it sound?

 

[unionrdr]

I'd be concerned about it sitting on the back porch overnight. Unless it was sealed up,it could develope somethinh nasty...

 

[OppR2nist]

Right, well, based on the suggestions here, it seemed like it would work. I bungeed the lid onto the kettle to keep things out, and just let it cool. The only issue I had three hours later was that it took a while to get rolling with the boil, but once it was going everything went according to plan, with the possible exception of my wife complaining about the hops smell (she hasn't been around for previous brews, and I'm sure she'll learn to love it like I do).

 

[unionrdr]

Ok,I see. You let the mashed wort sit out there & boiled aftarwards. That's def better than after the boil,obviously.

 

[OppR2nist]

Yeah, I wouldn't have done the boil if I didn't have the time to finish everything. The only reason I started in the first place was because I had plenty of time, but then things got in the way that made it impossible to see it all the way through.